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Added Multiplayer Functionality/Flexability


Coyle

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This thread is meant to be in response to NineLine for added multiplayer functionalities. I will only offer a couple of suggestions, if anyone else has further ideas please feel free to post.

AI Communications.
While I can appreciate that a significant amount of work has been done on the Super Carrier module in terms of AI comms, sometimes they can be quite a bit lacking. In a multiplayer setting where many different scenarios may want to flown, herding 20 people into a marshal stack is not always the prettiest or fastest method when it comes to dealing with the AI. When playing with a human Marshal/Airboss/LSO, things can often be conveyed or custom tailored to any situation that arises much more rapidly over voice.

It is for this reason I request that you allow us to bypass all AI communications and potentially all marshaling instructions such that we may fly our own marshal stacks, but still have basic ACLS guidance.

The simplest method I can think of is adding another radio option that'll just 'check in' the jet on the back-end to the carrier but with out prompting AI communications, thus all the things that need to happen will happen, just with out having to deal with the AI. Another suggestion might be to have a "Toggle on/off AI communication" switch in the upcoming Airboss station.

Prior to the ACLS update when we do this in our group with out checking in with the AI the only issue we have is that the carrier lights do not toggle for the event, requiring at least one person to radio in the carrier (usually the last person in our custom stack). This puts the burden on only one person to turn on the lights, as anyone ahead them will have the deck set to proper conditions.

Since it appears that everyone would have to radio in to get any ACLS functionality, an example of how it'll probably end up going is:

1. You will radio in with a human marshal
2. Switch to a different AI frequency so that things don't step on each other
3. Call up the AI while making sure you're not stepping on some one else who is currently in the process of doing so (the AI might choke and ignore multiple people calling in)
4, 5, 6... Switch back and forth for any further human/AI interactions. Commencing, platform... etc.

This can quickly become tedious over time as people fight to get into position and make their commence times while dealing with duplicate agencies... Being able to forgo the AI but still check in to receive ACLS would be very convenient.

Other manned stations functionality.
We are still unsure of what exactly we will be able to manually take control of while manning some of the stations on the carrier, so I will offer some suggestions.

-Having the ability to add/remove/sort jets to a custom marshal stack with or without AI comms.
This would give us the option us using external comms but also giving hornet pilots in-game T/C Link4 data.

-Allowing the Airboss to broadcast over 5MC
Could be helpful in some situations as well, perhaps via the in-game radios ED is working on?

Allowing the LSOs to set the eye-to-hook function
To better facilitate F-14,F/A-18C,upcoming F-4 landings, etc.

Any/all carrier features that could be used in a big multiplayer setting would be a very welcome additions to DCS for those of us that practice navy missions.

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This is IMO a very important concession that needs to be made to allow this feature to be properly used throughout the MP environment.

However I would suggest even better than having to check in with the AI. Having it auto detect aircraft within the ACLS lock on window, and provide them with ACLS instructions regardless of AI radio status. Similar to how the cat crew can detect and aircraft taxiing into a certain box and will guide it onto the cat.

So with this method the flow would be:
Tune link 4 frequency as demonstrated in Wags video. CMD A/S + ALT + ROD are all blank.
Marshal and commence as you would for ICLS approach with a human controller. Link 4 format remains unchanged.
Approach to the 8mile mark. At this point the AI will 'detect' you as described above, CMD AS 140 + CMD ALT 1200 + CMD ROD 0, LND CHK
Approach to 6mile mark. By this point the AI has already detected you, so it would proceed silently and show the same symbology as demonstrated in wags' video.

So to effectively, the player inputs the link freq, flies the approach as normal (without AI ATC), and the ACLS auto detects at 8 miles and provides the correct data messages without the radio comms from this point in.

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@Wags @NineLine

Hey both, 

I hope you are all well and many thanks to you both and the development team for todays implementation of ACLS and Link4 to the F/A-18C Hornet. Even the new implementation of the ATC Approach mode is a great addition and works satisfactory. 

Whilst the aircraft does a great job in allowing and flying with ACLS would it be possible to find other triggers for the ACLS, CMD A/S ROD and ALT then the supercarriers communication menu. When flying online using realistic carrier ops with human controllers, it currently will not allow for the ACLS to be used. Also when performing case III training launching directly into the pattern, ACLS will only become an option when you would have to walk through the entire communication menu first, which would assume you would come from the stack. 

This currently limits it realistic use quite drastically. 

On top of that, afaik the CMD A/S in the stack is 250Kts IAS or rougly 300gs for easy calculations. 
Maybe Matt can have a word with GB about the options... 

Regards, 

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Another request for the ACL logic to be untied from the AI Comms. I guess people must really want this ED (hint hint)

 

https://forum.dcs.world/topic/299507-added-multiplayer-functionalityflexability


Edited by Swift.
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On 4/25/2022 at 3:49 PM, Coyle said:

This thread is meant to be in response to NineLine for added multiplayer functionalities. I will only offer a couple of suggestions, if anyone else has further ideas please feel free to post.

AI Communications.
While I can appreciate that a significant amount of work has been done on the Super Carrier module in terms of AI comms, sometimes they can be quite a bit lacking. In a multiplayer setting where many different scenarios may want to flown, herding 20 people into a marshal stack is not always the prettiest or fastest method when it comes to dealing with the AI. When playing with a human Marshal/Airboss/LSO, things can often be conveyed or custom tailored to any situation that arises much more rapidly over voice.

It is for this reason I request that you allow us to bypass all AI communications and potentially all marshaling instructions such that we may fly our own marshal stacks, but still have basic ACLS guidance.

The simplest method I can think of is adding another radio option that'll just 'check in' the jet on the back-end to the carrier but with out prompting AI communications, thus all the things that need to happen will happen, just with out having to deal with the AI. Another suggestion might be to have a "Toggle on/off AI communication" switch in the upcoming Airboss station.

Prior to the ACLS update when we do this in our group with out checking in with the AI the only issue we have is that the carrier lights do not toggle for the event, requiring at least one person to radio in the carrier (usually the last person in our custom stack). This puts the burden on only one person to turn on the lights, as anyone ahead them will have the deck set to proper conditions.

Since it appears that everyone would have to radio in to get any ACLS functionality, an example of how it'll probably end up going is:

1. You will radio in with a human marshal
2. Switch to a different AI frequency so that things don't step on each other
3. Call up the AI while making sure you're not stepping on some one else who is currently in the process of doing so (the AI might choke and ignore multiple people calling in)
4, 5, 6... Switch back and forth for any further human/AI interactions. Commencing, platform... etc.

This can quickly become tedious over time as people fight to get into position and make their commence times while dealing with duplicate agencies... Being able to forgo the AI but still check in to receive ACLS would be very convenient.

Other manned stations functionality.
We are still unsure of what exactly we will be able to manually take control of while manning some of the stations on the carrier, so I will offer some suggestions.

-Having the ability to add/remove/sort jets to a custom marshal stack with or without AI comms.
This would give us the option us using external comms but also giving hornet pilots in-game T/C Link4 data.

-Allowing the Airboss to broadcast over 5MC
Could be helpful in some situations as well, perhaps via the in-game radios ED is working on?

Allowing the LSOs to set the eye-to-hook function
To better facilitate F-14,F/A-18C,upcoming F-4 landings, etc.

Any/all carrier features that could be used in a big multiplayer setting would be a very welcome additions to DCS for those of us that practice navy missions.

Yes!! I completely second this entire wish. While I do appreciate Eagle Dynamics bringing the world's most realistic naval aviation experience to players - especially to those that choose to fly or practice DCS in single player - there are a number of us that go beyond that to play as a team, both in the air and on the ground. Of course, that's the multiplayer community.

However, It is very cumbersome and task-saturating to depend on AI/ATC menu to communicate with AI objects (like a CATCC on a carrier) that happen to also be human-manned. It is necessarily a break from realism for single players, but not to larger communities.

If Eagle Dynamics has gone out-of-their-way to create an VOIP, an LSO platform, and an Airboss/PriFly station - which is very much appreciated to those of us that fly amongst friends - I would only ask that we take this realism endeavor a little further and allow an OPTIONS selection to turn ON/OFF the AI / ATC / Comms menu for items like ATC clearance, carrier lights, marshal instructions and ACLS for those that have those areas covered by human players using the very functions and modules provided by Eagle Dynamics. 


Edited by MRSHADO
Atrocious Spelling Errors
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Completely agree! In our community we use human marshal/approach/lso. Having to deal with the comms menu is cumbersome and a little immersion breaking. We opt to not use ACLS at this point. Please disconnect it from the comms menu. Swift's suggestion is great imho!

Just like Coyle pointed out, even without ACLS, at least one person currently has to call inbound for the lights to turn on. This is also a little annoying, but at least the workaround isn't that hard. I guess the ultimate solution would be to allow a player to simply instantly toggle them on/off at any point. Or a sledgehammer approach adding a mission editor advanced waypoint action "Force lights on" (would love an on/off clickbox for this for normal airfields also btw).

EDIT: Also, tying ACLS to comms doesn't really makes sense in the first place. AFAIK aircraft near the carrier gets ACLS regardless if they come from the marshal stack, from a bolter pattern, or any other kind of funky approach. 


Edited by Bankler
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Great suggestions here and I'm 100% behind them. Having to deal with the AI ATC in MP is problematic for us that play in squadrons. An option to skip that or at least have ACLS work like on the free Stennis (where you get the symbology at 6 NM out, without the need for SC comms), would be a solution.

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  • 5 months later...
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Bump.

I can appreciate the work ED has put in on the carrier comms side of things, but there has to be some way for us to connect to the carrier with out going through the AI process when we only wish to fly with other humans making all the calls in a simulated multiplayer environment.

A simple radio command that'll skip all AI comms, toss us up on the LSO platform list, tune the lights as appropriate, and automatically attempt to establish ACLS would go such a long way until some of these things can be modelled a little better via super carrier features. Maybe one that could even be bound like the "hornet ball" key bind we have.

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