missing info Damage model issue, too vulnerable?

[Kumabit]

As the title, I believe the current damage model of the hind is maybe too vulnerable. In DCS, the wing will usually get taken out if hit by some 7.62 bullets, but this seems doesn't match the reputation of the hind. Plz do some investment on this, a soldier with an AK47 can take a hind out if he has a good aim lol, this just doesn't sound right.

[KoN]

I agree too vulnerable considering its the flying tank . lol . 

[AlphaOneSix]

Well, I guess it's not a flying tank.

[AeriaGloria]

There will always be a golden BB that will take you out if it hits the right spot.

 

the only spot on the Hind that isn’t really armored is the sides of the canopy and tail. AK-74s have taken out my tail rotor but too much of anything’s will take out anything.

 

your armor int impervious to small calibers, it just takes alot 

[Kumabit]

On 12/25/2021 at 1:51 PM, AeriaGloria said:

There will always be a golden BB that will take you out if it hits the right spot.

 

the only spot on the Hind that isn’t really armored is the sides of the canopy and tail. AK-74s have taken out my tail rotor but too much of anything’s will take out anything.

 

your armor int impervious to small calibers, it just takes alot 

Hahaha, the "golden BB" got me, so true. However, it feels like every bullet is a "golden BB" for me lol. Maybe I am just too unlucky.

[KoN]

Flying online its like every enemy target gets hits on the Hind . Tanks ,Bunkers, AKs , But I think this is some thing to do with Ground targets are so Accurate . ? 

Seems so easy too bring down and nearly all same damage , The  engine looses power and your forced to glide down to crash land . 70% in explosion . 

Considering the Afghans couldn't shoot this thing down until the CIA brought in the stinger . 

Even Bunkers are bringing down the Hind . Online play . Just a gripe . 

 

[AeriaGloria]

I think it’s more vulnerable since the last big patch but that’s it. It was very durable before. But now it takes less hits in the wing stop the firing/jettison circuits. It seems to take less holes in the engine to have drastic power loss. 
 

and Kon, your engines will on Lu lose power if your engines or gearbox are hit. Sometimes it’s useful in F2 view to see where the hits are

[KoN]

No F2 view with online play . Yes of course i get the fact if engines get hit your loose power ect ,  that's common sense .

But I think she is too vulnerable  today .  But some one did mention that ground targets are so over powered in DCS .(OP) With Aim bot .

That they refuse to go low level.

[AeriaGloria]

11 hours ago, KoN said:

No F2 view with online play . Yes of course i get the fact if engines get hit your loose power ect ,  that's common sense .

But I think she is too vulnerable  today .  But some one did mention that ground targets are so over powered in DCS .(OP) With Aim bot .

That they refuse to go low level.

F2 view in MP is server dependent, a lot of servers will allow it 

[rogorogo]

after having paid attention to this before and especially after patch open.beta.2.7.9.18080 I would like to affirm this bug.
As so often this imho is a cumulative bug without a singular source issue.
While the module's DM is both WIP in rapid prototyping (and nothin beyond in practices) and in a very noticeable assyemtry some damage states might be in mispercpetion.

That IFV have a hardcoded sniper AI always locking on the pilot is well known - but as there is no shattered perspex (well.. it is not perspex but I forgot what the material is actually called) inner or outer render model, no cockpit sparks or panel damage states, no pilot injury and death animation or overlay filters (while there is a simple red overlay filter if the pilot gets crushed/inured in a rollover) and the player is also allowed to keep looking around and notice cursor map state changes, just without interaction - this once again shows a baseline systemic bug that has not been adressed for many years and will not be for many more.

But when a single rifle-caliber impact "plink" (rifle-caliber, as in infantry) result in either

• loss of both turbines
• complete loss of electrics (even when apu is started)
• pilot death (with the added flavour of see above)

there is definitely a mesh/hitbox/surface glitch and/or anything from a typo to a wrong action.result chain present.

For the latter another indication is that even a slight loss of power on one of the two turbines (with both turbine rpm, engine pressue and collective rpm very much still in the cruise threshold, and comfortably in its centroid) inevitably leads to an ever so slow descent and crash or at some pitch a sudden state.change into an uncontrolled RBS nose-up followed by an inevitable (and correct!) VRS crash.

External views can be disregarded, there is no finished indication for anything - but then seemingly the same applies to instrument indication for most damage events.
And - as stated above - the still complete absence of injury state indication for the player/pilot itself.

So even variants of the bugged state by - for example - single cannon (20-30mm) by IFVs or ballistic AAA cannot be paid attention to - as still is the case with most missile (A2A, G2A, AAM, Manpad, SAM) impacts.
For "sticks" the module mostly just evaporates. It does not blow up, it just evaporates in midair. And alternatively you crash while not actually showing any physical damage on the airframe (exception: collision meshes and damage states for main rotor blades, main rotor only, the tailrotor just goes missing and or the tail just breaks off).

Not the end of the world, will surely ably change at some point - but should be taken notice of and maybe attempted to stay in more cohesive or at least coherent coresponding overall progress state.

And while of course the argument "butbubbut it's early access... it's open beta...." could be brought forward (and will be done so as the usual pretense and cop-out) - no, that is not an excuse.
That the product provider has made an open-beta TESTBED the de-facto release tree while the actual release tree has ZERO release schedule paired with early-access states that span years is a fallacy in itself and deserves being admonished.

And before the usual Ian Banks excession event happens - in eventu conditionalis this will be pointed out wherever possible - act like adults (you know who you are), your actions define tonality, you create the echo you deserve as it will mirror your message outline (in median and centroid, the unsuitable outliers will always exist and should be disregarded if baseline cognition is present).

[AeriaGloria]

I have destroyed my Hind hundreds of times and never seen it evaporate. You’re probably going to get the developers to acknowledge your issue though if you give them a track 

[wowbagger]

Have to agree it feels very susceptible to ground fire now. The Huey seems able to soak up many more hits and keep on truckin' .

The crocodile's scales feel extremely thin at the moment.

[KoN]

Two AT missles to bring down a Huey and the Gazell well thats just a weired DM there . Small Arms is bring down the Hind very easy . However this is due to Sniper Aim-bot ground targets . Can this be adjusted on server side . ?

[Dragon1-1]

Ground targets are definitely too accurate. ZU-23s fire perfect streams of tracers like they were Shilkas with radar-guided guns, including at targets with very high line of sight rates. It gets ridiculous when APC turrets also do that, despite, in most cases, having telescopic sights that are simply not capable of pulling that much lead. Gunsight FOV needs to be considered for AIs, this is probably the biggest thing people don't think of when it comes to AA gunnery.

Sustained fire with rifle caliber MGs will take out a Hind, but IRL, most gunners would be unable to accurately hose down a Hind bearing down on them, including compensating for constantly changing range. In DCS, they get it right every time.

[KoN]

On 2/21/2022 at 10:41 PM, Dragon1-1 said:

Ground targets are definitely too accurate. ZU-23s fire perfect streams of tracers like they were Shilkas with radar-guided guns, including at targets with very high line of sight rates. It gets ridiculous when APC turrets also do that, despite, in most cases, having telescopic sights that are simply not capable of pulling that much lead. Gunsight FOV needs to be considered for AIs, this is probably the biggest thing people don't think of when it comes to AA gunnery.

Sustained fire with rifle caliber MGs will take out a Hind, but IRL, most gunners would be unable to accurately hose down a Hind bearing down on them, including compensating for constantly changing range. In DCS, they get it right every time.

Its Good Aim-Bot .

Needs addressing .

[Gierasimov]

On 12/30/2021 at 1:43 PM, AeriaGloria said:

Sometimes it’s useful in F2 view to see where the hits are

Not for the modern aircraft yet. The actual bullets are not traced, visual damage model is just based on the "health bar" from what I noticed. 

[AeriaGloria]

14 hours ago, Gierasimov said:

Not for the modern aircraft yet. The actual bullets are not traced, visual damage model is just based on the "health bar" from what I noticed. 

Not for aircraft/helicopters. Even the non WWII damage model is absolutely component based. Taking out hydraulics, engines; control surfaces, depending where it hits. Each component may individually have a “life bar,” but only ground objects really have an entirely “health bar” model wher it doesn’t matter where the object is hit. The one exception being armored vehicles where Some areas have toughe armor, and some of the more modern ships that also have a more component based damage model 

[Sapper31]

I have also noticed specifically the wings and jettison/firing circuits are waaay to vulnerable. Like first hit every time and I have hung stores. 

[AeriaGloria]

13 hours ago, Sapper31 said:

I have also noticed specifically the wings and jettison/firing circuits are waaay to vulnerable. Like first hit every time and I have hung stores. 

It used to be only when you saw large holes in the wing. That made more sense to me becuase the firing circuits can’t be that large. But now it’s when only a few bullet holes appear. I think that’s too simplified if the firing circuits are just wires to and from the pylons. I. Order to compensate, I have been trying to snipe targets with rockets a lot less and go in with salvos to make sure I kill stuff with lots of rockets. Better to use up all my rockets to kill a few targets. Then use them carefully and slowly and end up not being able to use a lot of them becuase of wing damage

The Hind will be beautiful when it gets the more high fidelity damage model, but I fear that’s very far away 

[KoN]

Systems always fail i find . Sight system and a like . Too Vulnerable . The Huey Is tougher . Two AT-6 into that thing and still flys .

[AeriaGloria]

12 hours ago, KoN said:

Systems always fail i find . Sight system and a like . Too Vulnerable . The Huey Is tougher . Two AT-6 into that thing and still flys .

Your sight? In what way? Only thing that causes sight issues for me, is when radar altimeter goes, you lose all auto ranging. So need to do manual shooting or manual ranging only 

[NineLine]

Please include tracks of when you feel it is damaged too easily.