F14 module so expensive!

[cptmrcalm]

Hi all.

 

Difficult to put into words my thoughts on the pricing of these modules.

 

Being a steam user of DCS, I wonder has the F14 module been on a more reasonable sale price with ED? Steam at the moment only has ever shown 15%, which makes the price fall down from insanely high to now eye watering.

 

I am not sure what it is I am trying to achieve here by casting my thoughts.

 

But £65 for a flight module I think is so high a price to make it feel offensive.

 

I bought the F16 and F18 at £30 each (with a year or so apart) and thought that price to be a little steep at the time. I feel now that those modules were worth it. At that price. I am not sure I would have bought the two as quickly as I did if they had been £65 -probably only buying one.

 

Is the F14 so much more a module over the F16 and F18? I am not talking about performance of the jet, but I guess the 3d model and systems and sound etc etc.

 

I just find it hard to believe that I would be getting that much more.

 

I've no doubt its a great module btw. I don't mean to suggest its poor in any way. Everyone has the right to charge what they feel its worth and I understand the model of business here adopted by ED and its partners. 

 

I suppose I can just keep it on my wish-list for it to fall down to more reasonable but expensive £30+ .

[Danny_P]

Well then, the F-14 is not for you

[Amarok_73]

F-14 is worth every penny spent on it.
I've bought it for myself, then decided to buy another two including super carriers for my two friends and the fun of flying it caused that I quickly forgot the trauma caused by such dent in budget.

 

[Flanking Moustache]

You get multiple versions of the same aircraft. Currently there's a late A variant as well as the B variant. I believe Heatblur is working on an earlier A variant as well as the specific A model that's operated by Iran. All these are included in the price.

"

Q: What version of the -B will be simulated?
A: The -B that we simulate spans an entire era, from the late 80s/ early 90s to late 90s/ early 2000s. As most Tomcats were "patchwork aircraft", exhibiting features found throughout all its iterations, we decided to recreate the B to what was most commonly found across all of them in that time period.

 

Q: What versions of the -A will be simulated?
A: Similar as with the -B, each version of the -A spans a certain time period, but to discern them easier, we divide them into the 135GR late version (same time period as the -B), which has more or less feature parity with the -B, except for engines, engine instrument panels and some minor differences; the 135GR early version (late 70s to early/mid 90s), which also features an older version of the RWR (the ALR-45) and the ECM page on the HSD; and the bonus 95GR IRIAF version, which is similar to the 135GR early (late 70s/ early 80s), with the difference of having no TCS, no ICLS/ACLS, no datalink, no Lantirn pod, only older weapons (no aim-9m, no aim-7M(/H), no aim-7F, no aim54A mk.60 and aim54C) and only dumb air to ground munitions. Each version will include skins for their dedicated period/country. All -A versions feature the TF-30 Engines.

"
-from the the F-14A/B FAQ.

 

[Donut]

I think the HB Tomcat is actually underpriced for what you get/will get...several F-14 variants, Forrestal carrier, A-6 AI, and of course a level of quality unmatched in flight sim.  For me, the Tomcat is the most incredible aircraft I have ever virtually flown in my 30+ years of flight simming.  Worth every penny and then some.

[Karon]

I'm going to get a lot of hate here, but DCS modules could easily cost 3x or more than their current price. Why?

1- since 2008 I played two modules: Ka-50 and F-14 as RIO. Hours of fun / Cost tends to +infinite. I bought multiple copies of the F-14 to gift to friends or modules I never even launched just to support ED and the devs.

2- the same CoD every time or FIFA cost as much as a module, not to mention a premium whatever in the various war thunder / wot. A DCS module takes an incomparable effort to make instead.

3- sales are recurring and quite well distributed during the year.

 

That being said, these are personal considerations and, moreover, a steep price increase would make DCS inaccessible to many people, which is something no one wants.

In the specific case of the F-14, we get three variants of the F-14A and the F-14B and a ton of other stuff. It's well worth the price!

Edited June 25, 2021 by Karon
I can't speak English :S

[cptmrcalm]

Thanks guys. 

 

I guess its down to personal budget.

 

I haven't heard any complaints about the module itself - so I am aware its meant to be good.

 

I do like the F14. One of my favourites since childhood.

 

Like I say, I'll keep it on the wish list until it comes down to something more affordable.

[Hiob]

The F-14 is a formidable module with very active and responsive developers.

One could argue that DCS in general is very expensive compared to "normal" games.

Consider though, the rather small audience for such high fidelity simulations as opposed to the large amount of research and developemend that goes into each module.

 

I think it's no shame to utilize sales and such to keep the costs at bay but other than that, I find the prices justified.

[draconus]

2 hours ago, cptmrcalm said:

I haven't heard any complaints about the module itself - so I am aware its meant to be good.

Well, you can download standalone version of DCS and try the Tomcat for 14 days free of charge now! You'll decide for yourself if it's worth it or if you can afford it later.

[kseremak]

To be honest DCS F-14 is still cheaper than just F-14 1:48 plastic model, so i would say it's very cheap in relation to what it offeres.

[Whiskey11]

I'd say it's quite cheap for what you get:
1.)   You get an F-14B, an F-14A-135GR, F-14A-95GR, F-14A-IRIAF.  That's FOUR F-14 modules, all with their own unique idiosyncrasies, different features, and different capabilities.
2.)  You get TWO campaigns
3.)  You get the Grumman A-6 AI airplane (eventually)

4.)  You get the USS Forrestal aircraft carrier (eventually)
5.)  You get an epic soundtrack

 

Even if you think about all three variants of the F-14A we are getting as substantially similar and count them as one aircraft, you are still getting TWO aircraft for the price of a little more than one.  That's a pretty good bargain, especially in the context of the other items included.

[Exorcet]

12 hours ago, cptmrcalm said:

Is the F14 so much more a module over the F16 and F18? I am not talking about performance of the jet, but I guess the 3d model and systems and sound etc etc.

It might actually be. Heatblur have done a great job with this module and there are a lot of little immersive details. Many people consider the F-14 the definitive module in DCS. If ED decides to never bring the F-15C to DCS standard, I'd love to hear that Heatblur would pick up the project.

 

On the other hand though, I will admit that Jester (the backseat AI) can let you down on occasion. The F-14 also seems to utterly destroy the DCS track system in a way no other modules does. I don't know why.

[WOPR]

If you compare the cost to an hour of flight time in a real F-14, there's simply no comparison.    There are some nice campaigns for it, and it is a very different experience from the Hornet putting it down on a carrier deck.  The free trial is great deal to try it out and see how you feel about it.  If you aren't in love with it you'll never be happy with the purchase.  

[captain_dalan]

Also, let's not forget two other things:
1. We are talking about the plane and the team that first incorporated jetwash, AI RIO and carrier burble effects in DCS. So just the level of innovation is something to be considered;
2. We are also talking about one of the most famous/infamous (depends on how much of an aviation hipster you like to feel  you are) in history and thanks to it's public exposure by the media, almost a global phenomenon. Thus the demand is high. And as you know, if the demands goes up, so do the dollars.

[Uxi]

Best module in the game,  so definitely worth it.  That said,  I bought in a sale on Steam myself. 

[Ddg1500]

go watch Top gun openning sence, here is a link for you

 

[S. Low]

It's worth every single penny. This is a very niche hobby using extremely complicated development into simulation. The level of fidelity we get with modules like this and the other top tier modules in DCS is simply astonishing. 

 

And not only is the module expensive, but go start pricing out head tracking or VR, high end flight equipment like Virpil/VKB/Winwig/Komodo/MFG, then obviously the computer necessary to get a good experience like at least a 1080, more appropriately a 2080 or into the 3080; the newest and best CPU you can get. And you really need 32gb of ram. 

 

And then there's more money spent in mounts and other accessories to make your computer chair and desk into a comfortable sort of "sim pit." Or you could get REALLY into it and make a full on simulated cockpit with individual switches and on and on and on.

 

This is an expensive hobby. I've increased my enjoyment of higher end peripherals over a long period of time. Saving up for a track ir 5, then mounts, computer, etc etc etc etc etc.

 

Save up. Be patient. Enjoy the game where you're at, and work toward a better experience. 

[Danny_P]

The thing you have to remember is HeatBlur is made up of humans.... Not robots or some AI farm... Those humans need paying. Then there's the 'cut' that ED will take. Then there is licensing. Then you factor is how many years the product will be supported for > look at the original DCS A-10, it's 10 years old this year. And it will still get some amount of bug fixing. 

 

The F-14 is a module in which dare I'd say, I would easily pay more... It would say it's almost, and in quoting your words in the original post, offensive to HB to say they doesn't deserve to charge what they do.

Edited June 28, 2021 by Danny_P

[Dauntless 7]

WORTH EVERY PENNY!!! Buy it and love it. 

[Steel Jaw]

I am going to get alot of flak for this but:

 

I have the HB Turkey and do not like it, dont fly it.

 

Even with VAICOM I find Jester troubelsome, and the job of the pilot up front gets boring.  Also given that it cant deploy Slammers, its A2A effectiveness is reduced, please no Phoenix lectures.  Makes we wonder why the F14 was so revered back in its day.  Sure as a Fleet Interceptor lobbing AIM54s at Backfires a 100 miles out, good deal.

 

For shear entertainment of multi role tactical jets, I fly my Hornet and soon the Viper.

 

NOW, HAVING SAID THAT...the product itself is top notch, stellar, almost so much so that I wish I had the time to learn it properly.

Edited June 28, 2021 by Mower

[G.J.S]

Just now, Mower said:

I am going to get alot of flak for this but:

 

I have the HB Turkey and do not like it, dont fly it.

 

If with VAICOM I find Jester troubelsome, and the job of the pilot up front gets boring.  Also given that it cant deploy Slammers, its A2A effectiveness is reduced, please no Phoenix lectures.  Makes we wonder why the F14 was so revered back in its day.  Sure as a Fleet Interceptor lobbing AIM54s at Backfires a 100 miles out, good deal.

 

For shear entertainment of multi role tactical jets, I fly my Hornet and soon the Viper.

You’re right, it doesn’t have ‘Slammers’, you are right, Jester can be a little wtf at times, but one of the things the F-14 module has in spades - far and above the electric jets and flying laptops - is character, soul, and gives you satisfaction from taming a bird that doesn’t have half of NASA’s computers trying to stop it swapping ends during a turn.

If you think the sole trick is lobbing -54’s from several hundred postal codes away and that is it, you are wrong. Very wrong.

And it was revered back in the day for the same reasons as the F-4 before it, it was very good at what it does, and it was when flown well, unbeatable.

Im sure we would be having the same conversation in 30 years time with people wondering what the F-22 was all about, and why was it so revered?. Same old same old.

Point is, when the airframes were in service, they really were the best for what they were made to do.

And just because certain types are either out of service, or considered obsolete - don’t think you are safe, turn your back or make a wrong move, and an antiquated has been can still thoroughly humiliate a newer type, even one considered better on all counts.

[Uxi]

As one who plays the Tomcat and Hornet regularly, the thing you immediately notice when trying to re-use missions is that the Hornet runs out of gas a LOT closer and is much slower while doing it.  That has much bigger implications for loiter time that aren't as relevant for something like DCS since you don't have to worry about logistics concerns on having appropriate tanker support, etc but the speed thing is very real, as well. 

[dehowie]

Lol the Bug(imagine wanting to fly an aircraft called that..lol..sorry) has barely enough gas to get to the corner store to buy a bottle of milk and back without tanking unless hauling three gas bags killing what little performance it had to start with.

On price it staggers me gamers(not aviation lovers they get it) think a product with tens of thousands of hours of testing of a product which is required to meet real world performance parameters on a home PC is "expensive".

This "mentality" that they want exact performance replication for zero to little cost flies in the face of any product wanting accuracy.

Want it cheap thats go fly one of the MSFS aircraft they where cheap and none fly like real aeroplanes and are even further from there real world brethren.

Time, effort, work cost people time and they deserve to be rewarded and id happily pay twice the ost of the F-14 as in houirs of gaming other than the FSLABS in P3D its the most used simulated aircraft i own. Value wise its easily the cheapest aircraft i have bought in DCS just due how much use it gets.

Its not just another FBW aircraft you cant break and requires thought to fly and employ. The Jester addition is pure genius and combine that with the thought about how to replicated things like aero buffet its easily the best implementation of multi sensory input to create the feel of real flight while sitting stationary at a table.

It has so much "character" that no other module has captured from Jester bleating on about your flying skills to adverse yaw it really is an absolute stunning example of what the home PC can achieve.

9 hours ago, Mower said:

.  Makes we wonder why the F14 was so revered back in its day.

 

 

Go watch Tomcat Tales on Vimeo or Amazon and you will see why Tomcats are adored and Hormets are nicknamed after an insect..

[captain_dalan]

8 hours ago, Uxi said:

As one who plays the Tomcat and Hornet regularly, the thing you immediately notice when trying to re-use missions is that the Hornet runs out of gas a LOT closer and is much slower while doing it.  That has much bigger implications for loiter time that aren't as relevant for something like DCS since you don't have to worry about logistics concerns on having appropriate tanker support, etc but the speed thing is very real, as well. 

This realization came to me when i was discussing the old Jane's flight sims with a friend i used to fly with at the end of the previous century. Back then we were like "whoa, Mavericks on double racks! Man that awesome! Why would anyone want anything else?!"
And many gamers of today would probably feel the same way in DCS today. But what people often fail to take into account is mission design. Back when we were kids we failed to take notice that we could take all those Mavericks and Harpoons with us on any mission because......well, you know, that "any" mission was designed with taking them in mind. So the carrier was in double digit miles of the hotspot and yet it never got hit by any surface to surface ordnance. You bring a real carrier that close to shore and you botched it, real bad.
It's the same in DCS. Just because you are tea in a cup that fits your shape, don't think the universe created that cup especially for you and that all the cups are the same. In the real life you are the one that needs adapting. And with short legs you are going to find that more difficult then others. Just imagine the refueling logistics required to extend the range of the ops when the engagement ranges exceed several hundred miles. You won't find that on most DCS servers. Now compare that to the 1000 mile doctrine...... 

[veenee]

14 hours ago, Mower said:

 

I have the HB Turkey and do not like it, dont fly it.

 

I can say exactly the same thing about Hornet.

 

Unfortunately, I can't return it for a refund.