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FLIR on BS3.


CYPHER11

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En 21/11/2021 a las 11:52, AlphaOneSix dijo:

Well, then you should skip this release. Plenty of others will be excited by the Igla and MWS. Everyone will get the new art.

No one is forcing you to use the FLIR if it was available. Now do not try to force a lack of FLIR on me.

 

We already have seen how that BS3 will have features that are admitted by developers to be arbitrarily assembled Frankenstein style ( like the A-10C II if my research is accurate ). 

These self-appointed enemies of FLIR I can not comprehend. It is like me going to people that are using a gps and breaking it and demanding that they use a map, a compass, rulers, etcetera. Do not try to force inferior technology on me when it has already been admitted that the KA-50 of BS3 will be a frankencopter as relating to the assembly of features. It was a prototype helicopter and there were no pre-decided, set-in-stone, official configuration or list of acceptable sensors that the aircraft is or is not to have. 


Edited by El buscador de la verdad
Structural improvements of the composition were completed.
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hace 3 horas, AlphaOneSix dijo:

I'm no enemy of FLIR, why would you paint me as such? Your arguments are so full of fallacies that they are difficult to read on their own merits.

The implication of your comment was: If you do not like the current plan of people where FLIR will not be included, then do not let the door hit your ass on the way out, no FLIR will be added.

You could have said, "Yes, the helicopter would have much more utility if it had a sensor with FLIR compatibility and I support this being included.", however you did not.

If statements that are equivalent to: "It is going to be this way and if you do not like it, then too bad. Everyone else does not care about FLIR." do not constitute one as being an opposer of FLIR for the KA-50, then I do not know what would qualify one for this designation.

hace 3 horas, okopanja dijo:

I am puzzled why Ka-50, and not Ka-52 with radar in addition to FLIR? This would make certain balance that also exists IRL.

You do not need to use these options if they were available. I do not demand that you use features, you ought to reciprocate this considerateness and abstain from demanding that I not have access to features.

     Life is not balanced. Nature hates equality, look at lions and zebras. Individual servers can select what options are available or not and so can you as to those that you would use if they were available.

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8 hours ago, okopanja said:

I am puzzled why Ka-50, and not Ka-52 with radar in addition to FLIR? This would make certain balance that also exists IRL.

Because Russian Law forbids us from simulating a Ka-52.

I agree with Buscador that the Ka-50 was a prototype.  Only a few were ever produced, and they were all experiments.  All of these experiments led to the development of the Ka-52.

This is why ED is allowed to simulate the Ka-50.  Because the only real versions of it are prototypes, that we're rebuilt into Ka-52's, or are sitting in sheds on air bases, rusting away.

I also agree with ED saying they are just going to make what they thought it would be if it had been produced.  A scout and attack craft linked to a Ka-52 command helicopter.

That heli would have had iglas, maybe RWR ( it may have depended more on the Ka-52 command ship to do that ), FLIR, upgraded Shkval ( Ka-52 does not use Shkval, it was dumped for a better EO system), President - S.

The only thing I can see the Russians objecting to is the President - S being simulated.  Everything else is old.

I'm not sure if the Russian's would allow Ka-52 AI to be simulated either.

The actual document banning this is very vague.


Edited by 3WA
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6 hours ago, El buscador de la verdad said:

The implication of your comment was: If you do not like the current plan of people where FLIR will not be included, then do not let the door hit your ass on the way out, no FLIR will be added.

You could have said, "Yes, the helicopter would have much more utility if it had a sensor with FLIR compatibility and I support this being included.", however you did not.

If statements that are equivalent to: "It is going to be this way and if you do not like it, then too bad. Everyone else does not care about FLIR." do not constitute one as being an opposer of FLIR for the KA-50, then I do not know what would qualify one for this designation.

Don't put words in my mouth that I did not say. What I wrote and what you interpreted are not equivalent statements.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 2/19/2022 at 11:17 PM, 3WA said:

Because Russian Law forbids us from simulating a Ka-52.

I agree with Buscador that the Ka-50 was a prototype.  Only a few were ever produced, and they were all experiments.  All of these experiments led to the development of the Ka-52.

This is why ED is allowed to simulate the Ka-50.  Because the only real versions of it are prototypes, that we're rebuilt into Ka-52's, or are sitting in sheds on air bases, rusting away.

I also agree with ED saying they are just going to make what they thought it would be if it had been produced.  A scout and attack craft linked to a Ka-52 command helicopter.

That heli would have had iglas, maybe RWR ( it may have depended more on the Ka-52 command ship to do that ), FLIR, upgraded Shkval ( Ka-52 does not use Shkval, it was dumped for a better EO system), President - S.

The only thing I can see the Russians objecting to is the President - S being simulated.  Everything else is old.

I'm not sure if the Russian's would allow Ka-52 AI to be simulated either.

The actual document banning this is very vague.

 

Okay not even an AI KA52? interesting

even if the comparison is a bit lame but in Warthunder the Ka52 is rudimentary playable

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7 hours ago, Hobel said:

even if the comparison is a bit lame but in Warthunder the Ka52 is rudimentary playable

It's not only lame, it's against the forum rules.

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Don't accept indie game testing requests from friends in Discord. Ever.

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On 3/13/2022 at 6:58 PM, Hobel said:

Okay not even an AI KA52? interesting

even if the comparison is a bit lame but in Warthunder the Ka52 is rudimentary playable

I would love an AI Ka-52.  As I said above though, I don't know if Russian law would allow it.  I've read that document ( at least, what is on the internet ), and it just seems very, very vague.

It would have to be very good AI if it was made though.  Because it would be what is directing the Ka-50's in the group, i.e. the command ship.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Quote

Мы не будем делать ИК оптику на Ка-50.
"We will not make IR optics on the Ka-50."

So I will not buy BS3.

What do they offer us for this module?
MWS? It's not an RWR, so it's not very useful, even more since we know that we won't have the whole “presitent-S” suite that goes with it.
the IGLAs? Interesting, but not essential. The role of Kamov remains the CAS so the IGLAS are not a vital functionality.

These features are also fictitious, there is no MWS on the Abris (which is a Finnish civilian navigation computer), and the 3-port wing only exists on the KA-52.
What is missing the most in Kamov? A FLIR. And that's good, there is a KA-50 model with FLIR, the Ka50N or Ka-50Sh with a Sam<profanity> optronic turret.
it exists, unlike the rest of the useless features offered!

A FLIR on the KA-50 and I pay for the module, I even have to pay dearly. But the IGLAS and the MWS? I do not care !

You don't made it ? We don't buy it.

We all think the same in my Kamov squadrons. If you want us to pay for this module, do something that makes us the will to buy!
You have just redone heat maps! Give us that FLIR!

 

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  • 3 months later...

Want to bump this topic up. 

Now i do not want to gripe, but i recently picked up the KA-50 after aroubd 2 years, and have a blast with it. Its a great bird to fly and kill stuff with. 

However i am really wondering about one thing. Is adding a FLIR to the ka50 really a big deal? 

I mean i know the whole story from the formal perspective, and some things cannot be modelled because of security reasons. But truth be told if we could simply get the flir for the shark it would be awesome. Just add flir, plus 2 buttons to change WHOT to BHOT and thats it. Heck, it can even be named the KA-50N and it could be a very limited version due to security stuff. I have No idea what kind of fancy systems it has, but truth be told if we would get the shark as it is right now + flir i would be a happy man. 

Would it make the shark on par with the apache during night ops? Probably not. But it would allow for better night ops. 

So simple question is, would it be possible to get a flir, without any special systems? I mean, do it in a way that it does not raise any security concerns. 

Im a simple man that finds fun in simple things. However i might be missing something, that is not that simple as i imagine it. I fully respect that. 

@BIGNEWY Thanks in advance and please dont kill me for asking this question, if you have already been spammed with it in the past. 

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On 7/18/2022 at 1:55 PM, Mr.Scar said:

Want to bump this topic up. 

Now i do not want to gripe, but i recently picked up the KA-50 after aroubd 2 years, and have a blast with it. Its a great bird to fly and kill stuff with. 

However i am really wondering about one thing. Is adding a FLIR to the ka50 really a big deal? 

I mean i know the whole story from the formal perspective, and some things cannot be modelled because of security reasons. But truth be told if we could simply get the flir for the shark it would be awesome. Just add flir, plus 2 buttons to change WHOT to BHOT and thats it. Heck, it can even be named the KA-50N and it could be a very limited version due to security stuff. I have No idea what kind of fancy systems it has, but truth be told if we would get the shark as it is right now + flir i would be a happy man. 

Would it make the shark on par with the apache during night ops? Probably not. But it would allow for better night ops. 

So simple question is, would it be possible to get a flir, without any special systems? I mean, do it in a way that it does not raise any security concerns. 

Im a simple man that finds fun in simple things. However i might be missing something, that is not that simple as i imagine it. I fully respect that. 

@BIGNEWY Thanks in advance and please dont kill me for asking this question, if you have already been spammed with it in the past. 

With you on this one. I was commenting to my co KA-50 flyer that all the she needs is a FLIR & an RWR to be nearly perfect.

Perhaps the cynic in me tells me it won't ever happen as it may impact Apache sales.

I'd like to think not and that it would encourage further KA-50 sales and even up the red vs blue force levels.

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It really does need FLIR.  Otherwise, it just can't compete against other more modern helicopters.

It was meant to be part of a pack, lead by a Ka-52 with radar, RWR, etc, so not sure if it would need RWR.

Of course, the real problem is, there is no Ka-52 to be the leader, AI or otherwise.

So, in that sense, we need a Ka-50 that can be standalone, like the Apache.  So, RWR, chaff, igla, FLIR, etc.

It's just a real mess as it stands now.

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