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Some key binding to copy cursor/selected unit coordinates from F10 into temporary message on screen


FalcoGer

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23 minutes ago, FalcoGer said:

- Repeatedly toggle F10, copy a few numbers, then because you have forgotten half of them, go back and repeat. I'm sure some people are better than this than me, but I can remember about 5 or 6 digits, meaning I have to go to the map 3 times to copy any coordinates and the respective altitude into the aircraft.

 

Same here. I play VR and I need to switch 3 times between F1 and F10 view, in order to add coordinates (sometimes more, if I get distracted). Short memory? Perhaps..

And each time I switch between F1 and F10 I have to find the exact same spot on the F10 map with my mouse (or click on the required map/unit icon again, as it automatically gets deselected when switching between views). I learned to live with it/use it, but there's certainly room for (quality of life) improvement here 🙂

 

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Some 21st c, suggestions…

Use the notepad feature on your phone/ tablet or take a picture of the screen with its camera. 


Edited by SharpeXB

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On 5/16/2022 at 4:54 PM, SharpeXB said:

I could swear I saw that somewhere but now I can’t find it. 

Perhaps you are referring to the 'Message History' function?

It then shows a message log

 

image.png

 

image.png

(is it just me, or is this forum's paste image function REALLY broken?)


Edited by cfrag
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3 hours ago, FalcoGer said:

My issue is that you can either have the F10 map open or you can not. If you have it open you can't type the coordinates anywhere. So the solutions are:

- Repeatedly toggle F10, copy a few numbers, then because you have forgotten half of them, go back and repeat. I'm sure some people are better than this than me, but I can remember about 5 or 6 digits, meaning I have to go to the map 3 times to copy any coordinates and the respective altitude into the aircraft.

- Use real pen and paper, which is a waste. paper and ink cost money, admitedly not a lot, but it also makes a mess of my desk having dozens of loose pieces of paper around, wasting about 1 A4 page every time I play DCS. I don't care for VR because I don't have it. But as some people stated before, using VR prevents the use of this option.

- Use a tablet or other device. I don't have one, neither should I be forced to buy one. I have a phone, but writing on paper and writing on a tiny phone are two different things, it's clunky, illegible unless you use huge letters and of course you need to have your phone at your desk with you. Again an issue with VR.

- Be able to use the aircraft's navigation system while the map is open

Or use mods.

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20 minutes ago, lefuneste01 said:

Or use mods.

Personally, I rather keep my DCS clean of mods, as too many times I had trouble when things broke after a DCS update. At some point I got fed up with troubleshooting to find out what exactly broke..

I'd rather see something added to DCS core to make it easier to enter F10 map coordinates into my jet/chopper.

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5 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Some 21st c, suggestions…

…make use of the ridiculously powerful hardware and memory capabilities of a modern computers to simulate the most basic functionality that has existed in aircraft since before they even successfully got off the ground the first time, and add the universal ability for pilots to jot down notes and annotations on whatever surface is available. You know. As if it was a flight simulator or something.

That would be infinitely better than some boneheaded inapplicable non-universal external non-solution that shouldn't even be needed, just to solve a problem that should never have existed to begin with.


Edited by Tippis
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an option to just add a line to a kneeboard page would also work. Though it'd be nice if you could also delete them.

On 5/18/2022 at 8:24 PM, lefuneste01 said:

Or use mods.

which mods? The way doesn't work for all aircraft and it's clunky and doesn't work half the time anyway. It's also a lot closer to cheating than to write the numbers down and it's inflexible at times. Any mod only shows the shortcommings of DCS, especially usability and UI mods. SRS is still kicking because DCS' internal VoIP solution is plain inferior in every way. Overlord bot exists because DCS AWACS is just plain unusable garbage. And the way and similar waypoint management mods exist only because DCS is lacking features that make it nice and easy to jot down some coordinates from the map.


Edited by FalcoGer
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Why use the F10 map in the first place? Let’s face it, that’s basically “cheating” Copying the coordinates directly and then pressing the pickle button isn’t much of a challenge. Sure, there’s a use for this in training, testing or practice perhaps but realistic gameplay means getting these coordinates from a radio or briefing etc. 

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19 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Why use the F10 map in the first place? Let’s face it, that’s basically “cheating” Copying the coordinates directly and then pressing the pickle button isn’t much of a challenge. Sure, there’s a use for this in training, testing or practice perhaps but realistic gameplay means getting these coordinates from a radio or briefing etc. 

Of course it would be. But I enjoy those random, dynamic and perpetual online missions. Sadly they don't offer you your waypoints, nor do they give you a specific briefing for a specific strike target. Because DCS is at the end of the day a game, we don't get that luxury of having a briefing room and a laptop to plug our waypoints in, so we have to do that in the aircraft if we can only decide our mission when the mission file is loaded. Typically you would plan your mission on the ground, load it into your DTC and then carry that to the aircraft. Since we can't do that, I do that on the ground, then fly my waypoints, which is the next best thing. Usually I don't use F10 in the air. Or sometimes I just pass the time entering pre planned threats while on the way because I have nothing else to do.

On 5/18/2022 at 8:00 PM, cfrag said:

Perhaps you are referring to the 'Message History' function?

It then shows a message log

 

image.png

 

image.png

(is it just me, or is this forum's paste image function REALLY broken?)

 

I don't see how message history is helping here. It's just the same old problem of having to bring it up, remember a few numbers, close it, type them in and repeat. Only instead of pressing 1 button, you now press escape, grab your mouse and click message history button, scroll to the relevant entry, remember a few numbers, close and type them in before repeating, which is just way worse.

Also you can't copy coordinates there in the first place, only read the messages designed by the mission editor in the first place.


Edited by FalcoGer
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13 minutes ago, FalcoGer said:

Of course it would be. But I enjoy those random, dynamic and perpetual online missions. Sadly they don't offer you your waypoints, nor do they give you a specific briefing for a specific strike target.

Yeah I agree and I dig that sort of mission as well. And I find the lack of that sort of info disappointing. I found myself doing the F10 cheat in the Operation Pontus campaign since it didn’t include any realistic way to get targets, I found that to be rather immersion killing. 


Edited by SharpeXB

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4 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Why use the F10 map in the first place?

Because it's there. And because maps are something you find in an aircraft, so it's pretty darn unrealistic if you couldn't use it.

3 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

I found myself doing the F10 cheat

In what way is it a cheat to get the coordinates off of a map? You do realise that coordinates exist in real life, right, and that maps have them and show them?

Applying the c-word in relation to something that is realistic, that is intentional, and that has numerous controls and options attached to it to determine the level of information you can gain is spectacularly silly.


Edited by Tippis

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8 hours ago, Tippis said:

And because maps are something you find in an aircraft, so it's pretty darn unrealistic if you couldn't use it.

Well, they have maps, not tablets, so it is what it is, a cheat. More realistic one you can find in a kneeboard.

I'd vote for something that writes down coords (from messages or from the map) into the kneeboard if we can't write it ourselves.

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Obviously a map itself isn’t a “cheat” it’s that it can be set to show all the enemy units and even your own location. Of course those settings can be controlled. In SP it seems like solitaire cheating. 
A solution to this dilemma might be an in-game scratchpad keyboard, which can appear windowed anywhere in the game. It could be used in the cockpit or the mission editor or map. And have the ability to paste it’s entries onto the kneeboard. 

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37 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Obviously a map itself isn’t a “cheat” it’s that it can be set to show all the enemy units and even your own location.

Setting up a mission the way you want it to be played is not a cheat.

Don't be daft.

38 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

A solution to this dilemma

What dilemma? The solution to a missing feature that would improve realism, gameplay, and general user friendliness is to add that feature. This would be a good thing. The alternative is to leave the game unrealistic, unfriendly to the user, and to have annoying gameplay limitations. This is a choice between a universally good option and a universally bad option — that is not a dilemma.

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7 hours ago, draconus said:

Well, they have maps, not tablets, so it is what it is, a cheat. More realistic one you can find in a kneeboard.

I'd vote for something that writes down coords (from messages or from the map) into the kneeboard if we can't write it ourselves.

It is a cheat, but you can disable external views. 

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15 hours ago, upyr1 said:

It is a cheat, but you can disable external views. 

Whether or not it is or isn't a cheat is not the topic either way. Personally I find nothing wrong with the concept of it. It's just clunky to transfer information from a fullscreen map to a fullscreen cockpit view and offered some suggestions around it.

I think the best thing would be to write the coordinates into the kneeboard, perhaps write anything you want, really. Copying the numbers right from the map into the kneeboard would be great at the time. Also why is coordinate view switching still a keybind instead of a button on the map view? It's ridiculous. Get some UX people on the team and fix this mess please? You can make the most amazing flight simulator but your UI is subpar.


Edited by FalcoGer
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1 hour ago, FalcoGer said:

Whether or not it is or isn't a cheat is not the topic either way.

Indeed. I don't understand how this would even be considered an argument;  'cheat' in this context merely is synonymous to 'not as in reality' -  like many other big advantages that simulations offer (not dying after a crash, exploring what-if scenarios without consequences, flying jets without being certified) and can offer quality-of-life improvements over reality: not having to wear gloves or restrictive garments, being able to pause to use the bathroom instead of hygiene products: are those 'cheats' too? As long as a feature is optional, not fully resembling reality is an opportunity to improve the experience rather than something to disparage as "unrealistic" or "cheat". Doing so would be a failure to take advantage of, and explore, new possibilities.  

I have no issues when someone states "I won't use that option because I deem it to be unrealistic". That's fine and fair - and a personal choice. It's something else entirely when they state "I'm against anyone having this option because I deem it to be unrealistic". That's imposing their own standards on others, usually a bad idea.

Also, I'd postulate that not taking advantages of the additional options we have in a sim is unrealistic. Some (OK, many) years ago, during my active duty time, I participated in a live-fire exercise (also called a 'simulated battle') when two techs got hurt in an accident. We suspended the exercise ("cheated"?) for two hours to recover and get them to a hospital. Nobody complained that is was cheating. Let's use the heck out of the new abilities and possibilities of DCS instead of needlessly limiting us to restrictions of reality that don't apply in a computer sim. Note: I'm not saying that we should ignore reality; we are still here because we like realism in simulations. I'm saying that we should be able to have the option to ignore reality if that can make it a better game for those who want to use it.   

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2 hours ago, FalcoGer said:

Whether or not it is or isn't a cheat is not the topic either way. Personally I find nothing wrong with the concept of it. It's just clunky to transfer information from a fullscreen map to a fullscreen cockpit view and offered some suggestions around it.

I think the best thing would be to write the coordinates into the kneeboard, perhaps write anything you want, really. Copying the numbers right from the map into the kneeboard would be great at the time. Also why is coordinate view switching still a keybind instead of a button on the map view? It's ridiculous. Get some UX people on the team and fix this mess please? You can make the most amazing flight simulator but your UI is subpar.

 

Someone else was calling it a cheat, and I'm just saying they don't have to use it if we get it as you can disable external views. I am not opposed to having it either. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
Am 15.5.2022 um 21:21 schrieb Phantom711:

Ok...I help your imagination: How about a virtual keyboard on the kneeboard. And of course the kneeboard should be available in the F10 map. Everything is better than having to take off the headset and writing a grid down on paper.

And while we`re at it: For the love of god make the gridsystem inthe upper left corner of the F10 map switchable by a click on a button with the mouse instead of a keybind!

That already exists.
Look here:
https://forum.dcs.world/topic/195956-dcs-scratchpad/

It works great!

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vor einer Stunde schrieb A.F.:

That already exists.
Look here:
https://forum.dcs.world/topic/195956-dcs-scratchpad/

It works great!

I am aware of that mod, I just could not get it to work. And as far as I know, the virtual keyboard stopped working at a certain DCS update iteration...

It still works for you? In VR? Could you check, which version of the mod you are using?

 

EDIT: Just saw, that someone posted a newer version a few days ago...I will give it a try. Thanks for bringing it back to my attention.


Edited by Phantom711

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vor 6 Stunden schrieb Phantom711:

I am aware of that mod, I just could not get it to work. And as far as I know, the virtual keyboard stopped working at a certain DCS update iteration...

It still works for you? In VR? Could you check, which version of the mod you are using?

 

EDIT: Just saw, that someone posted a newer version a few days ago...I will give it a try. Thanks for bringing it back to my attention.

 

Let me know how it works…

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  • 1 year later...
  • ED Team

F10 Coordinate picker for the F10 map is planned 

thanks

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11 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

F10 Coordinate picker for the F10 map is planned 

thanks

Great news BN! Thanks for sharing 👍 

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i7-8700K @stock speed - GTX 1080TI @ stock speed - AsRock Extreme4 Z370 - 32GB DDR4 @3GHz- 500GB SSD - 2TB nvme - 650W PSU

HP Reverb G1 v2 - Saitek Pro pedals - TM Warthog HOTAS - TM F/A-18 Grip - TM Cougar HOTAS (NN-Dan mod) & (throttle standalone mod) - VIRPIL VPC Rotor TCS Plus with ALPHA-L grip - Pointctrl & aux banks <-- must have for VR users!! - Andre's SimShaker Jetpad - Fully adjustable DIY playseat - VA+VAICOM

 

~ That nuke might not have been the best of ideas, Sir... the enemy is furious ~ GUMMBAH

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If you all are still looking for a kneeboard you can write on in VR.  I use OpenKneeboard (link below), coupled with a cheap Huion drawing tablet velcro strapped to my leg.

https://github.com/OpenKneeboard/OpenKneeboard/tree/v1.4.4

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