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Paddle Switch Disable Option in MP?


wilbur81

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It might be a nice option for MP server hosts to be able to turn on or off the ability for Hornet pilots to use the G-Limiter-Override switch if they so choose... though it would be understandable if it is too enmeshed into the flight modeling of the Hornet to accomplish easily?

Low priority at this point, I'm sure, but thanks for considering... 👍

Keep up the awesome work, ED!

 

 

 

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I had this idea multiple times. But its not only F18 overG-ing. Also F14 and F15 as non-fly by wire aircraft. I would find it much funnier if the main text chat showed a message to other players like: "player xyz just pulled 15,5 G - congratulations" - I am wondering how often that message would pop up before a kill.


Edited by darkman222
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Why would you disable a resource available in the real aircraft? We already have a really overdone and unrealistic wing-snapping model to try to deter people from over-g-ing. I personally would rather have a better damage model for the hornet itself that seems to be unable to survive any blasts, other than 4000fpm landings, lacks (like all aircraft in DCS) fragging and loses the wings before the stores hanging from those wings.

I understand why you want to forbid people from using the paddle switch in "competitive" servers, but for that darkman above gives you a very good solution.

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35 minutes ago, darkman222 said:

I had this idea multiple times. But its not only F18 overG-ing. Also F14 and F15 as non-fly by wire aircraft. I would find it much funnier if the main text chat showed a message to other players like: "player xyz just pulled 15,5 G - congratulations" - I am wondering how often that message would pop up before a kill.

 

This would be funny, but not very practical. As it would render the main text chat completely unusable for the standard dogfight servers. It would just totally flooded with those congrats messages all the time.


Edited by Snappy
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Perhaps I'm not skilled enough yet but I haven't found any use for g lim. override function yet and I've done crapload of gun fights and off bore heater shots, etc...

I did experience one or two 'controlled' flights into the dirt in my gaming career but pressing the paddle wouldn't have made any difference at the speed and angle I was coming down.

ALSO, instead of dumbing down our Hornet even more... I would rather have it FIXED.

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Of course my idea is not really meant serious. ( although generating a little public shaming for people constantly over g-ing would be quite a bit satisfying) We have multiple issues here that have been discussed a lot already.

Gamers are doing exploits. How does an F18 fly with a pulled paddle? Is there an EM diagram for that case (for our DCS US Hornet which is only approved for 7.5 G) ? Pretty sure there is not. And there is no EM diagram applicable  for a F14 fighting with deployed flaps either.

And also these endless discussions about Mr. F14 captain Snortgrass, almost crippling his F14 for a kill and boasting about it in front of an audience. Sure you would do everything to survive in the real thing. But would real pilots harm their aircraft for a kill in a training mission? I doubt it.

So what are we doing here? Fighting for our lives or just "training". People can chose the mindset they bring into this game and into a dogfight. If you enter a dogfight server and your mindset is fighting for your life: you will pull the paddle all the time. If your mindset is "training" your game plan would not include the paddle switch.

In the end the only real solution is what they did in folds of honor monitoring the g limits. Some people liked it others did not. Red or blue pill question.


Edited by darkman222
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On 3/25/2022 at 8:44 AM, wilbur81 said:

It might be a nice option for MP server hosts to be able to turn on or off the ability for Hornet pilots to use the G-Limiter-Override switch if they so choose... though it would be understandable if it is too enmeshed into the flight modeling of the Hornet to accomplish easily?

Low priority at this point, I'm sure, but thanks for considering... 👍

Keep up the awesome work, ED!

 

 

 

But you need it to for a realistic ITR as it is in DCS... I've been practicing my precise pull so I can get my ITR while not exceeding G-limits in lieu of the current FM.

Just no. Paddle switch disables NWS and is the only way to disable autopilot without forcing the aircraft.

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8 minutes ago, Hulkbust44 said:

Paddle switch disables NWS and is the only way to disable autopilot 

This is true and they'd have to work around that somehow if they were going to implement it. I like Darkman's ideas above better, though. :thumbup:

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After thinking about this for some time, I now think a better solution would be a more aggressive g-loc implementation for all aircraft that could be turned on and off at the server level.

Perhaps begin greying out at 1g over the operational limit for each aircraft, with full g-loc at 1.5g's over. This would give the player a visual cue to start easing pull if he is so inclined, while still applying a penalty for the excessive over-g if they continue with the pull.


Edited by Cab
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7 hours ago, darkman222 said:

You dont need it in the F16. The pilot just passes out way too early already. Also a non binary solution for wing overstress would help. If the aircraft is over G'd DCS only knows two states: Aircraft still intact or wings snapping.

Yeah, cumulative damage could work. Over G once for a short duration, fine. Sustain an over g condition several times in a short period, start breaking things. Make the radar go inoperative, cause the gun to jam, cause stores to jam, and after enough cumulative over G, break the wings. Each spawn would start clean slate, but in the span of a dogfight, someone who blatantly disregards limits will pay for it.

I wouldn’t even see this as being an option that needs to be enabled or disabled. If the existence of the paddle is realistic and should be modelled, so should the realistic consequences of doing so.


Edited by Sandman1330
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58 minutes ago, Sandman1330 said:

If the existence of the paddle is realistic and should be modelled, so should the realistic consequences of doing so.

As well as the realistic performance. Right now it seems more like a berserker switch than just an over-g one. Pulling that thing turns it into a whole different airplane.

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4 hours ago, darkman222 said:

I would expect the wings to be bent up if the over G is not enough to break them. But the flight performance should not be that great any more.

Yeah, good point. It would stall asymmetrically and at the wrong AoA, which would confuse the FLCS and make for very weird and unpredictable control response. 
 

There are so many ways this could be modelled fairly easily, while avoiding the on/off wings break at exactly xG model we currently have.


Edited by Sandman1330
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  • 3 months later...

Seems like a fair suggestion, leave it up to server owners and mission makers if they want to simulate war or training conditions.

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Does not make sense. The general over G modelling shouldnt rather be like "wings good" or "wings snap" that the wings get bent, which gives a disadvantage. This would also help with F15 guys permanently over-over-over G-ing!


Edited by darkman222
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Considering that you can vastly over-G even GA aircraft and still land them somewhat safely (though severely crinkled), the limits on combat aircraft would likely be conservative too, at least as long as they aren't carring twice their empty weight in ordnance on the wings. Apart from "wings snap", the damage would be more on a logistical side, i.e., maintenance reaming the pilot and planes going out of service for a good long while until an antire new airframe can be procured.

Disabling repair/refuel for an aircraft that has been strained significantly could work? As soon as it lands, ground crew just runs up to the plane and siphons out all the fuel to make sure nothing worse happens to it 😄

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