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Universal military aircraft homecockpit project


Viper1970

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On 10/5/2021 at 1:36 PM, Viper1970 said:

Ok, here is the truth. And thats only a part of all my HOTAS parts. There are many old used sticks or parts of them too, I collected over the years.

 

 

IMAG0504.jpg

 

IMAG0505.jpg

 

holy crap.. that a lot

 

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After some measurement I think I can make the whole sweep mechanism a bit bigger, cause the F-14 handles are very small compared to the original A-10 ones of the WH (They are also very small in RL - I used the original dimensions of the F-14D throttle grips).

This could give me enough space to integrate the L/G WRN Silence button into the mechanism of the wing sweeps cover and also use the APU start switch as a kind of lock mechanism for this cover, to hold down the Silence button, which it should press. I thought about making the functions of opening the cover and pull out the sweep handle programable with those two inputs via TARGET.

The plan is to bind the virtual opening of the cover to the Warthogs APU start switch (which also holds the printed cover down and locked - special hat for the switch needed) and while opening the cover the silencer button depresses and this should be binded to virtually pull out the wing sweep handle. The axis will be used (programed) to control the sweep. That's the plan, if it is feasible is another thing 😅.


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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40 minutes ago, Apar said:

holy crap.. that a lot

 

Yes, I collected a lot of used and broken HOTAS for many years,  I was able to get my hands on. The whole new Thrustmaster stuff was bought this year, after I decided to make a new homepit project. I had to slaughter my piggy bank for this and have also sold all my RC models I had. My lovely wife did also help me to get this dream come true 🥰.

The homepit was always my big dream since 1998 and sadly I never was able to finish it cause of RL. The reason for this was also very often, besides RL, my low budget. This time I wanted to make this dream really come true. It's still a lot of work, but I will never give up 😄.


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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The new start 🙂.

The throttle arm (lever mechanics) of the WH isn't like the original 😅 - it's only a measurement-template for the length and the rotation of the grips.

I will also limit the rotation travel of all my WH forward a bit, cause I personaly think that the angle at full forward is a bit too much. I would also like to have an option to set the idle position a little bit more forward so the grip isn't angled that much, but sadly the idle detent can't be adjusted. For the AB detend I will print my own inlay and make a stop limiter at fully forward.

For the F-14 grips and also he F/A-18 grips in idle, the space between the grips and the back console switches is very narrow if not too narrow at all. Maybe I have to rework the grips throttle-arm-connectors a bit to make them longer and the handles higher. I already did some measurement, but things in 3D always show the truth a bit better 🤔.

P.S:

Just tested this a bit and I can also make a limiter for the max idle position. The levers will not go full back but this is ok for me. You just loose a bit of resistance to put them out of idle. The rest could be calibrated with TARGET, .... I hope 🤔😆. I really don't have the desire to rework the already fully done and smoothed grips again 😜.

Edit:

Just did a test with the throttle calibration software 1.07 and the Idle button functions can easily be adjusted slightly forward, if the idle is limited before the original full back. This is arround 1.5 to 1.0cm before the slots end and this gives me enough room for the handles not to collide with the switches in forward position if they are in idle.

The F-14 (although they are overall much smaller) and also the F/A-18 grips need more space in length as the A-10 grips. If that all doesn't help, I will make a small extension, which could be set between the handles and the cutted off levers (the rest without the A-10 grips). That's not a big problem at all. Really less work as to rework the handles again.

 

F-14 - Manual Wing Sweep - 05.jpg


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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I rethought the idea and came to the conclusion that only one function should be enough to program the whole procedure for activating the manual wing sweep with a macro.

Now the toogle switch has to be switched back to be able to open the guard, which does the appropriate macro. After the guard is opened you can reach the inside lever of the manual wing sweep. This axis can also be programed in any way to make the function work like it should.

This works not exactly like the real thing, but can emulate it good enough.

 

F-14 - Manual Wing Sweep - 06.jpg


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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🙂🙃 Most of the complex 3D modeling is done now! I still have to smooth out some of the HOTAS parts, but the parts themselves are done now.

I will also do this or that small part like some special switch caps (already done a lot of them, but some still missing) for the consoles and the panels.

The two main panels with their UFC/ICP still have to be made. At the moment only two frames exist, one for the fighters and one for the helos.

The one for the fighters gets three Cougar MFD's and  "universal" UFC/ICP hybrid. That's one of the challenges that still had to be done. It's not so complex in building, but the best arrangement of the functions to cover different aircraft is not easy. I will be plan this UFC while building the pit, cause there is too much you must consider, that the chances are high you miss something if you do it before.

Same goes for the helo panel. At the moment I do not know if I will use my old Quickshot Masterpilots for it, which still do function very well even in Windows 10, once they are programmed, or if I will build completely new 3D printed MFD's. The Masterpilot's could also do the job, if I add some additional buttons and encoders to them which are connected to a Pokeys in the panel. The Masterpilot MFD's have 24 buttons arround the MFD and there is also enough space to intergrate some more functions in the corners. I already cutted the display area out, so that they also could be mounted on top of an TFT.

They are fully programable via macros. OK, no DX-function here but keyboard emulation should also do the job very well and it would be much easier to use them and modify them a litte bit with aditional functions connected to a Pokeys, as to make complete new MFD's from scratch. To convert them to another electronic isn't that easy, I had tried this while I'm working at my predecessor pit and it's a lot of soldering and following the circuits at the PCB's. There is also a matrix or shiftregister used in the button-electronics arround the frame which reduces the needed wires.

So converting them isn't simply just some soldering and doing new buttons and complete new electronics part also, does not make much difference to make completely new MFD's from scratch. It also doesn't make sense if you still have retro machines which are able to program the changeable cardriges (and I have a lot of cartdriges and also still four programming units) with the programmer unit and once they are programmed they really run without any problems from W98 up to W10.

The pit will have a left and a right side console which has two of those little wooden boxes on top of them each. Each of this boxes has an area of 185x185mm what makes a total of 370x185mm for placing switches, encoders and buttons on top of them in an printed panel. The electronics (Pokeys cards) will be inside those boxes directly under the switches and the lid with the switches can be simply folded open.

The overhead panel will get three of this boxes, also equipped with printed panels on top of the lid for the switches and buttons. In the overhead there will also be the throttle control for the helos at the left side, for those type of helos which have this unit in the overhead.

The different throttles could be changed at the left console and will be placed before the switch-boxes. Between the seat and the left console there is the collective base mounted on which you can connect the different kind of collective-grips. If  a collective is mounted, no throttle will be used or mounted at the console or the other way arround. Only exception ist the Apache, which will have it's own throttle there for the turbine control.

At the right console there will be the sidestick mounted at a special printed mount, which is fixed to the inner sidewall. This way there is enough space on top of the console and in front of the switch-boxes to be able to place the throttle quadrant for the big birds there, if needed.

At the center place there will be all kind of inputs connectable , like cyclics, sticks or even my yoke. If I fly an Airbus like aircraft I can also place the AXX sidestick on the left console at the throttles place, cause the quadrant is placed at the right console and there is no need for a standard throttle. There are only the controls that are used with an aircraft mounted at the same time, so no doubled controls at any time. Only exception is the overhead throttle control for the helos, which will always remain in the pit.

The different front panels can be replaced in front of the panel-TFT an will only be connected via USB (even the Masterpilots which work with a DIN/PS2 to USB keyboard converter). There will be only one USB cable for the connection and the rest connected to a hub placed in the panel. If a panel isn't needed it could be placed on a wall mount in the room.

That's the whole systematics of my universal pit 🙂


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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Just doing the whole research of all the functions for the consoles and panels with the use of my old cockpit plan, many manuals from DCS and also other simulators, or even real manuals. This will take a while 😄.

Things like: What is in every kind of aircraft, what has nearly the same function but is designated differently, how does it work and how is the right way to make it useable with every aircraft, how should be the designation in my pit, what should be left for use with Track IR or VR in the virtual pit only, cause it's too special for the universal pit and ...

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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Still fiddeling around with the layout and the way to arrange all the electronics to get all working. It's not that easy cause all of the HOTAS should be interchangeable and this makes the electric part of the project at terms like which plugs are needed and at which place they will serve best, a bit complex.

The overall plan how it should work was already done months ago, but the fine details are the things that makes the trouble in the end 😄. But I think I can get it working like I want it. Still a lot to do, but I have also still the hope that I will be able to do my first flights until spring to summer next year (hopefully 😏😅).

If first parts are done and there is something that is worth showing, I will do so.


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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  • 4 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...

Yes 😁, but at the moment some new troubles in RL will delay the whole project again 😏.

I always had the fear that this could happen again, cause it happend so often in the past and now it has come true. I hope that I can "fix" the RL problems as fast as possible and come back to my beloved hobby again as soon as possible.

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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  • 2 weeks later...

Looking a bit better now as I suspected at first, but there will be still a lot to do in RL.

I use the remaining time now to upgrade all my pc systems with new power supplies and also new cases. The power supplies that were integrated aren't very good (mostly really crap) and have to be exchanged with better ones. As I have to disassemble a lot again to do this, I decided to buy some new pc cases also, to have all four systems on my "command-unit" equal (retro and modern) and for the two systems in the sim-rig I will buy some bigger cases to prevent them from thermal problems (one is a SLI system and the other has a RTX 3090 inside).

Those new cases have to be painted again in gray (the whole equipment in my sim room is grey and partially black to fit some kind of "Navy style" 😄 - I don't like LED's or any kind of lights and eye candy used today at pc components - but all has to look clean, identical and a bit like military hardware), to fit the "theme" in this room.

If all this is done and the room is cleaned up, I will switch back to work at the sim rig and also start to print the HOTAS. I hope I'm able to get a lot of it working till the Strike Eagle and the Kiowa are arriving. But who knows, maybe they are much faster as I am or I have to wait another month/year/years to have all my "must have modules" in DCS ready. 😄


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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Just bought the cases 🙂. I have a little question about the power supplies, that maybe some of you can help to answer.

I already had three of those modern ATX cases (power supply seperated at the bottom of the case) used before and mounted the power supplies with the fan on top, although they are meant to be mounted upside down.

There is about 1cm space between the air intake and the cover, which seperates the mainboard part of the case, to the power supply part, so there is enough  room for sucking the air. There is of course also a hole in the bottom of those pc cases, which is meant to be used for the air intake, but you must put a filter before it to prevent the fan to suck up the dust from the floor. This filter is restraining the airflow really much and this was the reason I mounted the power supply with the fan to the upside.

Now I've read in a pc builders forum, that newer power supplies need the cold air from outside the case, especially if they have arround 750W up to 1000W.

If possible I still wanted to use the mounting direction with the fan upside, cause there is no need for a filter if the air intake is inside the case. The drawback is the warmer air inside the case which will be sucked through the power supply, but I think this must be still better as the constrained airflow through those dust filters, especially if they aren't very clean after a few days.

What are your experiences and how do you mount the power supplies in this modern ATX cases? Is the cooling effect from the warmer air from inside the case still enough for a 1000W power supply, stressed with a RTX 3090, or should I really use the bottom intake with the filter?

Edit: There are seven additional 120mm fans in each of the new bigger cases, three on the front sucking the air inside the case and four which blow the air out of the case (three on top and one at the back).

 


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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I will use the fan on top. I made some tests with the small cases and even under this conditions it is working good enough. The temp inside isn't getting very high. The big cases are still on delivery, but I think if it's working in the smaller ones it will do so with the new big cases. I don't want to suck the air from the bottom of the cases, first because of the dust which makes a filter necessary which restrains the airflow and second my PC's at the command unit are stacked. So the air outtake of the bottom computer is directly below the air intake of the power supply of the upper rig. That doesn't make much sense.

I hope I'm back on the track until end of February, to be able to start the printings and the work at the sim-pit again. I have made the 3D constructions of all those HOTAS, but I will be one of the last guys to see them printed in RL 😄. Many others have already started to make them.


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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Hi Viper,

sorry to say, but it makes much sense to use the air intake at the bottom for the power supply.

And normally they have an inlet dust barrier, which works good. With normal hard floor, we have to clean it once a month. And we have much dust in this area.

Your way disturbs the airflow in your case significant to the bad side. You will try to suck hot-air from the inside of your case trough the power supply against the physical behavior.

Where will be the inlet of the needed cool air for your power supply?

You should use the parts as they are designed for. I would not try to use the internal air for the power supply, because this would change the airflow in your case.

Normally best would be closed case with flow from front bottom to back top, best only top for CPU air. And let the graphic card blow its hot air to the back.


Edited by yogi149

regards / gruesse yogi

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Yes I know its not the best idea, but with those filters mounted there is really only a very, very small airflow. If I dont mount them, it will suck all the dust from the floor inside the power supply. And at my other place, the computers are stacked, so the upper one would also suck warm air inside the power supply from the top outake of bottom one. There is of course a little space between the stacked PCs (about 2,5cm) so that the warm air from the bottom computer could be blown out, but if I put the power supply from the upper one in the right direction, it will suck this warm air into its own power supply.

The computers on my "command unit" arent so powerful. Two of them are retro rigs, one is a Phenom II 965 with a GTX660 and the best one here is a Ryzen 7 2700X with a RTX 2060.

I tested a bit and it looks like its really better to suck the air from inside the case, as from the outside with those dustfilters applied. With the filters mounted, there is nearly no airflow, but a lot of noise. The ps is also seperated from the rest of the inside, but can get fresh air from the front, bottom fan.

For the two computers at the simulator, I will take a look as soon as the new cases arrived. Maybe their filter system is better (looks much better on the photos compared to the other cases) and I am able to use the conventional mounting for the ps.

 

 


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
ComUnitPC1: R9 3900XT|32GB DDR4|2x2TB HDD|RTX2070|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|16GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|GTX660|Win7Pro64
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@CrashMeTwice

Believe me, I have really not much skills in 3D design. I use simple tools like TinkerCAD and do some rework with things like meshmixer.

The only thing I am good in is, if I want something, I find a way to make it. But all this is far from perfect. It just fits my personal needs to let my own dream come true (somewhere in future 😄)

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
ComUnitPC1: R9 3900XT|32GB DDR4|2x2TB HDD|RTX2070|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|16GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|GTX660|Win7Pro64
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Viper,
 

just out of curiosity: Have you ever gotten something printed or finished from you good looking CAD-designs?
Could you post some pictures of the results?

Thanks and Cheers!

My System: Full Scale Huey SimPit
 

-Pit Computer: i7-12700K | Gigabyte Z690 AORUS Pro | 64GB DDR5 RAM | Nvidia RTX3090FE | Kingston KC3000 NVme

- All day use: i7-4790K | 32GB DDR4 RAM | ASRock Z97 Killer | GeForce RTX 2080 Ti AMP! | Oculus Rift | Pimax8KX | Sensoryx VRFree Gloves | X-TAL VR

 

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I only printed the F-14 throttle, some parts of the F-18 throttle and some other parts until now (pics are in the thread). The F-14 & the F-18 throttles were reworked again, so I have to print them once again. Some guys have also printed my AH-64D collective and posted some pics in Discord.

Sadly I wasn't able to do the whole print myself until now. Printing them with a relatively good shape takes a very long time and I have a lot of other things do to at the moment. I will also use a 0.1mm layer height and print relatively slowly. This part of my AH-64D collective was also printed with 0.1mm layer height.

 

20211011_100319.jpg

 

and here is one from another guy who printed the whole collective. I think he only used a 0.2mm layer height, but I don't know it exactly.

 

IMG_6827.jpg

 

and the whole thing printed from the first guy, who used 0.1mm on a Prusa I3

 

20211015_101449.jpg


Edited by Viper1970
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No, I have no own Discord server. Some guys from the forum that have my STL files just posted their results on the DCS server at Discord. That's all 🙂.

My parts were never meant to be used by anyone else as my own, but some guys have asked for the STL's and I have no problem to share my work with other simulation enthusiasts.

They are also very special and do not fit standard stick or collective bases, so anyone who uses them for his own project has to do a lot of rework to make it compatible with anything he/she uses. I have also not tried the parts myself, cause sadly I had no time to do so until now. I hope I'm back on the track somewhere arround end of February, to be able to print my parts and can do some work at my pit again. I will then show my own results at the HOTAS and the pit, if there is something that's worth showing.


Edited by Viper1970
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CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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On 1/9/2022 at 3:49 PM, Viper1970 said:

No, I have no own Discord server. Some guys from the forum that have my STL files just posted their results on the DCS server at Discord. That's all 🙂.

My parts were never meant to be used by anyone else as my own, but some guys have asked for the STL's and I have no problem to share my work with other simulation enthusiasts.

They are also very special and do not fit standard stick or collective bases, so anyone who uses them for his own project has to do a lot of rework to make it compatible with anything he/she uses. I have also not tried the parts myself, cause sadly I had no time to do so until now. I hope I'm back on the track somewhere arround end of February, to be able to print my parts and can do some work at my pit again. I will then show my own results at the HOTAS and the pit, if there is something that's worth showing.

 

Thanks, I might go looking for them. As for having to rework them, that's not a problem as I wanted to see how feasible it would e to mount one of the apache collective grips to the side accessory mount of my virpil collective as a separate button box. Having the double grip on the end of the collective would make it too long.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Still fiddle arround with my computers to be able to stack them. I had to print some connectors to be sure that they will stay in place when stacked.

My printer had also a cable break after one year of not using it 🤔😒, so I had to repair it before printing.

It looks like all is working how it should again, cause the connectors where printed fine, and so I decided to start printing the first parts for my pit project also. It will be a long run, cause there are many, many parts to print. I will start with the parts for my centerstick base at first.

During the print of the cockpit parts I will do the electronics and the painting of the Hori 3 HOTAS which I made for my Command Unit. It has a lot of extra buttons and switches in the throttle base, and a mechanical idle/AB detend. The stick is also modded with some extra functions and a paddle lever. I will use one Pokeys and one Codemercs card for the electronics to be able to control all the functions and the slew in the throttle as a mouse or as a ministick. There is also a UFC and some small panels which I already printed, that will also get one Pokeys card.

The end result should be a small "cockpit" with a foldaway panel that is fully compatible from Windows 98 up to Windows XP at which I can fly my retro sims again. The other use of my c"command unit" is tank and naval sims under modern OS from W7 up to W10. Besides this it will be my workstation in future so I don't have to use the HTPC in the living room anymore 😅.


Edited by Viper1970

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
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Just discovered that TinkerCAD is changing dimensions after a while by itself. Many of my created parts have changed slightly in dimensions. It's only about a few hundredth, but that's sometimes enough for fittings not to fit anymore 😡.

Eg. shapes like axis I created with 10.0x10.0mm have now 10.03x10.06mm and something like this. What the f.... is wrong in TC? I never opened those projects again or have changed anything!

I think now it's really time to look for something alternative to TC. I really liked it's simplicity, but changing dimensions by itself is an absolute nogo!

CockpitPC1: R9 5950X|64GB DDR4|512GB M2SSD|2TB M2SSD|RTX3090|ReverbG2|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|32GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|2x GTX660 SLI|Win7Pro64
ComUnitPC1: R9 3900XT|32GB DDR4|2x2TB HDD|RTX2070|Win11Pro - PC2: PhnIIX6 1100T|16GB DDR2|2x2TB HDD|GTX660|Win7Pro64
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Try out onshape, It's good enough for flight sims in my opinion. There are alot of tutorials on youtube aswell. 

You can export to alot of different filetypes and other can make modifications to the model on onshape. 

I prefer it over fusion 360 all day, but it's what I'm used to so take it with a grain of salt 😉

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