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Case 2 & 3


Devastator

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Hi Guys,

as the current tower in supercarrier not recognizing the complete flight but just the leader, how do you guys plan the holding point and pushtimes if you have, let's say 4 ship flight? What is the RL procedure for such flights in case 2 and 3 approaches?

Also does a 4 ship flight break together in Case2 or they come one by one like in Case 3 and do single breaks into case1?

Thanks in advance

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First of all lets start with marshall stack.Lets say it is 23 nm 8000 feet 180 radial and your push time is 44 ( if time is 13.XX it means your push time is 13.44 )

When you arrive exactly that point for example 13.39 and call establish ( 180 radial 23nm and angel 8 )

Now you you must plan your holding pattern.You have to be at that point again at 13.44 with the margin of +/- 10 sec at 250 knot.So you have 5 minute.

Most of the pilots fix their ground speed at 300 GS which gives you 5 nm per minute and its easy to calculate.

1-Continue with your heading (180) for 2 minute

2-Make a left hand U-turn with bank angle of 30 degree ( which takes about 1 min to complete. )

3-Continue with the inbound leg for 2 minute and you will be on time - on speed. (13.44)

Ofcourse it is not easy to hit your push time on time on speed every time.This is the logic behind it and you should constantly calculate.

However key is 300 GS and also it doesnt matter what your pattern is looks like you can do some zig-zags in order to hit your push time on time which is totally fine but you can not change your altitude without permission.

 

For CASE 3 Recovery

It doesnt matter if you are 4 ship or single jet every aircraft goes for different stack.

For CASE 2 Recovery

You can commence with 2 ship maximum, so you and your wingman penetrates the weather together and when you have visual in 10 nm continue as a CASE 1 Recovery with your wingman.

BTW SC is not very succesful to recognizing flights as you said.However sometimes it detecs the wingman if your wingman is in formation close enough you can hear "holding hands".

Hope it helps.

 


Edited by Zodiacc
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1 hour ago, Zodiacc said:

For CASE 3 Recovery

It doesnt matter if you are 4 ship or single jet every aircraft goes for different stack.

For CASE 2 Recovery

You can commence with 2 ship maximum, so you and your wingman penetrates the weather together and when you have visual in 10 nm continue as a CASE 1 Recovery with your wingman.

BTW SC is not very succesful to recognizing flights as you said.However sometimes it detecs the wingman if your wingman is in formation close enough you can hear "holding hands".

Hope it helps.

 

 

my question is exactly for the above part. So just to get it clear

1- For Case3, how do you seperate the complete flight in respect to push times? I can imagine that the seperation for altitude and distance is clear (1k feet per 1 nm) but what about the time to leave the stack?

2- For Case 2, so if you have 4ship formation you split into 2 unlike to the case3 where everybody is splitted? 

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1- Push times (Expected approach time) are also managed and given by CATCC just like marshall stack and ideally with all aircrafts depart from their marshall stack with 1 minute seperation.However in reality it all depends on the traffic, there might be bolters, bad weather, low fuel state etc.Therefore EAT might be changed for aircrafts in stack.( In DCS it always assume perfect condition and EAT does not change after.)

2-Yes, 4 ship formation has to be split into 2 flight.

If its not still not clear ill be happy to help for further questions.

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8 hours ago, Devastator said:

Hi Guys,

as the current tower in supercarrier not recognizing the complete flight but just the leader, how do you guys plan the holding point and pushtimes if you have, let's say 4 ship flight? What is the RL procedure for such flights in case 2 and 3 approaches?

Also does a 4 ship flight break together in Case2 or they come one by one like in Case 3 and do single breaks into case1?

Thanks in advance

For CASEIII, each flight member should talk to the SC. It will assign the holding and push time for each member individually.

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that thing does not work as far as I see. Everytime when someone talks from my flight, SC is using my own flight number and on top, they cannot talk if I did the talk first. This was the case for a long time, is it fixed with the latest update of SC?

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if you set them seperate then you will not see them in datalink with the letters as they will be seperate flights... 

Repeating the inbound call does not give new pushtimes for other airplanes but repeats the initial one for everybody. So it is not working

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Can confirm it does not work for clients in the same flight. Only the flight member who called inbound first will be recognized with the system. Subsequent flight members will get the same stack and push when they call inbound, but their comms menu will not change to give ESTABLISHED, etc., so they get stuck in an inbound loop indefinitely. 

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