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Briefing Room


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2 hours ago, Hiob said:

 

Don‘t speak for all of us. 

Same here. I´m eager for the Briefing room & grennie board.


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 - "Don't be John Wayne in the Break if you´re going to be Jerry Lewis on the Ball".

About carrier ops: "The younger pilots are still quite capable of holding their heads forward against the forces. The older ones have been doing this too long and know better; sore necks make for poor sleep.'

 

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2 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

A lot of time and resources have gone into the supercarrier, when the team is ready to release the new content they will. None of it is being ignored. 

And I don´t doubt it at all, a thing like the SC has never been done before, and I´m sure is a pretty complex task, but it´s like ED is building a fusion reactor, every new feauture, or even bug, takes an eternity to make or solve comparing with other early access modules, and the feeling is like it will take a decade to complete it, and the progress made, doesn´t seem too much, at least from the customer side, we only have few pics of the same virtual rooms, and that´s it. Nothing about the ATC, barricade net, the new Stennis, general improvements, night ops..., it´s like work on that hasn´t even begun. That´s why many people are suspicius about it🤔

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5 minutes ago, AKULA_OPTIMUS said:

And I don´t doubt it at all, a thing like the SC has never been done before, and I´m sure is a pretty complex task, but it´s like ED is building a fusion reactor, every new feauture, or even bug, takes an eternity to make or solve comparing with other early access modules, and the feeling is like it will take a decade to complete it, and the progress made, doesn´t seem too much, at least from the customer side, we only have few pics of the same virtual rooms, and that´s it. Nothing about the ATC, barricade net, the new Stennis, general improvements, night ops..., it´s like work on that hasn´t even begun. That´s why many people are suspicius about it🤔

We get that, early access takes a long time and it can be frustrating for people. But the teams are working as fast as they can, no amount of complaining can change how fast the teams can work.


Thanks

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And we should be aware of how hard we are in our words. Everytime when we hear about months of crunch in a studio we are so angry. We are so mad about the studio who's acting that way, just burning people for hitting a timeframe. 
A week later we are totally mad our shiny new toy will delay.

And no, I don't want to deligitimze every form of critic. Just a reminder to think about your critic, and the ways you talk about.


On the other hand ED could think about the way they talk about their modules, about the progress. The best example is the Apache. The status-video was supreme communication! As a customer I felt well informed about the state of the product and the reasons for the delay. Sure, such a video can't be made every week for every little detail. But maybe the basic idea of showing some more could help. 

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23 hours ago, BarTzi said:

Can we have a feature poll for the supercarrier? I mean, it will reduce the amount of complaints for sure.

 

This is probably a very good idea... There are some issues, like no deck crew wands at night, that likely most users would be putting near the top of that list.

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On 2/19/2022 at 8:13 PM, BIGNEWY said:

We get that, early access takes a long time and it can be frustrating for people. But the teams are working as fast as they can, no amount of complaining can change how fast the teams can work.


Thanks

I did not mean to start a 'flood' of complaints with my comment, and I appreciate you not locking this thread. I want to reply to what you said.

It's true that EA takes a long time to be completed, we all know this, trust me. We are not here to bash the devs. Still, after nearly two years with almost no updates to the module, there comes a time when we have to start asking some questions. Not all of those questions can be answered with the usual "it's in EA it takes time".

We know that EA\development can't last forever, and sometime in the future less and less resources will be allocated towards the development of this module (even the Hornet, as one of your flagship modules, is getting features removed, and is planned to get some fixes only when resources allow, which is an unknown to us). In my opinion, while resources are still allocated, and there are still people actively working on it, other more important issues\features should be worked on first (which is why I suggested the poll).

Maybe it's just a product of me sitting here and not being a part of the development process, but I fail to see a reason why the ready room should take priority over night equipment, or a way to set the right wind on deck for recoveries (almost two years after release and I still have to use a script to set it... imagine that).

I would highly appreciate if you could reply to some of my questions about the ready room, written in my previous comment here, so we can know that to expect.

Thanks.

 


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Just now, BarTzi said:

I did not mean to start a 'flood' of complaints with my comment, and I appreciate you not locking this thread. I want to reply to what you said.

It's true that EA takes a long time to be completed, we all know this, trust me. We are not here to bash the devs. Still, after almost two years with almost no updates to the module, there comes a time when we have to start asking some questions. Not all of those questions can be answered with the usual "it's in EA it takes time".

We know that EA\development can't last forever, and sometime in the future less and less resources will be allocated towards the development of this module (even the Hornet, as one of your flagship modules, is getting features removed, and is planned to get some fixes only when resources allow, which is an unknown to us). In my opinion, while resources are still allocated, and there are still people actively working on it, other more important issues\features should be worked on first (which is why I suggested the poll).

Maybe it's just a product of me sitting here and not being a part of the development process, but I fail to see a reason why the ready room should take priority over night equipment, or a way to set the right wind on deck for recoveries (almost two years after release and I still have to use a script to set it... imagine that).

 

 

Hey no problem, we want our module to be out of early access as much as you all do, but the reality is it does take time, people are passionate and have opinions and that is fine also.
Some take it to far, but some always will, some ask the same question repeatedly and expect a different answer which can become frustrating for all.

I have mentioned it in another thread, the project managers know the best way to task the team, it may not always align with what public demand is. Wands are coming, I cannot give you any ETA yet, even if we have an internal date for them giving you all that date would only create drama if we were to go over a planned date. This is why we will only mention tasks that are closer to completion. 
I hope you can understand the reasoning behind that, enjoy what we have already and know new things are coming.

Thanks

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There are a lot of people here obviously not very excited about the Briefing Room and Airboss features, especially when they seem to be prioritised over what many deem as ‘quality of flight’ issues such as wands, auto into wind steering, expanded & more realistic comms, etc etc.

Maybe ED could de-escalate some of this tension, and even gain some support for their chosen development path, if they explained a few of the features and functions we can look forward to with both the Briefing Room & Airboss. Currently, we don’t have a clue, because no one has ever told us. That’s despite it being asked for multiple times, even in this thread alone. How can ED expect users to get excited about features they know absolutely nothing about?

The only conclusion I can come up with, is that ED is completely unsure themselves on what they can deliver. So much so there’s not even the internal confidence to release a list of expected features and functions, however short or brief.

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2 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

I have mentioned it in another thread, the project managers know the best way to task the team, it may not always align with what public demand is.

Perhaps the real issue is that we're approaching two years since the SC was released to early access and there are some persistent bugs and basic functionality that appear to be lost in the ED development process ether that don't seem like they would take more effort to solve than developing a new ready room (i.e. a way to see deck crew hands in the dark without NVGs or use of landing lights, and the fact that your jet answers everyone else's inbound calls as your jet which creates enormous confusion when trying to get a half-dozen elements on the deck cleanly).  Pretty much every developer using the early access model has to be willing to make an enormous investment in asbestos underwear and fire extinguishers to handle less than positive customer feedback.   Going silent on progress that customers are asking about only fans the flames harder and asbestos can only protect someone from being on fire for a short period of time.  You still have to use the extinguishers by providing the look ahead.  Use of neither is pleasant for a bunch of introverted programmers.  We're all certain that when the ready room and air boss are available they will be cool because that's something ED does well when it wants to, but the ready room without some critical bug fixes is not what was ever communicated.  

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3 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

the project managers know the best way to task the team, it may not always align with what public demand is.

Well when I read all the posts in the last two years, in here and reddit, I would come to the conclusion that in this particular case the project managers do not and do not align with public demand at all. Like zero.

After all this time seeing what the majority of customers demand, I would rethink my plan. Just saying 🤷🏽‍♂️

Listening to customers and making them happy could be a very good direction (not pointed at you BN, you listen).

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Just now, Andartu said:

Well when I read all the posts in the last two years, in here and reddit, I would come to the conclusion that in this particular case the project managers do not and do not align with public demand at all. Like zero.

you maybe missed the public polls we had on other modules. 

Again, and I keep repeating it, the wands are coming, but they are not ready yet, no amount of complaining is going to change that in this case. 

Thanks

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11 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

you maybe missed the public polls we had on other modules. 

Again, and I keep repeating it, the wands are coming, but they are not ready yet, no amount of complaining is going to change that in this case. 

Thanks

No i did see them and participated in some.

All good, i was not complaining. Just observation of what was posted over all the time and what the main direction of the wishes of the customers is. And the project manager demand obviously differs a lot from the customers demand, and this is not that fortunate so to say. As said, just observation. I believe you have a similar picture.

And yeah I am very well aware that complaining does not change things. 🙂 

Thanks

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13 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

you maybe missed the public polls we had on other modules. 

Again, and I keep repeating it, the wands are coming, but they are not ready yet, no amount of complaining is going to change that in this case. 

Thanks

Hi, we know that work take time and all players are not project manager themselves. 
But, like many of other video game, ED have to make roadmap ? Without this, i got the impression that there was any plan or only short view plan.

Perhaps it will be a good to share the roadmap even it change often ?

thanks. 

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4 hours ago, hanab said:

Hi, we know that work take time and all players are not project manager themselves. 
But, like many of other video game, ED have to make roadmap ? Without this, i got the impression that there was any plan or only short view plan.

Perhaps it will be a good to share the roadmap even it change often ?

thanks. 

We have already mentioned there will be no roadmap this year, all projects still in development continue, including the supercarrier and when we have news we will share it. 

thanks

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2 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

We have already mentioned there will be no roadmap this year, all projects still in development continue, including the supercarrier and when we have news we will share it. 

thanks

Let's face that point, for a moment, and let's be real, the point is, ED was always way to optimistic about planned released and still is, evidence : AH-64 or every new module. That's not be impolite, but that's the truth. I get projects takes time,.. but lets be honest, often it was more than obvious that the release will not be possible in time.

 

20 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

you maybe missed the public polls we had on other modules. 

Again, and I keep repeating it, the wands are coming, but they are not ready yet, no amount of complaining is going to change that in this case. 

Thanks

We saw the poll and for example the FA18 Poll was the first time I had again the feeling ED would listen and respect our opinion BUT even that's out of the window because now progress nearly stopped and the promise to finish the Hornet before the Falcon is the new focus is also broken, I know you don't want to hear that but call it as you like that's how it feels. I totally get why the Falcon guys are happy their bird now gets more attention, but it's a slap in the face for every bug-driver. 

Why do I point that out? 
ED not you personal Bignewy but ED is saying, we should trust, and they know best, but in the end a Business has 1 Major points to fulfill, ... make money obviously and for that they should make the customer happy, that's why it's called customer is king. 

Try to get into the head of us customers, not just saying, but really try it, feel the frustration and at that moment, after seeing features removed, delayed, hundreds, some of them of nearly decade old, bug reports and really ask yourself are you really able to put your trust into these words after two years with nearly no progress at all? Is this really how it should be? A test of strength for the customer, a take it or break it approach. 

I for myself are one of your longtime customers, I stick with ed since lock on, I have enough miles to buy a full module with them,... but I do feel more and more fatigue. 

And to say "buy a finished module" well some of our older friends might never live to see the full release of the module they want, also see the approach of the hornet,... I mean, you want to push it out of EA in a unfinished state soooo.... 

As mentioned it's not personal against someone or to hate,... but in the end I personally as others think ED is not only partly decoupled from what the customer really want and how they should locate and communicate, as I always say good communication and transparency can do a lot. But you can not forever hope on blind trust,... you will more and more lose your long time customer and the guys who really carried ED for all that years. 

On 2/19/2022 at 7:13 PM, BIGNEWY said:

We get that, early access takes a long time and it can be frustrating for people. But the teams are working as fast as they can, no amount of complaining can change how fast the teams can work.


Thanks

We get that too, but in which other why can we show our frustration and also if a company sees that people are unhappy how they operate they maybe should just give it a though it might be not all perfect the way they do it. 

If ED would just stick the Wands with tape to the models, even it might have looked like an early 1999 era game and said "Yeah it's interim because we did hear ya it will be better, but that's a fast fix" many if not most user would cut you the slag for it. 
On the other hand, nothing other as "yeah its coming,... someday" and to say for other features "we do not know if we do it because we fear how it works in mp" while scripts already do it quite good,... that's are real bummer for customer.

 

For me, I can just say, communicate with us, do more real release dates, stick to promises and start sometime question yourself "is what I do really the best approach" "Is this what the community/customer wants" Most of us all time Customers really cut you a lot of slag in the past. You can not expect us to be on hold forever.

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19 minutes ago, headbreaker_ger said:

Let's face that point, for a moment, and let's be real, the point is, ED was always way to optimistic about planned released and still is, evidence : AH-64 or every new module. That's not be impolite, but that's the truth. I get projects takes time,.. but lets be honest, often it was more than obvious that the release will not be possible in time.

 

We saw the poll and for example the FA18 Poll was the first time I had again the feeling ED would listen and respect our opinion BUT even that's out of the window because now progress nearly stopped and the promise to finish the Hornet before the Falcon is the new focus is also broken, I know you don't want to hear that but call it as you like that's how it feels. I totally get why the Falcon guys are happy their bird now gets more attention, but it's a slap in the face for every bug-driver. 

Why do I point that out? 
ED not you personal Bignewy but ED is saying, we should trust, and they know best, but in the end a Business has 1 Major points to fulfill, ... make money obviously and for that they should make the customer happy, that's why it's called customer is king. 

Try to get into the head of us customers, not just saying, but really try it, feel the frustration and at that moment, after seeing features removed, delayed, hundreds, some of them of nearly decade old, bug reports and really ask yourself are you really able to put your trust into these words after two years with nearly no progress at all? Is this really how it should be? A test of strength for the customer, a take it or break it approach. 

I for myself are one of your longtime customers, I stick with ed since lock on, I have enough miles to buy a full module with them,... but I do feel more and more fatigue. 

And to say "buy a finished module" well some of our older friends might never live to see the full release of the module they want, also see the approach of the hornet,... I mean, you want to push it out of EA in a unfinished state soooo.... 

As mentioned it's not personal against someone or to hate,... but in the end I personally as others think ED is not only partly decoupled from what the customer really want and how they should locate and communicate, as I always say good communication and transparency can do a lot. But you can not forever hope on blind trust,... you will more and more lose your long time customer and the guys who really carried ED for all that years. 

We get that too, but in which other why can we show our frustration and also if a company sees that people are unhappy how they operate they maybe should just give it a though it might be not all perfect the way they do it. 

If ED would just stick the Wands with tape to the models, even it might have looked like an early 1999 era game and said "Yeah it's interim because we did hear ya it will be better, but that's a fast fix" many if not most user would cut you the slag for it. 
On the other hand, nothing other as "yeah its coming,... someday" and to say for other features "we do not know if we do it because we fear how it works in mp" while scripts already do it quite good,... that's are real bummer for customer.

 

For me, I can just say, communicate with us, do more real release dates, stick to promises and start sometime question yourself "is what I do really the best approach" "Is this what the community/customer wants" Most of us all time Customers really cut you a lot of slag in the past. You can not expect us to be on hold forever.

Thank you for your feedback and thanks for sticking with us. 

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3 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

We have already mentioned there will be no roadmap this year, all projects still in development continue, including the supercarrier and when we have news we will share it. 

thanks

Very prudent.

 

better to under promise and over deliver than the other way around

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21 hours ago, Cal1664 said:

Where is it not said or written?however  thank you for your very productive feed back on an opinion 🥱👍 

 

Seemed a faily stright forward question to me. I assume your "opinon" is baseless then? 

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2 hours ago, Boosterdog said:

Seemed a faily stright forward question to me. I assume your "opinon" is baseless then? 

Seemed a straight forward answer to me. . . 

My opinion is based on the majoritys thinking on the matter, as evedenced by the comments within this thread and other. 

 

Ps this is not a dig at ED, just stating that it seems the majority of people want lights rather than a briefing room. 

 

 

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11 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

We have already mentioned there will be no roadmap this year, all projects still in development continue, including the supercarrier and when we have news we will share it. 

thanks

No roadmap = no plan 

surprising but you are the project manager (who works without a plan).  
 

Good luck for the future.

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