Jump to content

Image Auto Track/Offset?


FalcoGer

Recommended Posts

What does Image Auto Track/Offset do?

Currently it seems like it is not working as the button simply does nothing. I was hoping for some kind of point track or ground stabilizing feature.

I read the entry on it in the quick start handbook, but I can't make sense of it.

Quote

Image Auto Track/Offset. Initiates and controls image auto tracking and offset
tracking.

- IAT (forward), short. Enables image-auto track and establishes the
object under the cursor as the primary track.
- IAT (forward), long. Activates manual sizing of the tracking gates.
- OFS (aft). When offset tracking, returns TADS LOS to the primary track.
When not offset tracking, deletes the current track (primary or secondary).

What is offset tracking, why would you use it. What's a primary or secondary track. What's a track in the first place? The manual just throws those words around as if they've been explained elsewhere already.


Edited by FalcoGer
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi all, just a few quick questions.

1. Is there any assist modes for hover other than the symbology page? (i.e. Hover Autopilot)

2. Other than Linear Motion Compensator (LMC) is there any other way to auto-track a moving column? Its a bit hard to keep that sight on a moving vehicle even with LMC. Especially if the road that the vehicle is moving on is curved. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

Bump.  Not sure why this is in the wishlist forum.  Since it's the only post I've found that mentions in Image Auto Track/Offset in the title, perhaps the post should be moved to the main forum where are more comprehensive explanation might be forthcoming?

System spec: Intel i9 13900KF @ stock,  Gigabyte GeForce RTX 4090 Gaming OC 24GB GDDR6X, Gigabyte Z690 UD DDR4, Corsair Vengeance RGB PRO SL 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4 3600MHz C18, Samsung 980 EVO 500 GB NVME M.2 SSD (system drive), Samsung 970 EVO 1 TB NVME M.2 SSD (games drive), Cooler Master ML360 Illusion CPU Cooler, Asus XG43UQ Monitor, Oculus Quest Pro, Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS, MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/17/2022 at 8:38 PM, FalcoGer said:

What does Image Auto Track/Offset do?

Currently it seems like it is not working as the button simply does nothing. I was hoping for some kind of point track or ground stabilizing feature.

I read the entry on it in the quick start handbook, but I can't make sense of it.

What is offset tracking, why would you use it. What's a primary or secondary track. What's a track in the first place? The manual just throws those words around as if they've been explained elsewhere already.

 

Offset tracking is when you have a contrast lock and move the thumb force tracker, the tads still moves with the target but at the offset you set with the thumb force controller. To zero out of the offset your click the OFS switch. IAT/MTT is a contrast lock basically, and it can track multiple things at once, hence primary, and secondary tracks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Hippo said:

Bump.  Not sure why this is in the wishlist forum.  Since it's the only post I've found that mentions in Image Auto Track/Offset in the title, perhaps the post should be moved to the main forum where are more comprehensive explanation might be forthcoming?

I certainly didn't put it in wishlist. And if I did it was by accident.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/25/2022 at 4:58 PM, llOPPOTATOll said:

Offset tracking is when you have a contrast lock and move the thumb force tracker, the tads still moves with the target but at the offset you set with the thumb force controller. To zero out of the offset your click the OFS switch. IAT/MTT is a contrast lock basically, and it can track multiple things at once, hence primary, and secondary tracks.

Thanks, but unfortunately I remain none the wiser.  Sorry if I'm being a bit thick.

What is a "contrast lock"?

"the tads still moves with the target but at the offset you set with the thumb force controller".  Isn't that what LMC does?

 

 

20 hours ago, FalcoGer said:

I certainly didn't put it in wishlist. And if I did it was by accident.

I didn't mean to imply otherwise, sorry if it came across as if I did.

System spec: Intel i9 13900KF @ stock,  Gigabyte GeForce RTX 4090 Gaming OC 24GB GDDR6X, Gigabyte Z690 UD DDR4, Corsair Vengeance RGB PRO SL 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4 3600MHz C18, Samsung 980 EVO 500 GB NVME M.2 SSD (system drive), Samsung 970 EVO 1 TB NVME M.2 SSD (games drive), Cooler Master ML360 Illusion CPU Cooler, Asus XG43UQ Monitor, Oculus Quest Pro, Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS, MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, Hippo said:

Thanks, but unfortunately I remain none the wiser.  Sorry if I'm being a bit thick.

What is a "contrast lock"?

"the tads still moves with the target but at the offset you set with the thumb force controller".  Isn't that what LMC does?

 

 

I didn't mean to imply otherwise, sorry if it came across as if I did.

It’s like a point track

Link to comment
Share on other sites

LMC is an inertial mechanism that doesn't use the image. It's 'blind math' that would work the same even with black paint over the lens.

IAT analyzes the image itself to pick out distinctive shapes as trackable like Maverick, Shkval, TGP point, AIM-9X, etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...
Am 18.3.2022 um 01:38 schrieb FalcoGer:

What does Image Auto Track/Offset do?

Currently it seems like it is not working as the button simply does nothing. I was hoping for some kind of point track or ground stabilizing feature.

I read the entry on it in the quick start handbook, but I can't make sense of it.

What is offset tracking, why would you use it. What's a primary or secondary track. What's a track in the first place? The manual just throws those words around as if they've been explained elsewhere already.

 

interesting video about it and it work amazingly smooth!

 

@Hippo

 

 


Edited by Hobel
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This should be interesting. I wonder how it behaves if a vehicle moves behind something. Will i try to keep track inertially and try to reacquire behind the obstacle or will it just give up?

Also those vehicles look to be mostly unmanned, just sitting there while everything around them blows up.

Also I noted that the video appears to be distorted. I don't mean the atmospheric effects of the hot ground, but you see the symbology is blurry and at some point the lines don't connect right. What's up with that? Looks like the recording bitrate and resolution are really crap. Why can the army afford multimillion dollar helicopters but can't afford something that any consumer camera could record better in their multimillion dollar sighting system?

The actual tracking itself seems to follow a fairly simple and straight forward algorithm of trying to finding connected pixels of similar intensity, then drawing a box around the outermost edge of those connected pixels and slaving the camera to it's center.

I heard people talking about how IAT isn't that great, how explosions make it go wild. From what I see here it just tries to auto track the explosion dust before it gives up because the area is too big, presumably. First of all, that doesn't make it less usable, since the target is dead at this point. It just makes it slightly less convenient since you're now a few hundred meters, at worst, off target. For stationary targets or targets moving without cover this should be perfectly fine. I shall make liberal use of it, as those pilots seemed to have done as well.

At one point you can see that the contrast wasn't great and the auto track tried to box the ground below as well before giving up. The pilot just tracked manually at that point, but for every other instance he used the automation to reduce the workload.

I never said it was magic, but it's not nearly as useless as some people here suggest. I imagine the software for it could be updated to use more advanced algorithms. With AI vision and some additional logic this could become quite good. I'm sure they have plenty of footage to train their models on.

Of course DCS' implementation will be magic, as it usually is. We never get a proper contrast lock, evidenced by the fact that we can't lock onto burned out vehicles. In aircraft like the a10, ka50, su25t, f16 and f18 which all have some kind of point track, this can be abused to identify destroyed targets because the camera will not "snap" to them.


Edited by FalcoGer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

vor einer Stunde schrieb FalcoGer:

This should be interesting. I wonder how it behaves if a vehicle moves behind something. Will i try to keep track inertially and try to reacquire behind the obstacle or will it just give up?

Also those vehicles look to be mostly unmanned, just sitting there while everything around them blows up.

Also I noted that the video appears to be distorted. I don't mean the atmospheric effects of the hot ground, but you see the symbology is blurry and at some point the lines don't correct right. What's up with that? Looks like the recording bitrate and resolution are really crap. Why can the army afford multimillion dollar helicopters but can't afford something that any consumer camera could record better in their multimillion dollar sighting system?

The actual tracking itself seems to follow a fairly simple and straight forward algorithm of trying to finding connected pixels of similar intensity, then drawing a box around the outermost edge of those connected pixels and slaving the camera to it's center.

I heard people talking about how IAT isn't that great, how explosions make it go wild. From what I see here it just tries to auto track the explosion dust before it gives up because the area is too big, presumably. First of all, that doesn't make it less usable, since the target is dead at this point. It just makes it slightly less convenient since you're now a few hundred meters, at worst, off target. For stationary targets or targets moving without cover this should be perfectly fine. I shall make liberal use of it, as those pilots seemed to have done as well.

At one point you can see that the contrast wasn't great and the auto track tried to box the ground below as well before giving up. The pilot just tracked manually at that point, but for every other instance he used the automation to reduce the workload.

I never said it was magic, but it's not nearly as useless as some people here suggest. I imagine the software for it could be updated to use more advanced algorithms. With AI vision and some additional logic this could become quite good. I'm sure they have plenty of footage to train their models on.

Of course DCS' implementation will be magic, as it usually is. We never get a proper contrast lock, evidenced by the fact that we can't lock onto burned out vehicles. In aircraft like the a10, ka50, su25t, f16 and f18 which all have some kind of point track, this can be abused to identify destroyed targets because the camera will not "snap" to them.

Well are quite old recordings   Besides, the quality is partly degraded on purpose for public. 

The seen are probably real recordings of desert storm

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...
  • ED Team

Please avoid posting videos, or links to videos, showing real people being killed. Let's keep the S in DCS based in simulation.

The IAT/MTT is being worked on, and will be released when able.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Afterburners are for wussies...hang around the battlefield and dodge tracers like a man.
DCS Rotor-Head

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 9/19/2022 at 3:10 PM, Raptor9 said:

Please avoid posting videos, or links to videos, showing real people being killed. Let's keep the S in DCS based in simulation.

The IAT/MTT is being worked on, and will be released when able.

It is kinda hard to find material showing how a particular system works, adding further constraints just makes the whole matter more complicated. If you have some footage of IAT being used in a training environment or some army instruction video feel free to replace the video with one that shows the same thing without the killing. But the reality is that weapon systems are designed to destroy the enemies ability to fight, and that includes killing them. If people don't want to watch the video, then they shouldn't click the play button or follow the link, but those people were killed either way, if you watched it or not and ignoring that fact by looking away won't change that. Besides all that it's blurry enough, it might as well be censored. I for one am glad that I now understand what it's supposed to look like and get a general idea on how it works. I mean was anyone complaining about it?

Edit: I thought you meant the video with the vehicles that is still available up top. Not sure if my rant applies to the one you deleted.


Edited by FalcoGer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • ED Team

@FalcoGer, I know all too well the effects of weapons in real life, and I do not take such things lightly. However, graphic images and videos of real people being shot, killed or maimed is not appropriate for these forums, regardless of whether anyone complains about it. This is not up for debate, nor is it the topic of this thread.

  • Like 1

Afterburners are for wussies...hang around the battlefield and dodge tracers like a man.
DCS Rotor-Head

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...