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Me and my simple Viper


CybrSlydr

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I've had the F-18 and the Supercarrier module for a while (I want to say I got the Supercarrier on release and the F-18 close to it's release - profile says I got the Hornet on 12/29/2018 and Supercarrier on 02/14/2020) but I've never used them that much.  Mostly as the Viper is my first love - I wanted to fly the things when I went to ROTC.

 

But, seeing all the cool weapons that the Hornet gets that the F-16 doesn't (like the SLAM-ER, JSOW C, etc), I thought I'd give it a go in a DCS Liberation campaign mission, just for variety.  Instead of launching a JSOW at an EWR in a DEAD mission with the Viper, I'd give the SLAM-ER a go.

 

HOLY BALLS THAT F-18 IS STUPID COMPLICATED!

 

I know it's just my unfamiliarity with the platform, but the F-16 is so much simpler.  JSOW?  Pre-brief, set the steerpoint to the target and just get in range.  Then there's the whole trying to land thing (and getting the chocks removed so you can actually get to the cat, don't forget to salute or you'll burn all your fuel waiting to launch - lol).  I think I had 6 go-arounds before I snagged the 2 wire and 2 bolters prior to that.  

 

Let alone all the other systems - while I wish the Viper could use the SLAM-ER, just for variety, that Hornet...  Even firing a HARM is complicated.  Viper it's just cursor point and shoot when it range.  lol

 

Trying that Hornet certainly makes me appreciate my simple Viper a lot more.


Edited by CybrSlydr
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Yeah, the Hornet is very clicky-clicky, constantly up and down through multiple layers of menu screens on the MFDs, without very good HOTAS support for many things that are comparatively simple in the Viper.

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Been flying the Viper in FBMS for 20 years and now the DCS one,  its a versatile Hot Rod.  The Hornet though is a workhorse and carries  more weapons also has a built in jammer so I dont have to waste a weapon station on it.

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Man, what should I say. I started with the Viper 28 years ago in Strike Commander 😉 (which was a pretty underestimated sim these times) , then Falcon 4.0 and BMS. I tried out a lot of different aircraft in DCS too. Before we had the Viper I was like: yeah the F18 will be a nice subsitute for the Viper until we get it. Systems work quite similar. I learnt quite a lot about the F18 which is also an amazing aircraft. But now as we have a Viper, I just realized again how well designed an pilot friendly the F16 is. Never fely any urge to jump in the F18 again.


Edited by darkman222
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Cool, Mower I remember you from F4Community (if you went by mower then too).

 

4 hours ago, Machalot said:

Yeah, the Hornet is very clicky-clicky, constantly up and down through multiple layers of menu screens on the MFDs, without very good HOTAS support for many things that are comparatively simple in the Viper.

 

Yeah, I had an epiphany while clicking in the Viper's MFD to set the Fuze for a bomb and realized it was just one button with every possible option in 3 clicks, while the Hornet had 2 buttons (to individually set the front and back fuze). I can totally imagine a newbie thinking "ok, so if I turn off the front fuze and back fuze.... is that a thing or just dumb? And if they're both on what does that do?" lol

 

UI is so difficult even in a modern context but they nailed it back in the day. One of the many reasons the F-16 is a work of art.

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Yeah personally I like the Hornet in '80s type scenarios: with just -9Ms, Sparrows, dumb bomb and the occasional LGB. The rest feels like making thing complicated just for the sake of making things complicated, or simply not caring one bit about the pilot-machine interface.

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I tired several weeks to get the hang of the hornet,  could bearly make it do anything. 

But in the same amount of time in the Viper.  I learned to use all the dumb bomb modes, JDAMS, smart bombs, HARMS, AMRAAMS etc. Only the Mavrick I find hard.

 

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6 hours ago, Gunfreak said:

I tired several weeks to get the hang of the hornet,  could bearly make it do anything. 

But in the same amount of time in the Viper.  I learned to use all the dumb bomb modes, JDAMS, smart bombs, HARMS, AMRAAMS etc. Only the Mavrick I find hard.

 

 

The maverick is not difficult, I recommend you to not use AUTO in TGP, just manual bacause AUTO is very slow and unpredictable. If the maverick didn't lock on you're waisting more time to reacquarie and its very dangerous.

 

For me the types of weapons are the disappointing thing in the F-16, it has much less options compared to F-18 or JF-17.

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15 hours ago, Theodore42 said:

Cool, Mower I remember you from F4Community (if you went by mower then too).

 

Yes Sir, the one and same.  Going back to FrugalsWorld circa 2002 or even earlier to the infamous Delphi Board circa 1999.  Been with Ed since 1995 Flanker 1.0 on W95.


Edited by Mower
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24 minutes ago, Ignition said:

 

The maverick is not difficult, I recommend you to not use AUTO in TGP, just manual bacause AUTO is very slow and unpredictable. If the maverick didn't lock on you're waisting more time to reacquarie and its very dangerous.

 

For me the types of weapons are the disappointing thing in the F-16, it has much less options compared to F-18 or JF-17.

 

My problem is finding a target before fly over it/it kills me.

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4 minutes ago, Gunfreak said:

 

My problem is finding a target before fly over it/it kills me.

 

Use a JTAC if available and/or GMT mode and/or the TGP if general target area known.


Edited by Mower

"You see, IronHand is my thing"

My specs:  W10 Pro, I5/11600K o/c to 4800 @1.32v, 64 GB 3200 XML RAM, ASUS RTX3060ti/8GB.

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Yep, I find the Hornet complex systems-wise, but sterile and boring when it comes to actually flying it. I get that this is what makes it such an effective platform in the real world, but it feels more like data entry than piloting. Traps are fun, but I much prefer the Tomcat for naval ops ... and flight dynamics ... and just about everything.

 

I had zero interest in the Viper, but bought it on a whim when it was on a crazy low sale and I had points to use up (ended up being only a few bucks more than most 50% off modules). Maybe it's because I had no expectations, but I enjoy the Viper immensely now. The view, the cockpit ergonomics, the approach to systems - it all feels so much more comfortable, manageable, and just a nicer place to spend time in. I don't need one plane to do everything, which is a major attraction of the Hornet. But the Hornet kind of feels like a Warthog in a different guise. I would happily pay full price for the Viper at this point. This is a great thing about DCS - different folks, different strokes.

 

I can't wait for the Viper to steal some of the Hornet's limelight when it comes to content creation though.


Edited by wowbagger
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54 minutes ago, Mower said:

 

Use a JTAC if available and/or GMT mode and/or the TGP if general target area known.

 

 

I've only used the maverick in two user made missions I've downloaded. 

 

In the first one, I couldn't find the base with the missiles I was gonna blow up, neither with the maverick itself or the TGP.

The second mission I was supposed to blow up some ships but because of the very low cloud. I had to fly really low and so the angle got weird and it was a very early dawn mission, meaning sea and land was hard to distinguish. I never found the ships before a SAM took me out.

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1 hour ago, Mower said:

 

Use a JTAC if available and/or GMT mode and/or the TGP if general target area known.

 

Does a JTAC require a TGP to be useful? 

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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10 minutes ago, Xavven said:

 

I haven't practiced this lately, but could you enter coordinates JTAC gives you into a steerpoint and then get eyes on with the HMCS?

IIRC we can't see STPT's in the JHMCS yet as that's a part of the A-G functionality, unless something's changed that I've missed. But yes, this would be the preferred method in a JTAC scenario. Our tape of F-16 should also be able to send/receive data to JTAC/FAC(A) via link.


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For the past few months, I'd shelved the Viper in favor of the Harrier, until the former matured a bit.  Yesterday, I flew the Viper to check its status....WOW!!  It's way better now, and I can't wait for the Oct release, whatever it will contain.  Keep up the great work, ED.  Let me get back to my muscle memory....

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26 minutes ago, karasawa said:

waiting for more updates from ED.

The contents of the October patch had a lot of promise, but 2 of my most anticipated features have been moved back it seems, as per Wags's update.
Still, there's quite a lot remaining in there to get excited about 😉

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On 9/26/2021 at 3:58 PM, CybrSlydr said:

I've had the F-18 and the Supercarrier module for a while (I want to say I got the Supercarrier on release and the F-18 close to it's release - profile says I got the Hornet on 12/29/2018 and Supercarrier on 02/14/2020) but I've never used them that much.  Mostly as the Viper is my first love - I wanted to fly the things when I went to ROTC.

 

But, seeing all the cool weapons that the Hornet gets that the F-16 doesn't (like the SLAM-ER, JSOW C, etc), I thought I'd give it a go in a DCS Liberation campaign mission, just for variety.  Instead of launching a JSOW at an EWR in a DEAD mission with the Viper, I'd give the SLAM-ER a go.

 

HOLY BALLS THAT F-18 IS STUPID COMPLICATED!

 

I know it's just my unfamiliarity with the platform, but the F-16 is so much simpler.  JSOW?  Pre-brief, set the steerpoint to the target and just get in range.  Then there's the whole trying to land thing (and getting the chocks removed so you can actually get to the cat, don't forget to salute or you'll burn all your fuel waiting to launch - lol).  I think I had 6 go-arounds before I snagged the 2 wire and 2 bolters prior to that.  

 

Let alone all the other systems - while I wish the Viper could use the SLAM-ER, just for variety, that Hornet...  Even firing a HARM is complicated.  Viper it's just cursor point and shoot when it range.  lol

 

Trying that Hornet certainly makes me appreciate my simple Viper a lot more.

 

I have been spending a bit of time in the Viper lately and really enjoy it.  I agree that it feels easier to use from the point of interfacing with it.  Easier to get set up for weapon delivery.  I pretty much only fly the F/A-18, the F-14, and the F-16 now.  Love them all after the initial 20 hours in each.  Glad I have keys to all of them!

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The Viper is really pilot-friendly, I literally learned it when I was 14 years old. Of course, I did have Pete "Boomer" Boonani to guide me with his excellent Falcon 4.0 manual, but hey, it's still quite something. 🙂 It's definitely less fiddly than the Hornet, and doesn't suffer nearly as much from the lack of DTC implementation in DCS. One thing that initially threw me off when I was first learning it was that it's so steerpoint-dependent in most of the A/G modes, I hope they get the markpoints done in the next update.

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