Alt+Enter does not enter full screen; stuck in windowed

[Loukuins]

3 hours ago, fab.13 said:

Not surprised.
The goal of the new windows 10 fullscreen mode  is to give Maximum Framerates as good as ALT-ENTER FSE give to us ( see microsoft blog )
 

Could you do the same test with In-game V-Sync OFF an NV V-Sync ON ?
 

For now, DCS 2.8 has stutters when V-SYNC is turned on on your rig.

We need to find other player that meet this problem or ask to @flappie to help us about this problem.

 

 

Just Force V-Sync OFF in the nvidia control panel and you're good to go

[Boosterdog]

@fab.13

i may have a couple of hours today to help. Please tell me exactly what combinations you want to test. Also how you want me to start the game ( launch play v launch altenter play v tabbing out. 

[fab.13]

The first test is to run dcs 2.8 full stock ( no mod ) in 2D with fullscreen on and v sync on 60hz ( dcs or Nvidia )

Art-j have some stutters when using v-sync 

Second test will be about alt-tab ( Check that dcs is still in fullscreen mode when returning to Game )

[Boosterdog]

@fab.13

Test 1

 

IN GAME  -    Vsync ON

                        Full Screen on

                        NO autoexec fix

NCP                Vsync OFF

 

Mission launches without EFS (windows volume window is visible when altering volume from keyboard).

Game has apparent frame pacing problems and does not run smoothly

Alt- Tab switches focus – no effect on game

Alt-Enter does not work

 

Test 2

 

IN GAME  -    Vsync ON

                        Full Screen on

                        autoexec fix applied

NCP                Vsync – Use application setting

 

Mission launches WITH EFS (windows volume window is NOT visible when altering volume from keyboard).

Game has NO apparent frame pacing problems and runs smoothly

Alt- Tab switches focus –  Tabbing back to game EFS is not enforced (windows volume window is visible when altering volume from keyboard) HOWEVER game continues to run smoothly with little of no frame pacing issues

Alt-Enter after Alt-Tabbing back returns game to FSE ( (windows volume window is visible when altering volume from keyboard).

 

Since the second 2.8 beta patch, I have noticed that the game reliably launches in FSE with the autoexec fix applied. Prior to this patch it required a single Alt-Enter. Moreover, even when alt-tabbing and returning to the game where FSE (in the old sense) is not applied, the game continues to run smoothly (although not quite as smoothly as in FSE when it is pushed graphically perhaps - difficult to tell).

I run no updates on my Win 10 install. Game is stock.

 

Specs in my sig. Track used (AH64 Caucasues) and game settings attached.

Stutters SC.trk

[Art-J]

14 hours ago, fab.13 said:

Could you do the same test with In-game V-Sync OFF an NV V-Sync ON ?

Sure. In-game OFF, NV ON, no autoexec, FS optimisations enabled, result - stutters. Frame time remains jittery even if camera is stationary (didn't use TrackIR, just moved camera with mouse and left it there). What I'm more interested in is - why it happens mainly when looking into the cockpit and not really when looking outside (or when in F2 cam view). 2.8 allegedly brought some improved dynamic lighting of the cockpit, but it clearly doesn't play nice with Nvidia Vsync and "native" DCS Full screen.

That's with Nvidia driver 526.98.

 

[Boosterdog]

Just now, Art-J said:

Sure. In-game OFF, NV ON, no autoexec, FS optimisations enabled, result - stutters. Frame time remains jittery even if camera is stationary (didn't use TrackIR, just moved camera with mouse and left it there). What I'm more interested in is - why it happens mainly when looking into the cockpit and not really when looking outside (or when in F2 cam view). 2.8 allegedly brought some improved dynamic lighting of the cockpit, but it clearly doesn't play nice with Nvidia Vsync and "native" DCS Full screen.

That's with Nvidia driver 526.98.

 

My tests were performed looking outside of the cockpit. The judders are not exclusive to the pit interior. 

[Art-J]

^ Yeah they happen occasionally to me when looking outside as well, but I thought it might be related to various object shadows problems that 2.8 brought and I so far I couldn't specifically narrow them down to any particular scenery feature (trees, buidings, structures). Makes troubleshooting somewhat difficult.

The only 100% reproducible judder scenario on my rig is when more than, say 2/3 of the view is in the cockpit.

[Boosterdog]

1 minute ago, Art-J said:

^ Yeah they happen occasionally to me when looking outside as well, but I thought it might be related to various object shadows problems that 2.8 brought and I so far I couldn't specifically narrow them down to any particular scenery feature (trees, buidings, structures). Makes troubleshooting somewhat difficult.

The only 100% reproducible judder scenario on my rig is when more than, say 2/3 of the view is in the cockpit.

For me its low over heavy forest. Its funny how stuff affects us all differently but perhaps this is more down to our rigs/settingsand some event horizon that throws the load somewhere else at a certain point in each unique case. 

My feeling personally is that certain "loads" have a greater effect than others - my shadows for instance are set to default. If I switch em off I see littlle stutter as clearly the game is breathing easy. Its only when one begins to reach the edge of the envelope (and by that I do not necessarily mean huge drops in FPS but perhaps VRAM or something) that the Alt-Enter bonus boost begins to count.  

[fab.13]

Thanks

The new Windows full screen mode may be not more exclusive ( sound volume is showed ) while giving good performances as FSE ( Microsoft new features , see blog )

I think we can remove the alt-tab topic for now

so we have 2 players that meet the  same problem ( stutter and less smooth ) with the new fullscreen mode combined with v-sync ( 2D screen ) in dcs 2.8 full stock

This last topic should be a new thread in 2D bug section :  « fullscreen + vsync give stutters and not smooth » 

( flappie could help us to check your system )

fortunately you have a work around ( FSE ) to play with DCS but this is not supported by DCS more ever i think

Edited December 3, 2022 by fab.13

[Art-J]

@Boosterdog Yeah, I forgot to mention what shadow settings I use. It's: primary on medium, secondary off and terrain on flat. About the trees, I think I have a good experience with them, even on Normandy and Marianas, despite their rather poor trees optimisation. On the other hand, I use Taz's tree mod for Marianas (which contains some shadow-related tinkering) and my modest shadow settings might make things easier for my 3070. 

[scommander2]

I (2D user) have tested the stable version (2.8.1.34667.2) on my two laptops with the "autoexec" setting for "Alt-Enter", it works perfectly.  Thanks ED for keeping the option. 

[Snowblind]

Tried on my system 2d

 

Nvidia CP Vsync Off

Ingame Vsync ON

Autoexec fix applied

 

no alt enter on the latest OB

 

 

edit: im stupid, i had autoexe not autoexec file

it now works, however im not seeing the same performance boost it used to give when doing it

Edited January 1, 2023 by Snowblind

[Snowblind]

this alt enter fix no longer works on the multithreaded (todays open beta)

[Loukuins]

PLEASE FIX DOESN'T WORK ANYMORE ON THE MT !!!!

[unicus]

Stopped working for me as well with MT (I applied same changes in compability mode to DCS.exe in mt-bin folder). Had to revert to old DCS.exe, I can't play without alt+enter

[medway]

1 hour ago, unicus said:

Stopped working for me as well with MT (I applied same changes in compability mode to DCS.exe in mt-bin folder). Had to revert to old DCS.exe, I can't play without alt+enter

So the normal exe is working for you or do you mean you saved an exe from a previous version? I'm trying the non MT exe and Alt-Enter is not working. I'm getting lots of stutters. I used to be able to run DCS really smooth but something happened.

EDIT it seems it's due to objects being loaded - with nothing going on it's butter smooth so probably nothing to do with alt-enter.

Edited March 10, 2023 by medway

[Loukuins]

Yes using the flip mode false with MT (Witch doesn't work at all), makes the game VERY unstable with some Graphical settings not working and destroying the frame time stability

 

And yes still no proper G-Sync support for a 2023 game, why?!

Edited March 12, 2023 by Loukuins

[Roostyla]

For us with older hardware (intel 6700k) this fix was vital, for my part I had much better frame stability with using this autoexec. It stopped working with MT. I would really appreciate if it can be brought back! I assume a new command line in autoexec would do it? Cheers

[Boosterdog]

@BIGNEWY given the MT branch has effectively reset the clock on this should I raise it the bug section (ED say it isnt a bug and working as intended). It would perhaps keep things neater if stuff stayed here with perhaps a modifed title.  Could I respectfully ask you to raise this the ED once again?

 

Thanks

Edited March 14, 2023 by Boosterdog
awful spelling

[Loukuins]

On 3/13/2023 at 8:53 AM, Boosterdog said:

@BIGNEWY given the MT branch has effectively reset the clock on this should I raise it the bug section (ED say it isnt a bug and working as intended). It would perhaps keep things neater if stuff stayed here with perhaps a modifed title.  Could I respectfully ask you to raise this the ED once again?

 

Thanks

 

Yes please ! This impact FPS and G-Sync !

[silverdevil]

i noticed something today. i ran ST to get the latest version. DCS started in the background (chrome was forefront. i had to click in the DCS windows to make it come forward. possibly because the update dialog is forefront. dunno. then i ran MT and it started forefront and stayed that way. clicking in my other monitor minimized DCS. clicked on icon in taskbar and the DCS came forward again. this seems to be related to the full screen questions. i use GSYNC and getting good performance.

 

Edited March 18, 2023 by silverdevil

[scommander2]

Are we able to the full screen back in MT yet?

[Boosterdog]

12 hours ago, scommander2 said:

Are we able to the full screen back in MT yet?

Not as far as i know. Nothing from ED on the matter. Nothing from @BIGNEWYin this thread (expected and undersatandable given the work around MT in general). 

[Dr Zaius]

Thanks to the dedicated efforts of folks on this forum I've got FS back, while trying to get it working and testing things out I noticed that the FPS differences are rather negligible however the experience really is a lot smoother in FS, I wonder then if this performance issue we're getting is more to do with TrackIR as the 'smoothness' of the sim only really makes itself obvious (to me anyway) when panning around the cockpit, which for whatever reason seems to work better in FS despite the FPS being very similar - I know there's been lots of testing by others and the general consenses is that the closer to TrackIR's 120hz refresh rate the better, for that reason I was restricting my frames to 60hz, with MT I'm able to up that to 120hz which works well but once the FPS drop away from the magic number the smoothness also suffers - are there any non-trackir users out there who prefer FS due to better performance?     

[Loukuins]

On 4/4/2023 at 11:16 PM, Dr Zaius said:

Thanks to the dedicated efforts of folks on this forum I've got FS back, while trying to get it working and testing things out I noticed that the FPS differences are rather negligible however the experience really is a lot smoother in FS, I wonder then if this performance issue we're getting is more to do with TrackIR as the 'smoothness' of the sim only really makes itself obvious (to me anyway) when panning around the cockpit, which for whatever reason seems to work better in FS despite the FPS being very similar - I know there's been lots of testing by others and the general consenses is that the closer to TrackIR's 120hz refresh rate the better, for that reason I was restricting my frames to 60hz, with MT I'm able to up that to 120hz which works well but once the FPS drop away from the magic number the smoothness also suffers - are there any non-trackir users out there who prefer FS due to better performance?     

I have a G-Sync monitor with a 187Hz Delan Clip (using a G-Sync OLED 175Hz monitor) and when Open Track works the way he should I have the smoothest experience I ever had, even more with proper G-Sync implementation if ED put back Exclusive Fullscreen, I also got way smoother FPS by putting higher FPS limit (than the default 180fps) even tho my FPS didn't increased much (but it did and frametimes went down giving way more fps smootheness).
Don't limit your FPS in DCS if you have a high refresh rate monitor and use the highest refresh rate of your tracking method, it will help with panning the camera around.