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Cockpit textures missing mipmaps


Giskvoosk

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As suggested in the title I've noticed the lack of mipmaps in the following cockpit textures which graphic-wise results in jagged edge. Except for UH1_scales_c.dds that has erroneous ones, the rest have no mipmap embedded at all.

affected files:

image.png

affected sectors:

image.png

 

 

stock textures (notice the jagged edge):

Untitled-1.jpg

 

 

affected sectors visualized with magenta overlay:

Untitled-2.jpg

 

 

after my quick fix:

Untitled-3.jpg

 

P.S.  I have no idea if anyone else has had brought up this persistent problem since the files are last modified in 2018. The mipmaps issue should cause people to have trouble reading some stuffs in the cockpit. Apart from the interior, some external skin namely the Hellenic AF ones also lack mipmaps, but to be honest the Greek skins across all modules have such problem more or less. Anyway lets focus on the issue here hope we can address this bug in this decade.


Edited by Giskvoosk
typo
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  • 1 month later...

I'm flying at 2560x1440 and installed a special cockpit mod to get rid of the mipmaps because otherwise you can't read the gauges when sitting back in normal seat position. Are you sure you really want a low res cockpit just to get rid of one or two jagged lines?


Edited by jumphigh
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  • 2 weeks later...
On 4/12/2022 at 12:52 AM, jumphigh said:

I'm flying at 2560x1440 and installed a special cockpit mod to get rid of the mipmaps because otherwise you can't read the gauges when sitting back in normal seat position. Are you sure you really want a low res cockpit just to get rid of one or two jagged lines?

 

I've already modded mine to add full mipmaps as a workaround to get rid of the jagged line artifact. For the reference incockpit-wise I'm using the highest possible graphic setup barring SSAA and the aliasing is beyond mildly annoying when .dds is lacking mipmaps. Dunno what does it have to do with low res cockpit...? Or maybe .dds textures are rendered differently on other settings


Edited by Giskvoosk
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2 hours ago, Giskvoosk said:

Dunno what does it have to do with low res cockpit...?

A mipmap is a downscaled texture. Different levels of scaling are used for different view distances because with the full scale texture many texels will collapse which might lead to undesired view effects.

2 hours ago, Giskvoosk said:

I'm using the highest possible graphic setup barring SSAA and the aliasing is beyond mildly annoying when .dds is lacking mipmaps.

And without AA – like I'm doing – the mipmap levels trigger to early and you can't tread the gauges from normal seat position. So I decided to go without AA and with full scale cockpit textures only. There are some jagged edges but the gauges remain readable.

2 hours ago, Giskvoosk said:

I've already modded mine to add full mipmaps as a workaround to get rid of the jagged line artifact.

But ED's standard cockpit has several levels of mipmaps!? So what's the point of this mod?

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3 hours ago, jumphigh said:

But ED's standard cockpit has several levels of mipmaps!? So what's the point of this mod?

Just read the main post. Certain cockpit textures are not embedded with mipmaps. And I've highlighted the sectors that are affected.

3 hours ago, jumphigh said:

A mipmap is a downscaled texture. Different levels of scaling are used for different view distances because with the full scale texture many texels will collapse which might lead to undesired view effects.

Yeah I'm aware of its definition, but mipmaps are really needed in DCS.

It's not that I'm nitpicking or something, you take a look. Screenshots are taken in Modelviewer, unscaled. MSAA set to x4.

 

Exhibit A:

Notice the altimeter windows, and the labels, and the markers on heading/course adjustment knobs. When leaning back in the seat there're indeed some undesired view effects you talked about.

The bottom ones are from my fixes.

unknown.png

 

Exhibit B:

Not huey-related but just to demonstrate what artifact could be caused by lack of mipmaps in the DCS.

Take the example of a stock F-16 livery, 152nd_Fighter_Squadron. The majority part of the textures has no mipmaps at all. 

The aliasing artifact is quite distinctive.

unknown.png


Edited by Giskvoosk
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Oddly enough I have been using this cockpit mod for years now, which claims to have removed the mipmaps:
https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/2893155/

It severely improves readability in VR 🙂

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28 minutes ago, Raven (Elysian Angel) said:

Oddly enough I have been using this cockpit mod for years now, which claims to have removed the mipmaps:
https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/2893155/

It severely improves readability in VR 🙂

Upon removal of mipmaps, the base color has also been tuned to a higher contrast, which could be attributed to improved readability. Two variable here, can't tell which one is the key factor unless we set a control group.

In terms of aliasing artifact, no offence to the author, it's been made worse.

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21 hours ago, Raven (Elysian Angel) said:

Oddly enough I have been using this cockpit mod for years now, which claims to have removed the mipmaps:
https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/2893155/

I'm using it in 2D too! I'm playing at 2560x1440 without any antialiasing modes. With mipmaps gauges become unreadable, the modded cockpit can be read better. I don't give a dime on jagged lines or unwanted highlights.

 

On 4/21/2022 at 5:40 PM, Giskvoosk said:

Exhibit A:

Notice the altimeter windows, and the labels, and the markers on heading/course adjustment knobs. When leaning back in the seat there're indeed some undesired view effects you talked about.

Sorry, but your solution has it's own faults! Some areas are better, some are worse than stock/without mipmaps. Have a look at the labels e.g. "High" or "Beacon Marker". For me stock looks better because it's readable and not blurred due to mipmap downscaling. As I told you I prefer readability over prevention of every unwanted artefact.

 

On 4/21/2022 at 5:40 PM, Giskvoosk said:

Exhibit B:

Not huey-related but just to demonstrate what artifact could be caused by lack of mipmaps in the DCS.

Take the example of a stock F-16 livery, 152nd_Fighter_Squadron. The majority part of the textures has no mipmaps at all. 

The aliasing artifact is quite distinctive.

And again: I don't see disturbing artefacts on stock. Please tell me: With mipmaps added what's looking really better now? Maybe if you look at still images with a spyglass... but in the sim?

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On 4/22/2022 at 6:58 PM, jumphigh said:

And again: I don't see disturbing artefacts on stock. Please tell me: With mipmaps added what's looking really better now? Maybe if you look at still images with a spyglass... but in the sim?

Zero anti-aliasing setups do attenuate the problem but its not solved, both cases significant enough to tell still.

I invite you to take another look at the f-16 livery again, at 100% zoom. if you still insist there's no profound problem with the stock one, I'd thank you for sharing your opinion then.

 


Edited by Giskvoosk
typo
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