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DCS English FreeTrack and TrackIR 1/2 fix


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So it is full 6DOF fix or not? :) no problem with SF btw?

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C2D E4500@3GHz + Scythe Katana , 2GB/800, GF9600GT@720 (GV-NX96T512HP), Cyborg Evo, Freetrack (2.2), Samsung 20" @1680x1050, Fortron BSII 400W (peak 430W), Win7 HP x64

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That just sold another copy of Blackshark. Somebody at ED should thank this Mr. Quarrion gentleman. I consider my (ancient) TIR2 to be my biggest immersion multiplier (over and above my CH HOTAS, even), but I can't buy a new TrackIR unit every year or two, and NaturalPoints lack of customer respect is making me think a good high quality camera for Free Track might be next on my upgrade list.

 

Just my opinion.

Thanks to Quarrion for making this option available.

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That just sold another copy of Blackshark. Somebody at ED should thank this Mr. Quarrion gentleman. I consider my (ancient) TIR2 to be my biggest immersion multiplier (over and above my CH HOTAS, even), but I can't buy a new TrackIR unit every year or two, and NaturalPoints lack of customer respect is making me think a good high quality camera for Free Track might be next on my upgrade list.

 

Just my opinion.

Thanks to Quarrion for making this option available.

 

Using Freetrack from a couple of years ago.



I have always heard only by people who have used TrackIR is the best system of hearings.

When I say Freetrack is free (software) that make the system leds takes 30 minutes, and that with a simple webcam get the same thing does not think so (not that).

In my case I have mounted the Freetrack with the system of 3 LEDs on the side, use a webcam that gives me 90fps at 620x400 (I think that its the resolution that I use).... I do not think that Tracker is much better than my Freetrack in terms of fluency and precision.

That if the camera in its day cost 90 € .....¿ worth it?

Well, as it would have been better to buy directly Tracker, but even so I get more sweet potatoes and I have a Webcam for other tasks.

 

If I could go back to the past maybe, I do not know, would acquire TrackIr, but it still seems a really expensive for what you offer me in comparison with the free Freetrack.


 

He also used a webcam Freetrack giving 30fps (EyeToy Play2 webcam with PC drivers), and also worked very well, that is, we do not need a webcam of last generation to use Freetrack.

I5 4690K@4500ghz/24gb DDR3 ram/Evga GTX1070

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  • 2 weeks later...

That first post in the FT thread is funny.

 

In simple terms it says, give us what you worked so hard to accomplish so we can offer it for free.

 

What they dont understand is that NP's encryption is not an anti-competitive situation because the FT company is free to write their own 6 DOF interface, instead of hacking NPs, and then lobby the publisher to include it.

 

If FT had wrote their own 6DOF interface, instead of reverse engineering a current one, then I am sure we would not even be in this situation.

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That first post in the FT thread is funny.

 

In simple terms it says, give us what you worked so hard to accomplish so we can offer it for free.

 

What they dont understand is that NP's encryption is not an anti-competitive situation because the FT company is free to write their own 6 DOF interface, instead of hacking NPs, and then lobby the publisher to include it.

 

If FT had wrote their own 6DOF interface, instead of reverse engineering a current one, then I am sure we would not even be in this situation.

Exactly.

 

This whole mentality is absolute craziness to me. Aside from the completely flawed legal logic behind it (which sadly isn't suprising to me, considerng the wacky source), if NaturalPoint hadn't created their interface/technology, none of us would likely be using any form of head tracking in Black Shark (or any other game for that matter). The concept and technology did not exist prior to TrackIR. Additionally, the FreeTrack "developers" haven't invested nearly what NaturalPoint has, in that they neither created a new interface nor spent the time and money necessary to persuade developers to implement this technology in the first place. FreeTrack users, whether knowingly or not, are continually biting the hand that feeds them.

 

Case in point: What if the guys at NaturalPoint just closed up shop and stopped pursuing implementation in new games? What would change? Nobody would have headtracking in any new titles. Black Shark would be the last title to support headtracking... at least until FreeTrack or somebody else decided to pony up the money, invest the time, and foster the necessary relationshiops to hound game developers all day long and get the code into their games. In other words, no TrackIR = bad for everyone.

 

How about if the FreeTrack guys just went away? What would change?

 

Nothing.

 

All that FreeTrack provides users is an avenue to discreetly mooch off of the ingetuity and hard work of other people without giving them their due compensation.

 

FreeLoad is more like it.

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Well I'm not sure it's exactly reasonable to expect ED or any developer to support 2, 3, or 6 different interfaces for 6DOF. That would just be a waste of resources. I mean they don't write specific interfaces for every graphics card out there. They go through an interface standard, Direct3D, to display graphics. That's really what would make sense here. Someone, most likely Microsoft, should come up with a standard interface and then you could just plug in any hardware that supports the standard.

 

I'm not being anti-TrackIR here. I own a TrackIR4 and owned a TrackIR3 before it and I love it however using a standard interface would encourage competition and I that's a good thing.

-- CoolHand

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I agree, but just because there isn't a standard interface doesnt mean it is OK for FT to reverse engineer and steal NP's. Which is what their excuse roughly boils down to.

 

I see no reason why FT before hacking the NP software didnt contact to tell NP of their legal point of view and offer to write a standard interface.

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The concept and technology did not exist prior to TrackIR.

 

NaturalPoint with TrackIR was the first one to commercialize the concept and the technology. There concept already existed and there were crude stuff for it; not that the first TrackIR was anything more than crude compared to the 4th generation.

 

What I see is the problem is that NaturalPoint is pursuing for monopoly. They don't leave much space for competitors by disallowing the use of the only tracking API built into the games.

 

Until I heard about these news I thought that the point of NaturalPoint was to sell advanced technology to offer more precise controls et al than with the improvised webcam stuff.

 

Case in point: What if the guys at NaturalPoint just closed up shop and stopped pursuing implementation in new games? What would change? Nobody would have headtracking in any new titles. Black Shark would be the last title to support headtracking

 

That's quite illogical. Apparently there is already at least one potential alternative, who most likely also has the potential to write an API for games to support their software. However as is the NP is the only one providing API to the publishers and therefore Freetrack is using it.

 

Not all publishers/developers agree to use the NP's API. Microsoft for one wrote their own API for Flight Simulator X, which is called SimConnect, or something like that. So it's free game for NaturalPoint, Freetrack and whoever else wants to write software benefitting from it. That's how it should be, not restricted to just one company with the aim of monopoly over the tracking technology - so much that they even remove support from the users of older TIR generations in order to boost their sales.

 

This is not about who wrote the API and therefore has the rights to collect funds for it's development, but who has the control of the market.

 

A friend of mine told me that NaturalPoint doesn't even have legal grounds to stop the use of their API from competition. Their only legal weapon is to make the court expenses so high that most competition willingly gives up when threatened, even though the competition is on the right side of the law and would not lose the case. I don't know for sure myself, but this guy knows quite a bit about this kind of stuff.

 

I’m all for free open source software, but breaking the encryption of natural point. I vote for NO. Backward engineering, hope it bites you back where the sun don’t shine…

 

Is it right for the NP to close out the competition from using Black Shark? As a customer I want to choose which company's tracking technology I want to use or whether I want to try my own. I'm sure there are people willing to write their own API (like Microsoft did), but will it be implemented in the BS so that anyone can use it with their hardware? I doubt that now that it's already implemented into the game. I think the NP is highly exaggerating the costs gone to develop the API used in BS. If they want to keep on the top then they should concentrate on making quality products rather than limit the market artificially.

 

 

 

Ps. I'm user of TIR 3 Pro with vector expansion, so let's not say anything about me being a bad person stealing from the NP or such. Though, as long as the NP insists on restricting the market artificially I will not be buying an another product from them.


Edited by Fishu
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So you can vent yourself as much as you want. I will not change opinion.

 

Open source does not mean stealing.... that gives a bad rap on legit open source programmers...

 

I stand on my opinion, sorry...

 

You can stand on whatever opinion you want, but I'm in this to point out to the others that your opinion is wrong and is not in the best interest of the gamers and the development may in fact become stagnant due to lack of pressure from competition.

 

That's how Nvidia, AMD and ATI became big makers in the market of their area of expertise - the giants before them had it too comfortable and neglected the development of new technology, which gave space for the new, innovative, companies. Alas, even innovative companies can eventually become the victims of their own success, as has happened to many companies before them.

 

This day NaturalPoint itself is the worst enemy of the company - they're no longer innovative in the true sense of it and instead resort to limit the markets like so many other failed market leaders have done before. Calling it stealing will not change the fact that the company is about to tumble downhill if they continue to neglect the best interest of the consumers. Should they continue their current policy there will be a serious competitor before soon and it will cut their markets worse than the so called stealing.

 

I see no reason why the history wouldn't repeat itself once again. Everything is proceeding just like so many times before.


Edited by Fishu
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What does this have to do with open source? Anyone can write a software of their likings to use (or abuse, as you see it) the NaturalPoint API and share it for free, but they don't have to release the source code, therefore not making it an issue about the open source.

 

The thread is about:

1) Being able to use TIR1/2 and non-naturalpoint technology with Black Shark.

2) Whether it is legit lawfully or morally to use the NaturalPoint API by a third party software (this discussion is not only about Freetrack).

 

Open source is totally unrelated to the point of discussion and is only related to how the most potent alternative software is made available. Nowhere is said that a software must or should be open source.

 

What comes to the legal side of it, the link in the first post, which I only now checked out, appears to include the section of law which dictates that the API cannot be used to create monopoly. You may be able to restrict the use of API by encryption and such, but you cannot tell others to stop using it should they figure out how to do it.


Edited by Fishu
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Guys, we already told you multiple times to stop the FT vs TrackIR accusations (against both sides). As you proably know, ED are working on a compromise:

 

Every joystick has standard software interface, that's why every joystick works in every game. For now there is no standard for head tracking devices software interface. We were going to add vendor-independent SDK in English release to allow every head tracking vendor (including FreeTrack) implement support of their devices for BlackShark. SDK has been removed from English release because of NaturalPoint request. Now we make agreement with NaturalPoint and we will release 3DOF version of our head tracking SDK soon.

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=589080&postcount=40


Edited by Acedy
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  • 7 months later...

Any help for DCS Spanish version and Freetrack?

 

Any help for DCS Spanish version and Freetrack?

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MSI GT72 6QD Core i7 6700HQ 2.6GHz-3.5GHz - 16 GB DDR4 RAM, NVidia GTX970M 3GB DDR5 - 256 GB M.2. SATA SSD + 1TB HDD 7200 RPM - 17.3" 1920 x 1080 Full-HD IPS Screen - Trackir 5 - HOTAS Warthog

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I have the western version now and can not get FT to work even with the fix Dll. Is there somthing that I am missing.

 

wester version, same system as below, on Win 7 RC 64, FT 2.2 with new Dll in blackshark

Home built PC Win 10 Pro 64bit, MB ASUS Z170 WS, 6700K, EVGA 1080Ti Hybrid, 32GB DDR4 3200, Thermaltake 120x360 RAD, Custom built A-10C sim pit, TM WARTHOG HOTAS, Cougar MFD's, 3D printed UFC and Saitek rudders. HTC VIVE VR.

 

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