Personal review of my capability's with the Viper

[Rukus]

Hi.   I purchased the F-16 a while back.  I've enjoyed this plane as im a old Falcon 4 player.  When i mean old,  im in my mid 60's.  I started flying sims back in the early 80's.

When i played Falcon 4 for a while,  i got fairly good at managing the aircraft.  My Dogfighting skills were ok.  I could keep up with the AI enemys.

After i purchased the F16 in DCS,  i found that i was really rusty with dogfighting.   After a period of playing,  the old skills seamed to come back.  Now after 2 years away and flying with VR again (Quest 2 now,  used to be a Rift),  seems everything has gone away again.

I struggle to stay with the AI in a turning fight.  Seems the only thing i possibly could keep up with is a Ultralight.

I've lost the energy management, finding the turn circle, and basically anything else to win a fight.

Back early on,  you could feel when to add power,  when to turn,  when to relax g's,  and energy management what just normal everyday thing.   Things just clicked,  felt normal.

Does anyone else feel like this with a fair amount of experience with dogfighting and being away for a fair amount of time.   Just seems as hard as i try,  i just cant get it back lol.

[wilbur81]

Absolutely. Dogfighting (especially in real life, but in this sim too) is a VERY perishable skill. I had a basement remodel happening that had my cockpit all locked up for about 3 months where I didn't play at all. When I got back into it, I thought: "What the HECK did ED do to "my" flight model!?!"  Then, after a couple of hours of aggressive GUNZO, I got 'it' all back. Practice, practice, practice.... And do all of your practice guns only if you want to accelerate your skill sharpening.

[Rukus]

11 minutes ago, wilbur81 said:

Absolutely. Dogfighting (especially in real life, but in this sim too) is a VERY perishable skill. I had a basement remodel happening that had my cockpit all locked up for about 3 months where I didn't play at all. When I got back into it, I thought: "What the HECK did ED do to "my" flight model!?!"  Then, after a couple of hours of aggressive GUNZO, I got 'it' all back. Practice, practice, practice.... And do all of your practice guns only if you want to accelerate your skill sharpening.

yes,  im doing guns only.  I appreciate your response.  Just thinking im just getting too old.  Which is still possible lol

[wilbur81]

10 minutes ago, Rukus said:

 Just thinking im just getting too old.  Which is still possible lol

Nah... you'll get it. 

[PLUTON]

Hi I am like you in my sixties and I can say one thing is that we are not too old but at a certain age when we have lost certain reflexes it takes longer to recover them than at 20 or 30 but They come back for sure, you just have to persevere.
good flight on the viper

[Steel Jaw]

Old Falcon flier as well, had the jet and combat mostly mastered but find much challenge with the DCS Viper, especially aerial refueling.  Mind you most of my time continues to be in the Hornet as I prefer naval aviation…flare to land = squat to pee.

[Rukus]

Well something just clicked.   I setup a headon with mig-21.   for some reason things just started to come back.   I was able to predict power requirements,  finding the turn circle ect.    I thought it was fluke.    Did it again 4 times. 

I then did the same setup but with both of us with IR missles only.   Same Stuff.   I was on him and just toyed before releasing a ir.

I then moved up the ranks of enemy and then to a mig 29.   Same thing.

Then i got smoked a few times.

All these were on rookie enemy but i feel much better.    So strange it just clicked in.

 

Edited January 16, 2022 by Rukus

[Rukus]

well seems i loose it frequently.   I guess it just says i need to practice with the scenarios that i have until it sticks lol.

[Csgo GE oh yeah]

ahhh the old "do i suck now?" struggle  

Feeling that you suddenly (or gradually) suck and are "Losing your skills" is a very common thing. 
It is in Counter strike at least, and i imagine it is in any game. 
There are even 'guides' on youtube on how to overcome this. But what i find works best is this : 

-Try not to obess over it and just accept that there will be periods where you suck and periods that you will be better. 
-Don't over-practice. In fact, taking a day or two off completely is (for me) a much better remedy. 

 

 

 

 

[BuzzU]

You're never too old. I'm 79.

[darkman222]

Welcome to DCS. Everybody. No matter what age youre at.

I grew up with all those simulators. The Janes series, Strike Commander, Falcon 3.0, Falcon 4.0, Falcon BMS. And of course the arcade ones from, for example Novalogic, too. But DCS really taught me dogfighting and energy management.

One thing to mention. The DCS F16 is a lot harder to master at the moment, than the F4 F16. Also the AI in DCS is much harder to beat than in F4.

Even if you feel too old to join a multiplayer server. Take advice from me as a 40 year old sim enthusiast: Do it. There will be a lot of young people around of course. Some also with bad manners and bad language But it is much more fun to fight human players than the sterile AI in DCS. You will soon realize there are some people who are way better than you. They will kill you in the first turn. But then there are also some people learning their aircraft. And you'll realize when they make a mistake and you'll get them.

If you are experienced in dogfighting but just a little rusty, you'll quickly develop a feeling when to engage a fight and when to disengage and reset the fight. Of course thats a question of mentality. Some people just fight until they die Just type in "dogfight" in the MP search. But dont go to the 1v1 slots. Go to the many vs many slots in: guns, missile, bvr . The DCS multiplayer experience is unbeatable fighting again real humans.

Edited January 16, 2022 by darkman222

[DerekSpeare]

5 hours ago, BuzzU said:

You're never too old. I'm 79.

Epic!  Just Epic, man!

[BuzzU]

34 minutes ago, DerekSpeare said:

Epic!  Just Epic, man!

Thanks everybody for the likes and thanks. I try to stay positive. The minute I say i'm too old. I'll be too old. Just ignore your age and keep doing what you enjoy.

 

I still elk hunt alone ay 11,000ft in my Colorado Rockies. I can't quit. I love elk meat and hunting with my old Hawken muzzleloader.

 

Carry on.

[Steel Jaw]

4 hours ago, darkman222 said:

The DCS F16 is a lot harder to master at the moment, than the F4 F16.

 

How so?  Do tell this old F4/BMS flier.

[EFcrazy]

I hope to be still flying when I’m at that age! Good on you!

[Glide]

VR won't let you spin around in your seat like a WWII fighter pilot like TrackIR, so you get an additional element of realism.  BTW, we old Falcon4 pilots don't suck.  The game keeps getting better.

[SCPanda]

Keep in mind F-16's FM is still pretty much work in progress. There're still somethings ED are working on to make the jet perform better and more realistically in BFM. 

[BIGNEWY]

2 hours ago, SCPanda said:

Keep in mind F-16's FM is still pretty much work in progress. There're still somethings ED are working on to make the jet perform better and more realistically in BFM. 

Only remaining now is G-Onset and ITR which will be tweaked in the future. 

[Spartan111sqn]

Exactly, what is g on set?, i am not sure to know what about is.

Thanks 

[BuzzU]

11 minutes ago, Spartan111sqn said:

Exactly, what is g on set?, i am not sure to know what about is.

Thanks 

I believe it means how fast the plane can build up G's.

[Rukus]

Thanks for the replies and support

 

[SCPanda]

19 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

Only remaining now is G-Onset and ITR which will be tweaked in the future. 

Thx BIGNEWY, but in ED's last update to F-16's flight model, the patch notes said this: "Tuning of the AoA/load factor limit for sustained turn rate (Ps) for CAT I. Instantaneous turn rates and accelerated rates are still undergoing adjustment." (source: https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/news/changelog/openbeta/2.7.6.12852/)

As far as I know, ED has not done another flight model update to F-16, so based on what you said, is ED not going to adjust F-16's accelerated rates? 

[BuzzU]

6 hours ago, SCPanda said:

Thx BIGNEWY, but in ED's last update to F-16's flight model, the patch notes said this: "Tuning of the AoA/load factor limit for sustained turn rate (Ps) for CAT I. Instantaneous turn rates and accelerated rates are still undergoing adjustment." (source: https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/news/changelog/openbeta/2.7.6.12852/)

As far as I know, ED has not done another flight model update to F-16, so based on what you said, is ED not going to adjust F-16's accelerated rates? 

G-Onset is how fast a plane can build up G's. In other words it's how fast the plane can accelerate in a turn. That could be the accelerated rates they're talking about.

[Sinclair_76]

On 1/17/2022 at 1:31 PM, Spartan111sqn said:

Exactly, what is g on set?, i am not sure to know what about is.

Thanks 

In physics it's called jerk.

position - velocity - acceleration - jerk - snap - crackle - pop

Edited January 19, 2022 by Sinclair_76

[jaylw314]

22 minutes ago, Sinclair_76 said:

In physics it's called jerk.

position - velocity - acceleration - jerk - snap - crackle - pop

That's more Engineer-ese  Physicist would just call it da/dt.

@Rukus If you've made the transition to VR, you may benefit from an app called VRNecksafer.  I have to admit, I'm unsure how it works with the Quest 2 (AFAIK, it's only for SteamVR), but it lets you set up curves to turn your view more than your head near the limits, since VR FOV is small enough it's tough to check six.