Elunnia Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 Hello dear desk pilots, I'm reading the book of Dave "Bio" Baranek : TOPGUN days. In the book he saids the case 1 was done at 600ft & 450kts before the break. In the Sims, case 1 is at 800ft and 350kts. So the procedure has changed since the eighties or it's wrong in the game? best regards, fly safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AH_Solid_Snake Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 Let me answer this question with two sides - I have a huge deal of personal admiration for Bio, Crunch, Victory, all F-14 pilots and RIOs. However theres not likely to be a completely clear cut answer here. For us armchair pilots its fortunate the navy does publish this type of training manual completely publicly. P-816 CV PROCEDURES So you can reference (at least for nuggets flying the T-45) what the Navy training is right now. And we can extrapolate that probably you train the same way you'll be expected to perform. But now we have 2 competing sources, and being armchair aviators thats our single biggest problem. We dont know, we didn't really do it. For Bio's story, even in a published book its not unheard of for a quickly typed error to go unnoticed. He could have meant 800ft 450kts (as far as I'm aware, the 800ft is non-negotiable, but the 450kts is a guideline...just make your pull work) and nobody caught the error. Perhaps in the 80s they did something slightly different, perhaps its different between what we can see for the T-45 and the F-14. All I can suggest is read as many primary sources (first hand accounts for events, written manuals and material from the time period for procedures) and "figure it out" for your own purposes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon1-1 Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 The pull is at whatever works for you, the important part is that you get in the right place with the right speed by the time you're done turning. It's generally around 400kts, but can be more or less. As for altitude, AFAIK, Case I is 800ft and has been so since forever, no matter what you're flying. 600ft is probably a typo. Bolters are done at 600, IIRC. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draconus Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 When Victory made his first version of Case I tutorial it was definitely 800ft and afaik T-45 training differs from NATOPS in many figures. 1 Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060 Rift S T16000M HOTAS FC3, F-14A/B, F-15E CA SC NTTR, PG, Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elunnia Posted May 10, 2022 Author Share Posted May 10, 2022 Thank for your replies. I have the Victory case 1 training, and the difference between him and Bio hit me (like you said all, 200ft are quiet something at this altitude. Bio wrote that multiple time during the Qualification when they arrive at the Constellation. I will continue with 800 feet. It's a nice discussion, too bad Victory or Bio aren't here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sLYFa Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 Initial HAS to be 800ft. Anything below is calling for a midair with aircraft in the pattern. AFAIK the speed is not that restrictive and depends on how the pilot likes to fly his break. i5-8600k @4.9Ghz, 2080ti , 32GB@2666Mhz, 512GB SSD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonesvf103 Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 (edited) 800 ft level in the initial into the break. Remain level until established in the downwind then when established on downwind, descend to 600 ft. v6, boNes Edited May 10, 2022 by bonesvf103 "Also, I would prefer a back seater over the extra gas any day. I would have 80 pounds of flesh to eat and a pair of glasses to start a fire." --F/A-18 Hornet pilot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealius Posted May 11, 2022 Share Posted May 11, 2022 Sounds like he was mixing up SHB with standard CASE I. "Nasty" would do an offset SHB at 600/600 (600ft 600kts). The 450kts is a guideline, as someone else mentioned. I recall hearing that it was anywhere between 350-450, pilot preference for low speed low G or high speed high G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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