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maddogmcewan

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Back in 2005-2007 (that is 17 years ago... ouch) we were developing a theatre for Falcon 4, that covered the war that lasted for over 25 years between the Cuban led FAPA-DAA and the SAAF... We introduced new flyable aircraft (many a firsts in Falcon) e.g.

  • Mirage IIIC and E Variants
  • Mirage IIIRZ and R2Z
  • Mirage F1AZ and CZ
  • Impala MK2 (MB-326KC)
  • Cheetah E and D/2
  • Buccaneer SMk50
  • Canberra
  • yup even an Alouette III, Super Frelon and Puma helicopters
  • and props eg C47, C130B, C160Z, Bosbok
     
  • SU-22/25/27
  • MiG-15/17/21bis/23

The South African Air Force gave us incredible support and access to all aircraft (and in most cases performance data, flight manuals etc) including the Hawk and Gripen and it seems so many years later in would be incredible to "port" this shelved project over to DCS....

I will post some thoughts/pics of the old SAAFOPS and information regarding the war/campaign in Angola and see where it goes

 



 

MaddogIntenseConcentration.jpg

_ad2.bmp saafops_1.bmp saafops_bg3.bmp


Edited by maddogmcewan
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  • 1 month later...

Please don't give up on this, I remember it from Freefalcon days and thought it had so much potential. I recently had a sit down with an ex SAAF Mirage pilot and the accounts of what went on were amazing. I still have a soft spot for the chopper crews as they've published more (a rarity). All in all it would be a fantastic addition!


Edited by cochise
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  • 1 month later...

I assume you guys kept all your old research and satellite imagery? Because that would seriously speed up the development of an actual terrain module. And I think the only way Angola is coming to DCS in our lifetimes is if we actually just built it ourselves. But that would require a license from ED and their terrain tool... And a lot of our lives. I'm down for it though. I work my own hours and am quite quiet over the winter, so I could happily graft away for a significant portion of the year, if this was to move ahead.

No way I could go it alone though. I'm pretty clued up with illustrator and know my way around photoshop, but I have little experience with programming and 3D modeling. I do a tiny bit of LUA scripting for DCS missions and make simple things for my 3D printer, but that's about as far as it goes. Don't ask me to build you a battleship or something... I honestly don't think I'd be good for much besides the more monotonous things like tracing out satellite images, placing objects and making textures etc. I do have a brother who is an experienced programmer and 3D modeler, who also occasionally plays DCS, but he's always "busy" and getting blood out of a stone is easier than getting him to lift a finger. Still, he could prove pretty useful should I get stuck along the way... 

So if anybody else is keen to bring this terrain to reality, and maybe make a little dosh once it's done, lets put a team together and propose it to ED. 'Cause I for one am done waiting! 

 

 

 

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Just now, Ozone1 said:

I assume you guys kept all your old research and satellite imagery? Because that would seriously speed up the development of an actual terrain module. And I think the only way Angola is coming to DCS in our lifetimes is if we actually just built it ourselves. But that would require a license from ED and their terrain tool... And a lot of our lives. I'm down for it though. I work my own hours and am quite quiet over the winter, so I could happily graft away for a significant portion of the year, if this was to move ahead.

No way I could go it alone though. I'm pretty clued up with illustrator and know my way around photoshop, but I have little experience with programming and 3D modeling. I do a tiny bit of LUA scripting for DCS missions and make simple things for my 3D printer, but that's about as far as it goes. Don't ask me to build you a battleship or something... I honestly don't think I'd be good for much besides the more monotonous things like tracing out satellite images, placing objects and making textures etc. I do have a brother who is an experienced programmer and 3D modeler, who also occasionally plays DCS, but he's always "busy" and getting blood out of a stone is easier than getting him to lift a finger. Still, he could prove pretty useful should I get stuck along the way... 

So if anybody else is keen to bring this terrain to reality, and maybe make a little dosh once it's done, lets put a team together and propose it to ED. 'Cause I for one am done waiting! 

 

 

 

Yes! I wholeheartedly agree with this. I sent OP a PM regarding a very related mod I am involved with and possibly getting him or his team involved, I also asked if I could get involved with the plans he has for DCS but he has not read my message yet (sent a week ago so still early). But I see he is very active with other things as well, filming etc. 

I am also willing to contribute my free time, but there's not a lot of it, I can make myself free most weekday evenings and then weekends as well. I am a software developer with mostly Java experience, moderate C++ experience and a bunch of other languages as well. Lua is still a bit new to me, but my bigger learning curve currently is the DCS ecosystem and how things talk to each other. I am currently giving all my free time to the aircraft mod I am involved with so at least I am conquering that learning curve I mentioned.

And to answer your first question, they did, there was a comment made on a YouTube video where OP himself mentioned that he still has all the files and I quote "oh what to do".............

To propose to ED we would have to meet some requirements though, we would need to prove that we are capable, which is difficult because it is like a chicken and egg problem. And with aircraft you have to have declassified official documentation to provide them a way to test and prove that your aircraft performs like the real thing, which is not a problem for at least one of the SAAF aircraft.

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Problem I see with this is terrain making, as Ozone1 said, we must build it ourselves If we want one, but last thing I knew about that is that you need to show them some "buildings" or something like that.

I don't understand anything in russian except Davai Davai!

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3 minutes ago, Stratos said:
Problem I see with this is terrain making, as Ozone1 said, we must build it ourselves If we want one, but last thing I knew about that is that you need to show them some "buildings" or something like that.


Yes that’s also what I was referring to when I said we need to prove that we are capable. Well we can do that at least, static objects are easy simple. I have done one before but I still need to make one good quality one. I am no modeler so I buy my models on TurboSquid etc, but the missions I make them for are not SAAF related.


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Edited by TheEscapist___
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Ahh, so I take it your involved with the Cheetah-C project then...? I've been trying to get the manual for that thing for years now. Been through every avenue I can think of, but it's so far proven to be more elusive than a sasquatch. Anyways, yeah. We would need to prove to ED we're capable. The Cheetah mod might be a good place to start, although that TurboSquid model is going to need a little work. OP obviously has some good experience, although who knows if he'd want to be involved...? I can't show much I'm afraid. I worked as an Illustrator for an infographics firm and I've done a few DCS mods, but not much else really...  

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Ahh, so I take it your involved with the Cheetah-C project then...? I've been trying to get the manual for that thing for years now. Been through every avenue I can think of, but it's so far proven to be more elusive than a sasquatch. Anyways, yeah. We would need to prove to ED we're capable. The Cheetah mod might be a good place to start, although that TurboSquid model is going to need a little work. OP obviously has some good experience, although who knows if he'd want to be involved...? I can't show much I'm afraid. I worked as an Illustrator for an infographics firm and I've done a few DCS mods, but not much else really...  

That one. The aircraft itself is very illusive with its history, but things look promising at this stage in terms of research and specs and limitations and other things, although nothing guaranteed yet.

Yeah that turbosquid model is not quite a Cheetah. I would like for him and Combat360 to get back in the game. And this topic shows there is at least a bit of interest from his side.


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Cool. Well hopefully that pans out. Would love a decent Cheetah!

I'd honestly settle for a Cheetah with a Mirage 2000C cockpit. It's pretty close. You probably already know this, but the C already uses the M2000 stick and throttle. A Rooivalk skinned Apache would be pretty cool too... If we actually had a map for it anyway. 

As to a bit of interest, I've been harping on about Angola for what feels like the beginning of time. Just ask Stratos... And I've seen so many threads over the years about the border war. It's about time something is done about it.

I was in contact with the guy that did the Armscor mod for Arma3. He did some really nice SADF vehicles that could be ported over. Only thing is, I lost contact with him when I deleted my facebook account after my millionth ban for literally nothing. He's in Australia now, but hopefully he can still be reached. 

 

 

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Cool. Well hopefully that pans out. Would love a decent Cheetah!
I'd honestly settle for a Cheetah with a Mirage 2000C cockpit. It's pretty close. You probably already know this, but the C already uses the M2000 stick and throttle. A Rooivalk skinned Apache would be pretty cool too... If we actually had a map for it anyway. 
As to a bit of interest, I've been harping on about Angola for what feels like the beginning of time. Just ask Stratos... And I've seen so many threads over the years about the border war. It's about time something is done about it.
I was in contact with the guy that did the Armscor mod for Arma3. He did some really nice SADF vehicles that could be ported over. Only thing is, I lost contact with him when I deleted my facebook account after my millionth ban for literally nothing. He's in Australia now, but hopefully he can still be reached. 
 
 

I would also love a decent Cheetah, I would prefer for the mod to be a module but ja. The Cheetah C throttle has more buttons on it, like a full HOTAS, the Mirage one looked a bit naked when I last saw it.

Yes we need to do something about it. Dino Cattaneo made an Impala for Prepar3D and is now about to release MB-339 module for DCS with the IFE team that they formed. Mirage F-1 is coming and there are manuals somewhere online for both the AZ and CZ even with the amendments included. MiG-21 is already there, MiG-23 has been started by Razbam if I remember. We need the map more than anything else. I know of someone on Reddit making SANDF things for a game, I can’t remember if it was Arma or something different, might be the same guy you mentioned but we can at least ask and see.


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Yeah, I'd prefer the 326 to the 339. I'll take a pair of 30mil cannons over a back seat driver any day of the week... An SAAF F-1 would also be awesome. Ours had a HMD. But sure, I'm reckon the Israelis modified the throttles before they found their way to us. Suppose, unlike the Mirage the Cheetah had two MFDs, so they had to add some extra buttons.

And you forgot the MiG-15, Mi-8, Mi-24, L-39 and Su-27, which Angola flew/fly. And the SAAF flew the Sabre, Mustang and Spitfire too. Executive Outcomes also operated Su-25's and Mi-24's. Not to mention we have all the Red ground assets already. It makes no sense to me why not one of the dev teams has ever mentioned the Border War. It spanned 3 decades... How has it already been forgotten...?

 

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  • 2 months later...

We have started work on the Cheetah C over here in the link below. I dream of creating what Combat360 - SAAFOPS set out to do but for DCS. The Cheetah C was chosen because someone wanted to make a Cheetah and asked for information, but I was only able to get good information on the C variant, so C it is.

 

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  • 1 year later...

its an old project based on Falcon 4 which I was given the source code to many moons back - but we build the terrain from SRTM data from Luanda Angola down to Windhoek Namibia, built all the relevant ground objects and equipment (even herds of elephants and Kudu buck to simulate wildlife in the area)

there were two campaigns - the actual war 1966 - 1989 including all air assets at the time
then a 2nd campaign which was fictional as if the war continued, the SAAF asked us to include new assets eg Gripen, Hawk etc vs SU27 of FAPA

a/c aircraft included (ugh i hope i remember) *** flyable

Mirage IIICZ  *** flyable
Mirage IIIEZ *** flyable
Mirage IIIR2Z
Mirage D2
Canberra
Buccaneer S50 *** flyable
AM3C Bosbok
C4M Kudu
C47 Dak
Impala Mk2 (MB326KC) *** flyable
Mirage F1CZ  *** flyable
Mirage F1AZ  *** flyable
Cheetah C  *** flyable
Cheetah D2  *** flyable
Hawk  *** flyable
Grippen  *** flyable

C160 Transall
C-150
C130B
Alouette III
Super Frelon
SA-330 Puma
Boeing 707 tanker

Mi-8
Mi-17
Mi-24
Mi-35
Su-22  *** flyable
Su-25
Su-27   *** flyable
Su-30
MiG-17
MiG-23  *** flyable
MiG-21  *** flyable
L-29
L-39
Casa-212
EMB-314
Il-76
An-12
An-26
An-32
An-72


https://combat360.online/groups/saafops-angolan-theater/

 

 

 


Edited by maddogmcewan
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On 4/23/2022 at 6:16 PM, Ozone1 said:

I assume you guys kept all your old research and satellite imagery? Because that would seriously speed up the development of an actual terrain module. And I think the only way Angola is coming to DCS in our lifetimes is if we actually just built it ourselves. But that would require a license from ED and their terrain tool... And a lot of our lives. I'm down for it though. I work my own hours and am quite quiet over the winter, so I could happily graft away for a significant portion of the year, if this was to move ahead.

No way I could go it alone though. I'm pretty clued up with illustrator and know my way around photoshop, but I have little experience with programming and 3D modeling. I do a tiny bit of LUA scripting for DCS missions and make simple things for my 3D printer, but that's about as far as it goes. Don't ask me to build you a battleship or something... I honestly don't think I'd be good for much besides the more monotonous things like tracing out satellite images, placing objects and making textures etc. I do have a brother who is an experienced programmer and 3D modeler, who also occasionally plays DCS, but he's always "busy" and getting blood out of a stone is easier than getting him to lift a finger. Still, he could prove pretty useful should I get stuck along the way... 

So if anybody else is keen to bring this terrain to reality, and maybe make a little dosh once it's done, lets put a team together and propose it to ED. 'Cause I for one am done waiting! 

got most of it still

On 4/23/2022 at 6:16 PM, Ozone1 said:

 

 

 

 

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As much as I would love to see such a mod, is simply a no go, as terrains cannot be created as mods, and we lack several very important planes for the theatre. Maybe we can use North Australia map as stand in as I think the bush terrain can look similar.

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I don't understand anything in russian except Davai Davai!

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