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Adjust trim causes my b1rd to buck like a bull


KevyKevTPA

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I have no idea if this is a setup issue, if I'm doing something wrong (very, very possible), or what, but I've found when I'm adjusting my trim to try to get on speed for a landing, the plane will jump up by a good 15-20°.  I have trimming mapped to a hat on my x56 throttle, and it happens pretty much all the time, though it's not like I've been keeping a log.

Any thoughts about this?

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On 5/11/2022 at 11:28 PM, KevyKevTPA said:

I have no idea if this is a setup issue, if I'm doing something wrong (very, very possible), or what, but I've found when I'm adjusting my trim to try to get on speed for a landing, the plane will jump up by a good 15-20°.  I have trimming mapped to a hat on my x56 throttle, and it happens pretty much all the time, though it's not like I've been keeping a log.

Any thoughts about this?

Did you check all your control assignments, so that every function should be assigned to one button/controller axis only, and that every button / control has only one function? Wouldn't be surprised if you would find your stick back function would be assigned to the trimm nose up button, or something similar glitch...

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14 hours ago, Swift. said:

How fast are you when you are trying to trim? If you try to trim onspeed at 200 kts, you are going to nose up to the moon

You may be onto something, as I have noticed when it behaves that way I am in fact somewhere in the area of 200 kias.  BUT...  why would it do that at 200 kts whereas if I slow down from there, it doesn't?  Frequently that's the speed I roll out from my break turn at, give or take.  

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5 minutes ago, Dragon1-1 said:

The Hornet balloons horribly on flaps deployment, and if they come down as you try to trim it, that's about what you'll see. Don't try to trim on speed at 200kts, and make sure you're properly set up for landing before you start trimming.

That's one reason I wish the joystick and HOTAS makers would start equipping their products with force-feedback.  Just like most other DCS users, I've never flown an F-18, but I have flown a Cessna many, many times, and it, too, wants to balloon when you drop the flaps.  However, you can feel it in the yoke and counteract it with a firm push, which is something DCS and for that matter all flight sims (same is certainly true in MSFS) can't simulate.  AFAIK, not even the high end, $1,000+ HOTAS units have FF.  That should change.

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It should, but what needs to change here is the fact that the Hornet simply does not do that IRL. You don't have FF in the real Hornet, you have FBW that is supposed to prevent things like that from happening. That it does not is entirely on the Hornet devs. It would be nice to have FF stick bases and pedals for WWII and especially helicopters, but in modern jets, you generally don't have that sort of feedback unless you're in something like manual reversion on the Hog. 

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7 minutes ago, KevyKevTPA said:

That's one reason I wish the joystick and HOTAS makers would start equipping their products with force-feedback.  Just like most other DCS users, I've never flown an F-18, but I have flown a Cessna many, many times, and it, too, wants to balloon when you drop the flaps.  However, you can feel it in the yoke and counteract it with a firm push, which is something DCS and for that matter all flight sims (same is certainly true in MSFS) can't simulate.  AFAIK, not even the high end, $1,000+ HOTAS units have FF.  That should change.

Oh FFS (no, ff doesn't stand for force feedback... ) It's either your stick setup or what WOPR said: before touching the trim switch, make sure to disengage any autopilot sub mode you might've engaged before the break. Smack the paddle switch just to make sure. Well... first, make sure your paddle switch assignment is correct. When rolling out after the break, you should be slow enough to avoid any horrendous ballooning, just counter with the stick. The FCS model is still being worked on (I hope) and NO... it's not similar to Cessna. With the way things work currently, I prefer to gradually start adding power and trim simultaneously as soon as I see the velocity vector beginning to creep down. You should be in a descent anyway, from 800 to 600 ft. (Of course, talking carrier ops here) Takes a little practice to do it smooth. Other then that... check, double check, triple check your stick setup.

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A couple of thoughts. 1- Like others have said be sure to disengage autopilot. I don't understand it completely but if you have used autopilot at any time in that flight you need to disengage it. Hitting AP and then clicking 'BALT' for instance to make the colon sign go away, does not disengage it. I have a separate button on my stick for disengage AP. It also does something else that I don't remember at the moment. 2- I 'assume' you are doing a straight-in approach. If so, I do not drop flaps until about 180. That way you get what you would expect, a quick loss of airspeed, w/ virtually no float upward. 3- If you are doing a carrier pattern trap, you fly past the carrier upwind at 350 and 800ft w/ the hook down. I always set full flaps at the same time I drop the hook. But the flaps will not actually drop until below 250. So in the first break turn, you chop the throttle, bank over hard, hit the speed brake, watch the airspeed and drop gear at 250, somewhere right around there the flaps will drop. But, since you are banked over hard, you don't really feel them because, rather than lifting the plane, they just tighten your turn. Hopefully you finish the turn at a heading of about 180deg from the carrier's base coarse and can use the downwind leg to perfect your onspeed aoa as well as drop to 600ft. 

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  • 1 month later...

Just came to forum looking for a similar issue, it doesn't always happen to me, but I notice it when I come in straight say for Case 3 when I deploy flaps and lower landing gear @ around 250knots 1200ft 8nm from carrier it will pitch up high I will try and trim and use throttle to get on AOA, but nothing happens. Sometimes it will drop first so I give it more throttle and try and trim up same again nothing then all of a sudden it will pitch up high and then the trim starts working if that makes sense it feels like I am fighting against something didn't think that maybe the Auto throttle or pilot might still be engaged as I was sure they where disengaged. Will check this out. 

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