"Improved SCAS" patched 28/04

[Belphe]

Hi,

I did some flying in the Apache today after reading that SCAS has been improved but found the helicopter to be much more "floaty" and less "snappy" in the roll axis, especially at higher speeds. IMHO, it is now much harder to apply precise roll amount because the aircraft excessively counters this movement. The effect resembles "rubber banding".

Of course, people generally don't like change. I will gladly train to adapt to this new behaviour if it's confirmed to be "working as intended". Just thought I'd ask if you had similar experience.

Thanks

[RodBorza]

Yes, I've found it to be more stiff, but it is better now, ar least for me.

And yes, the SCAS fights you. If you input X amount of input, you need to take out Y amount, being Y less than X. Example; if you input right pedal, you would need to take out the same amount you put in to stop the turn. But in the Apache you need to take out less than you input because the SCAS is already inputting left pedal.

Maybe the SCAS is fighting the rolling motion as you mentioned.

Enviado de meu SM-A127M usando o Tapatalk

[inexus]

After the latest patch I found taking off is much harder as if the Apache appear much heavier now. 

[noisy_lightning]

On the contrary I found last night the aircraft to be much more twitchy and unstable in the hover, taking off was a PITA and transitioning to a hover was much more all over the place. It was like I was starting all over again. I do concur it feels heavier now in certain flight regimes, if I try and evade a missile in the hover its much slower to react to input, but I am not sure if thats the SCAS fighting me or a change to the FM overall.

Its not even that my stick is cheap, I have a Virpil CM2 with a 200mm extension. The only thing that changed is the patch yesterday.

[Vakarian]

I've only flown it for ~half an hour yesterday after the patch and I found it to be a lot less twitchy, especially in the yaw department. In all other regimes the Apache seems (to me at least) a much more stable platform than before. Some would say it got more sluggish compared to before the update, but personally I like the change. 

Haven't had any difficulties evading ATGMs fired at me when hovering while CPG is shooting, I could do all maneuvers I wanted in stable, smooth manner, transitions hover <-> forward flight were way more stable and had a lot less yaw oscillations... 

Also, I could kill all curves I had on my pedals, so that's nice

[lt_d4n]

is reported according to nineline

Edited April 29, 2022 by lt_d4n

[YoYo]

The same, more stable I suppose.

[spikenet]

Having same experience to others where the chopper has become really hard to fly, super twitchy. I've not changed anything in my setup so its really weird. At first I thought my curves had been removed but no, they are still as set before. I noticed in the cockpit the virtual stick seemed to be moving more than before in relation to my inputs... hmm

 

scub that, was my stick calibration was out..

 

Edited April 29, 2022 by spikenet
correction

[mwlue]

Just did a few quick flights, I found transition from forward flight is much much easier!  Yes it's much more stable, zipping through trees/covers smooth as silk now.

Thanks ED.  

[pii]

OMG it's all different now.  I just about had it all tuned in, could hover steady, take off steady, landings good but now its all out the window.

The bird has become a sloppy mess for me and the second I lift off the ground it pitches forward and races down the runway (hopefully you are on a runway) landings are sloppy also now. Looks like its time to start over figuring out how to fly it again.

[monkie]

It sure seems to me that it's much harder to control in pitch, prior to the patch I was able to lift off about 3 feet and hover without much movement, now its very hard to hold a steady pitch attitude. I chalked it up to my own perception but now I am wondering if there was a change to the flight model.

[Devrim]

Hi.

It's definitely better now. The aircraft is in more calm attitude. Last night I tested updated SCAS and it was the first time I've seen 3, 2 and also 1 knot while hovering.

But yes, I've realized more the sense of that SCAS is fighting against you, but if you stop fighting SCAS, the aircraft immediately calms down and do what you want to do.

Note: I'm still using curves.

Love it!

Edited April 29, 2022 by Devrim

[Codex]

Much more stable for me now, easier to land

[Catweedle]

14 hours ago, ApacheLongbow said:

It's early access. Expect this to happen after every patch and you won't be disappointed. Be disappointed if patch after patch, nothing changes.

 

Expect people to articulate their impressions and findings after every patch, because it is "early access".

I also feel like I have to relearn some aspects of how she handles now. However, since they already stated "work has started on" tuning SCAS, I assume there's going to be more iterations of readjusting to the FM. 

 

[pii]

18 hours ago, ApacheLongbow said:

It's early access. Expect this to happen after every patch and you won't be disappointed. Be disappointed if patch after patch, nothing changes.

 

Which is why I generally put EA mods away for a year or two but I just spent weeks tuning it and now it looked like its out the window. The good part is all I had to do was remove the 40 curve I had  on the pedals and its all good now.

[CaptHawk]

Yeah that's all I had to do, a few other minor adjustments and it seems much easier to transition to a hover. Still can't get George to pay attention when things get hot...

[poochies]

I think the ATT hold is much much better in a hover it actually holds the hover and I can ascend descend and it holds the yaw as well much more enjoyable now before it would go all over the place and the helicopter would all of a sudden bank hard left or right as if a big wind hit it , it's rock steady now , big improvement for me at least ....

[RuskyV]

I noticed that it’s still a bit iffy above 125knots, pushing the cyclic forwards starts a roll to the left and pulling rolls to the right. Above 130knots it starts to get really pronounced.

right now getting anything above 130knots in a dive can be really problematic when trying to level out.

[Floyd1212]

I agree, ATT Hold does a great job holding attitude while in a hover now.  I'll get myself into a reasonable hover and press trim, then release the stick to center, make some minor adjustments to really get stable, then set ATT Hold.

However, sometimes things go horribly wrong after I have disabled ATT Hold and pressed trim reset to move to a new position, or to evade an incoming missile.  I get massive oscillations in roll left and right.  This is during otherwise level forward flight at maybe 100 knots.  Oscillations in roll angle are maybe 20 degrees? 

At one point I looked at the Controls Indicator and saw the circling behavior someone else mentioned, where the green SCAS plus was going in circles around the diamond.

[purpi]

AH-64D FM wip ?.......  Better to wait a while until the FM is adjusted and then sit in the pilot's position with the controls.

[pii]

4 hours ago, Floyd1212 said:

I get massive oscillations in roll left and right.  This is during otherwise level forward flight at maybe 100 knots.  Oscillations in roll angle are maybe 20 degrees? 

I get this also in level flight now. It's not too bad but noticeable.

 

[Badhorsie53]

Also confirm at straight and level flight @ 130kts with no weapons the amount of trimmer pressure is extreme along with extreme left pedal to try and keep bird at speed @ 133kts the oscillation, tilting, yaw, and kitchen sink start going crazy and flight continues to become unstable the faster you go, if you can even reach 150kts.

Helicopter may hover ok at 0-60kts, but the rest of flight envelop as you go faster goes out the window.

Next question would be what's the normal operating speed? 100-120kts. Even at those speeds not very stable.

This is just more negative with hopes next update will get better.

 

After deleting flight controls and starting over flight now seems good and stable.

Edited May 2, 2022 by Badhorsie53

[Hotdognz]

Just returned from holiday Vipil CVM2 and 200mm extension and was really happy with the Apache, now it bobs about all over the place and is very unstable (no curves)