missing info TGP Zoom Out and Other Weird Stuff

[Caldera]

Hey All,

 

These things have happened to me enough to become noticeable and annoying.

 

Sometimes if I zoom the TGP all the way out it will weird out into some kind of spiral and the automatically reset to bore sight.  Typically when it does happen I am in Wide Mode, but it has happened in Narrow.  This happens with no Gimbal Fault present as I would be staring at the TGP at the time it happens and of course notice that.

 

Another weirdness that I have seen.  I have been getting NO SPI messages randomly (the white box bottom right corner).    I am positive that I had a SPI just prior, but not true as the SPI evaporated and I get a NO SPI message.   There is no SPI anywhere at the point and I have to create one again. 

 

I had thought that the A-10C must always have a SPI and if none is created it would default to the steer point?

 

Another weirdness, so say I lay down a Mark Point and make it SPI and then slave the TGP to it.  Clearly I can see that the Mark Point, the SPI, and the TGP diamond all stacked at the same position on the TAD.  As soon as I try to slew the TGP it pops off.  It moves to a position that is close enough that I can still see the TGP diamond on the TAD, but it is way off the Mark Point.  I have to slew it back using the TAD as a reference.  This process seems to go on for a while when it happens.

 

Any of this sound familiar to anyone else?

 

Caldera

[Yurgon]

23 minutes ago, Caldera said:

Sometimes if I zoom the TGP all the way out it will weird out into some kind of spiral and the automatically reset to bore sight.

 

The spiraling TGP sounds familiar, when it reaches the Gimbal limits. However, it should not boresight itself.

 

Do you have a track or a video of that?

 

24 minutes ago, Caldera said:

Another weirdness that I have seen.  I have been getting NO SPI messages randomly (the white box bottom right corner).    I am positive that I had a SPI just prior, but not true as the SPI evaporated and I get a NO SPI message.   There is no SPI anywhere at the point and I have to create one again.

 

When you have a steerpoint with no elevation data, it's not a valid SPI.

 

So if you slew the TGP above the horizon or anything else reverts the SPI Generator to STPT, you'll get the NO SPI message.

 

25 minutes ago, Caldera said:

I had thought that the A-10C must always have a SPI and if none is created it would default to the steer point?

 

That's why you get the message on the MFCD.

 

27 minutes ago, Caldera said:

Another weirdness, so say I lay down a Mark Point and make it SPI and then slave the TGP to it.  Clearly I can see that the Mark Point, the SPI, and the TGP diamond all stacked at the same position on the TAD.  As soon as I try to slew the TGP it pops off.  It moves to a position that is close enough that I can still see the TGP diamond on the TAD, but it is way off the Mark Point.  I have to slew it back using the TAD as a reference.  This process seems to go on for a while when it happens.

 

I'm not following. What pops off, the TGP or the markpoint?

 

When you slew the TGP away from the markpoint, it won't be on the markpoint any longer, obviously.

 

What exactly is it that is not expected here?

 

Again, a track or a video would be helpful.

[Frederf]

TGP manages its head spin automatically. Normally when you are zoomed in you don't notice because the picture is being electronically spun the opposite way as the physical TGP head is spinning to cancel out the effect as seen on the MPCD. When zoom out enough you can see the edges of the sensor frame and this spinning is noticeable.

 

Depending how the TGP is sending its LOS position slewing the TGP is normal to have the diamond change dramatically especially in range. I think if you did TGP AREA before slewing the jump would be minimal.

[Caldera]

Hey Guys,

 

Quote:

Another weirdness, so say I lay down a Mark Point and make it SPI and then slave the TGP to it.  Clearly I can see that the Mark Point, the SPI, and the TGP diamond all stacked at the same position on the TAD.  As soon as I try to slew the TGP it pops off.  It moves to a position that is close enough that I can still see the TGP diamond on the TAD, but it is way off the Mark Point.  I have to slew it back using the TAD as a reference.  This process seems to go on for a while when it happens.

 

Well...   This one I figured out.   It is a result of the SPI being placed on a Mark Point that is physically in some pretty rugged mountains.  (EX: Caucasus)

 

Yurgon,

 

Quote:

The spiraling TGP sounds familiar, when it reaches the Gimbal limits. However, it should not boresight itself.

Do you have a track or a video of that?

 

I do not have a track.  It does appear to be about the same effect as reaching Gymbal limits when TGP reaches timeout and resets.  But, it always occurs when I am zooming out and about maximum. 

 

Bam...

 

Quote:

When you have a steerpoint with no elevation data, it's not a valid SPI.

So if you slew the TGP above the horizon or anything else reverts the SPI Generator to STPT, you'll get the NO SPI message.

 

I do not recall actually slewing the TGP when it happens.  It seems that I just get a "message" flashing on the HUD.  I will pay attention to that.

 

Typically, my SPI is locked to a Mark Point, if not to a waypoint in the mission plan.   Occasionally, I use a TGP SPI.  I do try to mark them all due to idiosyncrasies with TGP.  That way, I can quickly pop back to my target if the TGP gets weird or gymbal faults..

 

How do you make a Mark Point that has no elevation data? 

How do you make a steerpoint that has no elevation data?

 

I am definitely missing something here.

 

Fred,

 

I will try that. 

 

I am not sure of the mode that I am in when it happens.  I normally select INR when I am rolling out and only select INR-P (on purpose --> sometimes I HOTAS fumble) if I am making an attack using the laser.  The TGP will often automatically switch to INR-A.  I will pay more attention to the mode that it happens in.

 

Caldera

[Yurgon]

1 hour ago, Caldera said:

I do not recall actually slewing the TGP when it happens.  It seems that I just get a "message" flashing on the HUD.  I will pay attention to that.

 

There's got to be some reason.

 

1 hour ago, Caldera said:

How do you make a Mark Point that has no elevation data? 

How do you make a steerpoint that has no elevation data?

 

With markpoints, that should not happen as far as I am aware.

 

With steerpoints it can happen when they are entered during the early stages of CDU alignment, when the elevation is not automatically set by the CDU.

[Kuna]

What are the max angles of view for tpod anyway?

Wysłane z mojego Redmi 6 przy użyciu Tapatalka

[Caldera]

Hey Guys,

 

Quote:

Another weirdness that I have seen.  I have been getting NO SPI messages randomly (the white box bottom right corner).    I am positive that I had a SPI just prior, but not true as the SPI evaporated and I get a NO SPI message.   There is no SPI anywhere at the point and I have to create one again. 

 

This seems to be related to when I have the CDU in Mark, where the SPI and the TGP are sitting on the mark point.   Then I switch to Flight Plan or maybe vice versa.  I will keep looking into it.  However, this is not specifically give a  NO SPI message, but the message is similar and the SPI does not actually vanish.

 

Caldera

[Frederf]

Try to capture a track or reproducible action for it

[Caldera]

Hey All,

 

I did not get a track as it was a long mission, but I did get it to happen I again and got some snap shots.

 

This is when I first noticed that I had no SPI.  TMS L Aft had no effect.

 

 

So I created another Mark Point on top of Mark A (C).  I got this error when I switched the CDU Steer Point from Mark to Flight Plan.

 

 

Continued...

Edited August 1, 2021 by Caldera

[Caldera]

Then I noticed that the same thing happened on an adjacent Mark Point (B) that I had created about the same time (as A).

 

 

So in process, I created two Mark Points A and B.  I noticed about the same time that these Mark Points had the error "NO EL" in red letters.  I am guessing that means no elevation data, as you can see by the hooked data where the elevation is zero.

 

I do not know why or how this happens.  These Mark Points where created like just many others on the TAD.

 

Anyone have a clue?

 

Caldera

 

Edited August 1, 2021 by Caldera

[Frederf]

I've never seen "TGP XR ERR" before. I notice this is on Marianas. Does it happen on other terrains? I have a suspicion about elevation data for this new terrain. I do know that the DTSAS area is finite relative to where the airplane spawns. E.g. it's a box around Anapa if you start at Anapa and a different box around Batumi if you start at Batumi. If you fly long enough you'll leave the DTSAS area. But that's never lead to that error I don't think.

[silverdevil]

no answer on this post really but from 2014

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/topic/102360-list-of-error-messages

 

 

 

 

[jaylw314]

19 hours ago, Caldera said:

Hey All,

 

I did not get a track as it was a long mission, but I did get it to happen I again and got some snap shots.

 

This is when I first noticed that I had no SPI.  TMS L Aft had no effect.

 

 

 

So I created another Mark Point on top of Mark A (C).  I got this error when I switched the CDU Steer Point from Mark to Flight Plan.

 

 

Continued...

 

 

When did you create markpoint A?  I've found that creating waypoints (or markpoints) prior to full EGI alignment produces waypoints with the error "NO SPI".  It should not, however, affect waypoints (or markpoints) created after the EGI is fully aligned.

[QuiGon]

@Caldera It would really be helpful, if you could just post a track file, so we can take a look at what is actually happening.

[Caldera]

Hey All,

 

I don't know what to think about this one because it got weird at the end.

 

This is on Caucasas map at Batumi.  I had just landed and turned on to the taxi way when I noticed.  NO SPI

 

Unfortunately my timing was a little late.  Just as I pressed PRTSC the CDU reset and this is the picture I got.  The picture below is the actual MFCD screens that I had up when I first noticed the NO SPI message. 

 

I did not notice exactly when the message first came in as I was in the process of landing.  But somewhere during inbound fairly close I switched the right MFCD to divert and selected Batumi.  I am pretty sure that it happened about then, but I am unsure.  Notice the NO EL in red on the upper picture and the elevation is 000 in both pictures on the left MFCD.

 

 

 

 

I exited the mission and saved the track.  Then I tried to watch the track within the mission editor.  It wasn't even the right track as it was from a previous mission where a SA-13 took me out.  I exited mission editor and then I tried to watch the saved track, same deal.  It was the wrong track.   Then I tried to watch the track in TacView, but the track was not recorded. 

 

Something went wrong...

 

Caldera

Edited August 3, 2021 by Caldera

[Carbon715]

On 8/1/2021 at 6:31 PM, Vinny002 said:

Question for you, what is the rectangular display just above the caution and warning lights in the F-16 Viper called?

 

        Cheers,

     Vincent 

Question I've been having wierd things too...in mission editor is the a10 set to client or player...I have a sneaky suspicion client a10s have flyers activated that are hidden unless cleared out from the aircraft options clear button

[jaylw314]

9 hours ago, Caldera said:

Hey All,

 

I don't know what to think about this one because it got weird at the end.

 

This is on Caucasas map at Batumi.  I had just landed and turned on to the taxi way when I noticed.  NO SPI

 

Unfortunately my timing was a little late.  Just as I pressed PRTSC the CDU reset and this is the picture I got.  The picture below is the actual MFCD screens that I had up when I first noticed the NO SPI message. 

 

I did not notice exactly when the message first came in as I was in the process of landing.  But somewhere during inbound fairly close I switched the right MFCD to divert and selected Batumi.  I am pretty sure that it happened about then, but I am unsure.  Notice the NO EL in red on the upper picture and the elevation is 000 in both pictures on the left MFCD.

 

 

I exited the mission and saved the track.  Then I tried to watch the track within the mission editor.  It wasn't even the right track as it was from a previous mission where a SA-13 took me out.  I exited mission editor and then I tried to watch the saved track, same deal.  It was the wrong track.   Then I tried to watch the track in TacView, but the track was not recorded. 

 

Something went wrong...

 

Caldera

 

 

That actually sounds normal.  About 30 seconds after landing, the A-10C EGI does some housekeeping--I think it downloads flight and engine management data to the DTC among other things.  During this time, the EGI alignment is reset, and you get the NO SPI warning.  I don't recall what sets off the reset, IIRC it might have been weight on wheels.  After a few seconds, the EGI does a warm start and is back up and running.

[QuiGon]

21 hours ago, Caldera said:

I exited the mission and saved the track.  Then I tried to watch the track within the mission editor.  It wasn't even the right track as it was from a previous mission where a SA-13 took me out.  I exited mission editor and then I tried to watch the saved track, same deal.  It was the wrong track.   Then I tried to watch the track in TacView, but the track was not recorded. 

 

You need to use the Replay function in the DCS main menu to watch the track file. It can't be watched through the mission editor nor TacView. So the file should be good, you just didn't use the right tool to watch it

 

In regards to your A-10 issue: @jaylw314 is right.

Edited August 4, 2021 by QuiGon

[Caldera]

Yep...

 

Caldera

[Caldera]

QuiGon,

 

After further review it is different in a subtle way.   The difference is the NO EL message in red.  This does not happen on normal CDU resets if I am correct?

 

Jay,

 

Yes, however it was much longer than 30 seconds as I was sitting there messing with taking and saving the snapshots etc...

 

Thanks for you help!

 

Caldera

Edited August 5, 2021 by Caldera

[QuiGon]

21 hours ago, Caldera said:

QuiGon,

 

After further review it is different in a subtle way.   The difference is the NO EL message in red.  This does not happen on normal CDU resets if I am correct?

 

Without a track file of the issue I can only speculate what's happening there. If you would provide a track file I could take a look at it and see exactly what is happening and what is going wrong.