CBU-97 & CCIP

[LordOrion]

I'm trying to deliver some CBU-97 in CCIP mode but looks like the plane cannot compute the fire solution and the PBIL line never become solid.

Since the procedure works fine with low drag bombs I suspect something wrong on my side.

Any clue?

[Yurgon]

The CBU-97 is very draggy. On top of that, it'll blow some 300 or 500 or 700 or whatever feet above the target, so the actual aimpoint that the aircraft needs to consider internally when giving you the CCIP pipper will be above the target, depending on your HOF setting. You'll probably have to give it a very steep dive angle to get a valid CCIP solution.

Whenever possible, I much prefer CCRP with the CBU-97.

[jaylw314]

Either that, or you can get REALLY close and just use the TLAR method (That Looks About Right)

Edited March 23, 2022 by jaylw314

[Auger]

I've had this issue as well.

Like Yurgon said it takes a very steep dive angle to get a valid CCIP. I find myself at about a 65 to 70 degree dive angle before I get a solid line and can view the bomb circle. Makes for an exciting bomb run. hehe

But then, I'm a big fan of the CBU 97. There's no problem that can not be solved with a righteous amount of 97's applied.

[jaylw314]

Going as fast as possible helps to get the CCIP pipper in the HUD, too.  Things that help:

• Low altitude
• Steep dive
• High speed

Obviously, all 3 at the same time is not good for your health, but you can just get it in view in level flight at full throttle about 2000' AGL

Edited March 23, 2022 by jaylw314

[schurem]

CCRP is the way with these bundles of joy.

[ASAP]

The CBU-97 is more accurate with a CCIP drop because it doesn't have the WCMD tailkits helping it steer to the desired point of function (at least in real life). In game I think you can get "good enough" with CCRP but you could still be more accurate with CCIP and I like to do it because I think its more realistic. Also if you ripple 2 you'll get much better target effects because of higher bomblet density (but that's beside the point). The trick with these like Yurgon said is that because they have so much more drag and the weapon functions above the ground the CCIP solution will be closer to the bottom of the HUD, and you might have to drop it consent to release. That means when you roll out on final you will have a much higher aim off angle and a further aim off distance from the target. That requires you to adjust your base parameters from where you would normally want to roll in with dumb bombs. I find that adjusting your base position in like a half mile closer to the target before rolling in helps alleviate a lot of those problems and helps keep the dive angle reasonable. 

[LordOrion]

21 hours ago, Yurgon said:

The CBU-97 is very draggy. On top of that, it'll blow some 300 or 500 or 700 or whatever feet above the target, so the actual aimpoint that the aircraft needs to consider internally when giving you the CCIP pipper will be above the target, depending on your HOF setting. You'll probably have to give it a very steep dive angle to get a valid CCIP solution.

Ok, make sense, I will give it a try.

14 hours ago, schurem said:

CCRP is the way with these bundles of joy.

Ok, but how to deal with moving targets with CCRP?

[ASAP]

3 hours ago, LordOrion said:

Ok, but how to deal with moving targets with CCRP?

You can't. I mean, technically you could pick coordinate somewhere out in front and drop on that, but good luck being accurate. If you have to use CBU on a mover, you'd likely have better success doing a CCIP delivery and leading the target with your pipper. You'd have to do some math to figure out TOF of the weapon and figure out how many seconds to lead the target by. The lead required will be much less in CCIP than CCRP, you'll have to guestimate where the target will be in 3-4 seconds vs 20-30 seconds for a medium alt CCRP delivery. Its CBU so you have some slop due to the dispersion of the bomblets, but you want to try and be accurate with where you are dropping it. Its a point weapon with area effects, or in other words: aim small, miss small.  

[LordOrion]

13 minutes ago, ASAP said:

You can't. I mean, technically you could pick coordinate somewhere out in front and drop on that, but good luck being accurate. If you have to use CBU on a mover, you'd likely have better success doing a CCIP delivery and leading the target with your pipper. You'd have to do some math to figure out TOF of the weapon and figure out how many seconds to lead the target by. The lead required will be much less in CCIP than CCRP, you'll have to guestimate where the target will be in 3-4 seconds vs 20-30 seconds for a medium alt CCRP delivery. Its CBU so you have some slop due to the dispersion of the bomblets, but you want to try and be accurate with where you are dropping it. Its a point weapon with area effects, or in other words: aim small, miss small.  

This is exactly my same doubt, I can be enough accurate with CCRP is the target is moving!

Edited March 24, 2022 by LordOrion

[Yurgon]

15 minutes ago, ASAP said:

The lead required will be much less in CCIP than CCRP, you'll have to guestimate where the target will be in 3-4 seconds vs 20-30 seconds for a medium alt CCRP delivery.

That's a good point!

I don't remember off the top of my head how long it takes the submunitions to deploy, go up and actually attack the target, but I'd estimate that to be an additional 10 to 15 seconds. Shouldn't the pilot take that into account as well?

In any case, the bomb fall time for the CBU before its HOF would be less in a steep CCIP vs. a higher CCRP delivery, and the submunition deployment needs to be considered in either case. Just saying, I think it's 3-4 seconds plus another 10 or 15 or thereabouts that the pilot has to calculate, making the CBU-97 less than ideal against moving targets in any case.

[Frederf]

I have tried to deploy SFW ahead of a moving column and it's very difficult to be accurate in leading the targets. There are too many variables: weapon TOF, target speed, time between SUU burst and BLU-108 weapon dispense, etc. The trajectory of the canister passing the HOF plane makes a big difference how long before the skeets are dispensed.

[jaylw314]

If you're going to use CCRP mode, it would make sense to make HUD SPI and use the TDC (or the HMD SPI and the HDC) instead of using the TGP.  That way, you're looking at the "big picture" instead of looking through a straw.

Again, if you do a relatively low (3000' AGL) level drop, you don't really need to lead moving targets much more than you would have to lead them in CCIP anyways.  Neither are particularly helpful if you're at a higher altitude, though

Edit:  Duh, forgot you can also use CCIP in delayed release mode

Edited March 25, 2022 by jaylw314

[Eagle7907]

I use CCIP with consent, most of the time 5 mil setting. It’s sort of a hybrid. You can aim for movers, and also pull out early to avoid ground fire with less of a dive angle.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro