OpenXR Guide - Deprecated - This time for real (▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿)

[chichowalker]

If you look on the second tab of the OXRDT it will list the current resolution of the headset

It's true. Thanks

Enviado desde mi SM-G981B mediante Tapatalk

[loiphin]

I TOO HAVE DECIDED, I am never going back....SteamVR is dead in DCS. Long live Open XR!

Its just too god damn amazing! I am running a 9900K (OC to 5GHZ) , Radeon overclocked 6900XT (I let the software do it) , Reverb G2,  150% custom resolution, no MSAA (not really needed).

AH-64D, F/A-18 and A-10C are just incredible. On Caucasus map I am getting 50-60FPS most of the time in each module. (Main menu, Instant Action , <module>, On the Ramp) 

 

Hands down the best single mod I have ever made to DCS in my 10 years of DCS. I just sit there on the runway and look at the cockpit in awe. Thank you to all involved for the amazing work.

 

Edited April 4, 2022 by loiphin

[DeltaMike]

8 hours ago, Dogmanbird said:

Great results here in single player mode with OXRCACC (with and without OXRTK)

...but multiplayer mode is hit and miss, with the fps dropping drastically after a few seconds to a couple of minutes into flight, and also with f10 map use in MP. Sometimes it picks up again, but once it drops its pretty much over till exiting the server where it will generally reset itself. Even the DCS menus become jittery/juddery once it happens till exiting server.

I don't experience this with SVR (with MR on or off) in multiplayer. It seems to be linked to openxr somewhere.

Keep in mind most of your graphics settings affect CPU at least as much as GPU.

On an empty Caucasus map, OXR tempts you to dial it up. Vis range!  Shadows!  Lions and tigers and bears!  Then you gag as soon as you get into MP. 

Gotta turn right back around and dial that stuff back down again.  Start with vis range, medium should be plenty.  Trees to match. Bye bye grass and shadows and clouds.  About the only thing you won't have to change is resolution, MSAA and maybe AF.  

One way of looking at it is, OXR allows you make more pixels.  How you use em is up to you.  

 

[nikoel]

21 minutes ago, DeltaMike said:

Keep in mind most of your graphics settings affect CPU at least as much as GPU.

On an empty Caucasus map, OXR tempts you to dial it up. Vis range!  Shadows!  Lions and tigers and bears!  Then you gag as soon as you get into MP. 

Gotta turn right back around and dial that stuff back down again.  Start with vis range, medium should be plenty.  Trees to match. Bye bye grass and shadows and clouds.  About the only thing you won't have to change is resolution, MSAA and maybe AF.  

One way of looking at it is, OXR allows you make more pixels.  How you use em is up to you.  

 

This 100%

DCS is still DCS. Multiplayer complaints are for the lack of CPU utilisation which I highlighted a few times. Even Wags during an interview not too long ago has said that he expects much more performance uplift from multi threading implementations than from Vulcan. Man got a point. I can not name an other game which is CPU limited after I render over 7K combined resolution

So you installed Open XR, but nothing has changed, you still only have a couple of threads which are now supersaturated driving your eye candy. This is because you can actually take advantage of the connection between DCS and your headset. Now you gotta slog multiplayer shenanigans on top. Not an ideal metaphor, but if this is not making sense - Before with SteamVR you had a bottleneck which "helped" the multiplayer performance in the same way a closing of a few lanes of the motorway "helps" the merging traffic flow after the roadworks. Now that the roadworks is gone, for people joining the traffic flow downstream it has gotten more difficult

Edited April 4, 2022 by nikoel

[Nightstorm]

3 hours ago, nikoel said:

Yes*

As long as your overall steam settings were at 100% as well. Otherwise you're applying multiplications on top of multiplications
Eg. Default Steam setting 50%, per app setting of 200% = 100%

OpenXR gives you the final output in the second tab of OpenXR Tools

 

Question for clarification.  I'm running a G2 and the default resolution is 2160x2160 per eye.  In steam VR my settings were as close to native resolution as I could get.  So, based on that, when the custom render scale is set at 100% are we getting 2160x2160?  And is it a linear change from there?

I.E. custom render scale at 60% would be 1296 x 1296 per eye?

 

Thanks,

 

Based on a setting of 100% I see this on the second tab:

 

 

So, it is in fact upscaled to 3172x3096.

Edited April 4, 2022 by Nightstorm

[Eaglewings]

This thread is a very long one so a bit of a task searching for answer to this question.
Pardon my asking asking if it has been dealt with before.


Does openXR have a medium where I can monitor framerate, frame time and such like fsvr in steamvr?
I would like to know how my hardware is performing.

[Nightstorm]

Just now, Eaglewings said:

This thread is a very long one so a bit of a task searching for answer to this question.
Pardon my asking asking if it has been dealt with before.


Does openXR have a medium where I can monitor framerate, frame time and such like fsvr in steamvr?
I would like to know how my hardware is performing.

Yes, the toolkit.  It doesn't export but it can show you data on screen in real time.

[edmuss]

5 minutes ago, Nightstorm said:

Question for clarification.  I'm running a G2 and the default resolution is 2160x2160 per eye.  In steam VR my settings were as close to native resolution as I could get.  So, based on that, when the custom render scale is set at 100% are we getting 2160x2160?  And is it a linear change from there?

I.E. custom render scale at 60% would be 1296 x 1296 per eye?

 

Thanks,

The display resolution of the panels is 2160x2160 but in order to account for distortions related to having to focus for the lenses SVR will render at 3100x3100 (or there abouts).  60% render resolution on a G2 is about 2400x2400.

OXR uses the same distortion allowances as SVR so that 100% is 3100x3100.

edit: the second tab of the OXRDT will show you the current resolution that the headset is rendering at.

Edited April 4, 2022 by edmuss

[Nightstorm]

Just now, edmuss said:

The display resolution of the panels is 2160x2160 but in order to account for distortions related to having to focus for the lenses SVR will render at 3100x3100 (or there abouts).  60% render resolution on a G2 is about 2400x2400.

OXR uses the same distortion allowances as SVR so that 100% is 3100x3100.

Thank you.

[Eaglewings]

Yes, the toolkit.  It doesn't export but it can show you data on screen in real time.

Okay thanks. I will check the toolkit out.

[KONGMAN]

On 4/3/2022 at 4:03 PM, KONGMAN said:

i did it and now it starts dcs without steamvr but dcs turn black screen and dont get any picture in vr

 

I delete dcs, make new clean install and now works perfect (for now).

i think that reshade made some problems when i copy my save game to new installation.

thx all for advice

[Gripen 4-1]

I am not 100% with you guys that shimmering is gone and sharpness is better!

First yes I thought WOW sharp as crystal and no shimmer but low FPS.

After a few tests I could figure out why the picture was crisp as glass with no shimmering:

I used 100% resolution for my G2 in OpenXR, but that's not the correct value for the G2! I have to set it to 50% to get the native resolution. With that the FPS went up, but shimmering came back. Look at my pictures.

 

with 100% I am pushing a resolution of 3164x3088 which is way higher than the G2's native resolution. So no wonder why it looks crisp as glass!

 

 

Edited April 4, 2022 by Gripen 4-1

[Nightstorm]

6 minutes ago, Gripen 4-1 said:

I am not 100% with you guys that shimmering is gone and sharpness is better!

First yes I thought WOW sharp as crystal and no shimmer but low FPS.

After a few tests I could figure out why the picture was crisp as glass with no shimmering:

I used 100% resolution for my G2 in OpenXR, but that's not the correct value for the G2! I have to set it to 50% to get the native resolution. With that the FPS went up, but shimmering came back. Look at my pictures.

 

with 100% I am pushing a resolution of 3164x3088 which is way higher than the G2's native resolution. So no wonder why it looks crisp as glass!

 

I was asking about something similar.  See the reason a few posts up.

https://forum.dcs.world/topic/295123-update-14-v063-openxr-quickstart-guide-for-g2-g1-and-other-headsets/?do=findComment&comment=4938103

 

For my system I found having it set at 75% which is roughly 2700x2700 is a nice balance.  Motion Reprojection off and decent FPS and some stutters but not terrible.  Ironically, it appears more fluid to me at 75% then it does at 50% and the shimmering is much improved.

Edited April 4, 2022 by Nightstorm

[lax22]

5 hours ago, loiphin said:

Its just too god damn amazing! I am running a 9900K (OC to 5GHZ) , Radeon overclocked 6900XT (I let the software do it) , Reverb G2,  150% custom resolution, no MSAA (not really needed).

 

I saw another user say the same thing about not needing MSAA if resolution is set to 150%.

I tried this myself, but for me the shimmering with this setting is far more noticeable than with 100% + 4x MSAA

It’s interesting that people with very similar hardware get different results.

Anyway, the important thing is that OpenXR is a big improvement over SVR and once OpenXR will improve MR it will be even more amazing!

[nikoel]

38 minutes ago, Gripen 4-1 said:

I am not 100% with you guys that shimmering is gone and sharpness is better!

First yes I thought WOW sharp as crystal and no shimmer but low FPS.

After a few tests I could figure out why the picture was crisp as glass with no shimmering:

I used 100% resolution for my G2 in OpenXR, but that's not the correct value for the G2! I have to set it to 50% to get the native resolution. With that the FPS went up, but shimmering came back. Look at my pictures.

 

with 100% I am pushing a resolution of 3164x3088 which is way higher than the G2's native resolution. So no wonder why it looks crisp as glass!

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=tgWg3S4pR1U

This is a good resource. A person who came to the same conclusion and made a video to correct this. He gets it right in the end

The TL/DR version was pointed a few comments above yours

Edited April 4, 2022 by nikoel

[edmuss]

26 minutes ago, Gripen 4-1 said:

I am not 100% with you guys that shimmering is gone and sharpness is better!

First yes I thought WOW sharp as crystal and no shimmer but low FPS.

After a few tests I could figure out why the picture was crisp as glass with no shimmering:

I used 100% resolution for my G2 in OpenXR, but that's not the correct value for the G2! I have to set it to 50% to get the native resolution. With that the FPS went up, but shimmering came back. Look at my pictures.

 

with 100% I am pushing a resolution of 3164x3088 which is way higher than the G2's native resolution. So no wonder why it looks crisp as glass!

 

 

As above, native display resolution for the G2 is 2160x2160 per eye, but render resolution is deemed to be much higher, this has always been the case with SVR and has been followed through with OXR.

[Sr.]

22 minutes ago, lax22 said:

I saw another user say the same thing about not needing MSAA if resolution is set to 150%.

I tried this myself, but for me the shimmering with this setting is far more noticeable than with 100% + 4x MSAA

It’s interesting that people with very similar hardware get different results.

Anyway, the important thing is that OpenXR is a big improvement over SVR and once OpenXR will improve MR it will be even more amazing!

I'm in the same camp... might as well get on board now because this is where we are heading.

[nikoel]

1 hour ago, lax22 said:

I saw another user say the same thing about not needing MSAA if resolution is set to 150%.

I tried this myself, but for me the shimmering with this setting is far more noticeable than with 100% + 4x MSAA

It’s interesting that people with very similar hardware get different results.

Anyway, the important thing is that OpenXR is a big improvement over SVR and once OpenXR will improve MR it will be even more amazing!

I would rate MSAA somewhere between drinking orange juice after brushing your teeth and enabling Reprojection

One undeniable fact of life however, is that It serves a purpose. But then again at what cost? Well the cost turns out to be over 50% of additional resolution, which at 6K+ is absolute bonkers. It additionally gives a blurrier image. So people are running a x4 blur filter over their images, to then try to sharpen it again via filters and mods. Each step taking more resources

Many are trying to derive ways to reduce shimmer without the massive performance hit and are coming up with ways to do so

None of them can touch MSAA in the shimmer reduction - but going from 100 to 150% still makes it better! - it's something we need to bear with until a better implementation comes along
The other thing to keep in mind is that the guy running 150% has a significantly more detailed and sharper image than anyone with MSAA smear

So what do you get? Well, guys with 1080ti cards who have accepted shimmer and a 10% reduction of resolution are now within a stone throw away from 3090's running MSAAx4. Proving that even I can outrun Usain Bolt if he is tied to a ball and chain

An other thing to keep in mind is that OpenXR at least in my case has reduced shimmer significantly even with MSAA off (compared to the same settings in SVR)

I am hoping FSR can be fixed and I can run my 200% resolution with 0.75 FSR to almost equal MSAAx4 SVR

For the record I am running MSAAx2 (but this is because even after dialing up settings, I still had a heap of overhead left - so, I decided, why not?)

 

Edited April 4, 2022 by nikoel

[winghunter]

The clarity improvement I thought I had with openXR also came from 100% render scale while in SteamVR i had 80% configured. So it seemed like an improvement at first.

Buth when both are at 100% I dont see a visual difference tbh. The tracking is still faster with openXR though, less latency.

Edited April 4, 2022 by winghunter

[dburne]

Just now, winghunter said:

The clarity improvement I thought I had with openXR also came from 100% SS while in SteamVR i had 80%

When both are at 100% I dont see a visual difference tbh. The tracking is still faster with openXR though, less latency.

I just switched to Open XR with my Aero and so far really I do not see any difference at all.

[Marco Schaap]

5 hours ago, nikoel said:

This 100%

DCS is still DCS. Multiplayer complaints are for the lack of CPU utilisation which I highlighted a few times. Even Wags during an interview not too long ago has said that he expects much more performance uplift from multi threading implementations than from Vulcan. Man got a point. I can not name an other game which is CPU limited after I render over 7K combined resolution

So you installed Open XR, but nothing has changed, you still only have a couple of threads which are now supersaturated driving your eye candy. This is because you can actually take advantage of the connection between DCS and your headset. Now you gotta slog multiplayer shenanigans on top. Not an ideal metaphor, but if this is not making sense - Before with SteamVR you had a bottleneck which "helped" the multiplayer performance in the same way a closing of a few lanes of the motorway "helps" the merging traffic flow after the roadworks. Now that the roadworks is gone, for people joining the traffic flow downstream it has gotten more difficult

"I can not name an other game which is CPU limited after I render over 7K combined resolution"

 

Try Assetto Corsa Competizione in VR. And it's not even completely single threaded. It utilizes a few threads for different engine components.

[Gripen 4-1]

1 hour ago, dburne said:

I just switched to Open XR with my Aero and so far really I do not see any difference at all.

I tend to say the same. If you compare SVR and Open XR at the same render soloution I can't tell you if there is a big difference.

Tested SVR with DCS stable and Open XR with the open Beta on the same settings. Renderresolution for both was 75%, both had nearly the same shimmering.

Maybe Open XR gives you some FPS plus, but at all, I don't know, for me it's not the reinvetion of the wheel.

You gain some pros, but also get some cons.

 

100% Rendersolution looks great, but for that I have to wait until RTX4000 or Radeon 7000 and multicore support.

Edited April 4, 2022 by Gripen 4-1

[edmuss]

My peak FPS OXR to SVR is identical setting for setting, the difference is SVR is jumping all over the place with 3-5ms spikes constantly.

Additionally the image clarity of OXR is higher so you don't need to run the same resolution to achieve the same quality.

OXR also aliases much less for me at lower resolutions so not so much requirement for MSAA or running super high resolution.

[Nightstorm]

From what I'm seeing, I've got similar performance now with some settings a bit higher than I had in SVR.  And the benefit of not have to start Steam at all.  There were some cases that it took me almost half an hour to get Steam VR to cooperate and let me fly.  The irony was, I was trying to fly to relax, but it would piss me off so much that by the time I got to I didn't want to.  I have actually NOT flown because I didn't want to deal with Steam VR and all the hoops.

"Steam VR does not support VR."  That message always made me pull my hair out.  I mean, it's kind of IN THE NAME.  And a reboot would clear stuff up.  Non sensical.  

So, with OpenXR, Steam VR can just eff right off.  I don't miss it.

I start WMR, I start DCS.  I fly.  Period.

[dburne]

With my Aero I am finding with running the default HI setting for VB and set vysnc to on in VB, it does a good job locking my fps to 45 and a very smooth experience. Don't know how much Open XR is helping that but I will take it for sure. I tried enabling the default Fixed Foveated Rendering with the Open XR Toolkit and it introduced some ugly shimmering for me so I disabled it.

Edited April 4, 2022 by dburne