OpenXR Guide - Deprecated - This time for real (▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿)

[Baldrick33]

19 minutes ago, TED said:

@nikoelI downloaded the latest beta and all works great but I can't seem to access kr find the fixes foveated rendering options. Any tips or ideas? 

Have you enabled experimental settings, I am not sure if this is needed but I did it anyway!

[Ready]

2 hours ago, Ollie said:

You need to have WMRP off. Start DCS and the WMRP will load automatically - no error message. Always close down WMRP before starting DCS.

 

Getting the same error message. WMRP is off. OpenXR Demo is working fine. 

[nikoel]

34 minutes ago, TED said:

@nikoelI downloaded the latest beta and all works great but I can't seem to access kr find the fixes foveated rendering options. Any tips or ideas? 

My friend let me guess. You are running a 6900XT (or something the like)

AMD has the integration for DX12 FFR only. This means we are second class citizens when it comes to FFR integration for DCS as it's DX9 that parades as DX11. With that said, I am running 45FPS constant in Syria inside the Apache now so it's not needed. We are officially CPU limited. It won't help us, neither will FSR

Edited March 27, 2022 by nikoel

[TED]

25 minutes ago, nikoel said:

My friend let me guess. You are running a 6900XT (or something the like)

AMD has the integration for DX12 FFR only. This means we are second class citizens when it comes to FFR integration for DCS as it's DX9 that parades as DX11. With that said, I am running 45FPS constant in Syria inside the Apache now so it's not needed. We are officially CPU limited. It won't help us, neither will FSR

 

Ahhh of course. Yep. 

I don't need it anyway but was just curious. Same for me, last night I was online Syria server with 23 other players, mostly apaches and was getting 45fps and smooth. This was unthinkable before for me. 

And yes the cpu is definitely the limit. I still see occasional stutters as its trying to load AI. U can notice by just looking at ai and watch fps take a little dip. 

Incifently I did reduce custom resolution in openxr to 80% with almost no degradation in image but keeps fps a bit steadier. 

[Col. Kernel]

41 minutes ago, Ready said:

Getting the same error message. WMRP is off. OpenXR Demo is working fine. 

I had the error code -13 quite consistently a few days back. It was fixed on my end by clicking "search for extra files after repair" in the DCS Updater and repairing once more. Turned out I had some old reshade .dlls inside the DCS main folder. After deleting those files, OpenXR has worked for me.

[Ready]

49 minutes ago, Col. Kernel said:

I had the error code -13 quite consistently a few days back. It was fixed on my end by clicking "search for extra files after repair" in the DCS Updater and repairing once more. Turned out I had some old reshade .dlls inside the DCS main folder. After deleting those files, OpenXR has worked for me.

Thanks, worked!!

[Topo]

2 hours ago, TED said:

I downloaded the latest beta and all works great but I can't seem to access kr find the fixes foveated rendering options. Any tips or ideas? 

Same question; is fixes foveated rendering available on AMD cards? (RX6900XT here)

 

sorry, already answered some post ago...

Edited March 27, 2022 by Topo

[Ready]

55 minutes ago, Ready said:

Thanks, worked!!

No it didn't. It was still sneakily opening SteamVR.. I just figured out that OpenVR capture for OBS recording also still needs SteamVR.. No alternative yet I guess. Will wait with the switching..

[dburne]

For something folks tell me is not a Mod, this sure seems to create a lot of issues from reading this thread. I am tempted but I also so enjoy the many hours of completely trouble free flying from my install. I so wish DCS would look at adding native Open XR support. Works fantastic in MSFS 2020.

[Baldrick33]

16 minutes ago, dburne said:

For something folks tell me is not a Mod, this sure seems to create a lot of issues from reading this thread. I am tempted but I also so enjoy the many hours of completely trouble free flying from my install. I so wish DCS would look at adding native Open XR support. Works fantastic in MSFS 2020.

I was rather sceptical as my initial try was disappointing but having just done a back to back test having got it working right the difference is significant enough for me to stick with OpenXR.

Thanks to those on this thread the legwork of getting it installed is largely done. Some aspects seems a little bizarre like switching the OpenXR runtime to SteamVR and back again to fix reprojection but a lot of knowledge has been gained in a short time. having just done the back to back test switching between OpenXR and SteamVR is a simple and very quick process without touching DCS settings other than replacing a couple of files.

I would say it is a pretty safe thing to try with little risk of messing up your installation.

Edited March 27, 2022 by Baldrick33

[edmuss]

5 minutes ago, dburne said:

For something folks tell me is not a Mod, this sure seems to create a lot of issues from reading this thread. I am tempted but I also so enjoy the many hours of completely trouble free flying from my install. I so wish DCS would look at adding native Open XR support. Works fantastic in MSFS 2020.

I don't see how you can call it anything other than a mod? It MODifies the openvr runtime DLL to translate directly to openxr.

I think the issues that people have mostly been facing are largely due to not having a clean foundation to start with. A loose DLL here or there and it's all broken, the devs then have to spend precious development time trying to fix a non issue.

I'm sure that native openxr will arrive as and when vulkan does, both are products of the khronos group and should interoperate nicely. Additionally I believe that all of the vr vendors (valve/meta/microsoft/varjo) have signed up to use openxr.

If you're system configuration is clean and well optimized, DCS is thoroughly cleaned and you follow the instructions then it should all be good. You have to consider that it's not apples for apples and what you did before might not be the best for openxr. It's going to take time to configure, most of us have been tweaking, testing and measuring almost constantly for the last week.

Also it is a work in progress, it's not 100% perfect 100% of the time but it's pretty damn good from my end.

If you're concerned about breaking your DCS installation, create a copy of it to test in another location and install open composite there

[Sr.]

32 minutes ago, Baldrick33 said:

I was rather sceptical as my initial try was disappointing but having just done a back to back test having got it working right the difference is significant enough for me to stick with OpenXR.

Thanks to those on this thread the legwork of getting it installed is largely done. Some aspects seems a little bizarre like switching the OpenXR runtime to SteamVR and back again to fix reprojection but a lot of knowledge has been gained in a short time. having just done the back to back test switching between OpenXR and SteamVR is a simple and very quick process without touching DCS settings other than replacing a couple of files.

I would say it is a pretty safe thing to try with little risk of messing up your installation.

 

Yep, I stumbled into that yesterday evening too. I switched back to SVR just to do some comparisons. And when I switched back to play with numbers dinner more I noticed first the external bubbly effect around the cockpit in f2 view was gone. And I had much, much less jitter when rolling, and zero while panning my view inside.

 

I was afraid to close it thinking it might revert back.

Edited March 27, 2022 by Sr.

[Pikey]

it's literally an OVGME double click on/off once the OpenXR dev tools are installed. It backs out and in perfectly. I also tested DCS repair, it removes to the original also and takes less than 45 seconds to do one on NVMe. Simplest thing to add, but obvbiously you have to readd it each DCS update.
Classic gotchas are running SteamVR, or a repair afterinstalling. Will cause a Black screen. That's it. I still don't understand the benefit yet, in the HMD i'm not seeing the difference. I wonder if the placebo is caused by the DCS repair?

[Sr.]

I'm still trying to figure how using med textures and low terrain yield just as nice visual cockpit as high/high... I guess that's the magic of up scaling?

 

I hope @speed-of-heat is out there crunching numbers. Wish fpsVR would make an oxr version.

Edited March 27, 2022 by Sr.

[Pikey]

4 minutes ago, Sr. said:

I'm still trying to figure how using med textures and low terrain yield just as nice visual cockpit as high/high... I guess that's the magic of up scaling?

 

I hope @speed-of-heat is out there crunching numbers. Wish fpsVR would make an oxr version.

 

Can you see anything in the mirror or is this all derived from in headset comparisons? I don't see the difference. What is actually changing? To be precise I see the same thing but with the OpenXR I get up to 30 frames less than with SteamVR and I can literally see the stutter in the mirror. I don't understand how I seem to be th eonly person who gets worse performance?

[nikoel]

5 minutes ago, Pikey said:

it's literally an OVGME double click on/off once the OpenXR dev tools are installed. It backs out and in perfectly. I also tested DCS repair, it removes to the original also and takes less than 45 seconds to do one on NVMe. Simplest thing to add, but obvbiously you have to readd it each DCS update.
Classic gotchas are running SteamVR, or a repair afterinstalling. Will cause a Black screen. That's it. I still don't understand the benefit yet, in the HMD i'm not seeing the difference. I wonder if the placebo is caused by the DCS repair?

Reminds me of a joke I once heard. Goes something like this:

Wife calls her husband and says, “Be careful driving home. Some idiot on is on the news! He is driving the wrong direction on the freeway.”
Husband frantically replies, “No! It’s not just one guy going the wrong direction! There’s hundreds of them!”
 

[edmuss]

8 minutes ago, Pikey said:

Can you see anything in the mirror or is this all derived from in headset comparisons? I don't see the difference. What is actually changing? To be precise I see the same thing but with the OpenXR I get up to 30 frames less than with SteamVR and I can literally see the stutter in the mirror. I don't understand how I seem to be th eonly person who gets worse performance?

Have you tested with the settings turned right up? You benchmarked it on the vr preset didn't you?

Could it be that it's CPU bound and the GPU is just waiting?

I can't explain the losses you've recorded when compared to steamvr.

[Baldrick33]

22 minutes ago, Pikey said:

That's it. I still don't understand the benefit yet, in the HMD i'm not seeing the difference. I wonder if the placebo is caused by the DCS repair?

As mentioned I just did a back to back test. Reverted to SteamVR, ran the Apache runway start instant action. Reinstalled OpenXR and did the same mission. The Apache is quite demanding on my system and with SteamVR running I couldn't get 45fps taking off so it stuttered. It didn't look great either. With OpenXR I got 30fps (reprojection running) and it was super smooth and it looked better in terms of image quality (My Reverb G1 is running a higher resolution by default compared with Steam VR) plus the colours look better. The downside was looking through the blades there are some reprojection issues (nothing like the jelly mould issues before the reprojection fix). Overall though it was a much better experience.

Before starting this I thought 30fps would be a disaster but now I am quite happy with it.

Doing all this somehow magically fixed MSFS performance which has always been rubbish with OpenXR. I guess I must have had some legacy issue with my OpenXR install (I had an early developers version which was reporting the latest runtime.) and must have updated something.

[speed-of-heat]

40 minutes ago, Sr. said:

I'm still trying to figure how using med textures and low terrain yield just as nice visual cockpit as high/high... I guess that's the magic of up scaling?

 

I hope @speed-of-heat is out there crunching numbers. Wish fpsVR would make an oxr version.

 

sorry Guys, work is meaning im either working or playing at the moment, I havent even tried this mod yet.

[javelina1]

23 minutes ago, Baldrick33 said:

As mentioned I just did a back to back test. Reverted to SteamVR, ran the Apache runway start instant action. Reinstalled OpenXR and did the same mission. The Apache is quite demanding on my system and with SteamVR running I couldn't get 45fps taking off so it stuttered. It didn't look great either. With OpenXR I got 30fps (reprojection running) and it was super smooth and it looked better in terms of image quality (My Reverb G1 is running a higher resolution by default compared with Steam VR) plus the colours look better. The downside was looking through the blades there are some reprojection issues (nothing like the jelly mould issues before the reprojection fix). Overall though it was a much better experience.

Before starting this I thought 30fps would be a disaster but now I am quite happy with it.

Doing all this somehow magically fixed MSFS performance which has always been rubbish with OpenXR. I guess I must have had some legacy issue with my OpenXR install (I had an early developers version which was reporting the latest runtime.) and must have updated something.

exactly buddy.  as noted prior in the thread, 30fps is the new 45, with the Toolkit!  Solid and beautiful.

[winghunter]

I wonder why framerates get so much worse on my system. Once openXR hits low 20 it doesnt seem want to crawl back up, while steamVR will go happily back up to 45. I dont have the framerates locked in OXR tools.

Edited March 27, 2022 by winghunter

[Sr.]

1 hour ago, Pikey said:

Can you see anything in the mirror or is this all derived from in headset comparisons? I don't see the difference. What is actually changing? To be precise I see the same thing but with the OpenXR I get up to 30 frames less than with SteamVR and I can literally see the stutter in the mirror. I don't understand how I seem to be th eonly person who gets worse performance?

I'll check again, but I believe the mirror looks pretty stunning too.

Try starting with your DCS graphics settings using the "VR" tab, then set the Render slider under OXR Tools to 80 then adjust from there.

I have also compared FSR to NIS in the toolkit UI and prefer NIS.

Make sure you're not using the Mixed Reality Portal installed under Steam, in fact I'd uninstall it. I am also using the "Launch" button inside the Radeon Software, though I'm not sure if that matters.

[exil]

3 minutes ago, winghunter said:

I wonder why framerates get so much worse on my system. Once openXR hits low 20 it doesnt seem want to crawl back up, while steamVR will go happily back up to 45. I dont have the framerates locked in OXR tools.

 

On which aircraft did you try it? Because I have the same issue on the apache. All other aircraft are working flawless. 

[winghunter]

4 minutes ago, exil said:

On which aircraft did you try it? Because I have the same issue on the apache. All other aircraft are working flawless. 

Tomcat on a busy carrier. I have foveated rendering enabled though, maybe thats the bug. Will try without.

Edited March 27, 2022 by winghunter

[edmuss]

9 minutes ago, winghunter said:

I wonder why framerates get so much worse on my system. Once openXR hits low 20 it doesnt seem want to crawl back up, while steamVR will go happily back up to 45. I dont have the framerates locked in OXR tools.

 

I've seen similar as well when reprojection is turned on, I've had it locked down to 30fps even frametimes have been 18ms (55fps). It would be worth raising that one with the devs on discord.