3080 10GB vs 3090 24GB or OCULUS QUEST2 vs VALVE INDEX

[Ericcaff]

Good day to all,

Want ask for help or recommendation, I use for playing DCS PC VR Gigabyte 3080 10GB Overclock
Full system specs:
i7 12700K overclock 5Ghz + Gigabyte RTX3080 10GB OC + RAM32GB 4100Mhz + M.2SSD + Oculus Quest 2 with original Link Cable

Down below my game settings screenshoots, actually i can play with this settings almost normal, but in multiplayer some maps with more players i have big frame drops even empty areas like sand in Syria map. I saw some posts about DCS use a lot of VRAM, that why im start thinking maybe need change my GPU to RTX3090 24GB, but moste important question - Is it help me increse FPS and stable work, if it is just incres 3FPS that is nothing and i think it is just spend money, like everyone know now PC detail is it deficite and cost expensives like never that why question is REALY NEED CHANGE GPU TO 3090???
 Also read somewhere about DCS soon change engine to "VULKAN" did some one know is it help increse stability and when they plan release it?

Second question - if i leave my 3080 10GB, but will change my Quest 2 to Valve Index, is someone know DCS work better with Index than Quest 2, becasue Index is created special for PC VR Gaming, but Quest primary is Aadroid Mobile Games, PC VR is just a option and i think it is on still beta version. 
 Maybe GPU no need to much resurces work with Index and can make nice good quality Picture, LIKE Quest 2 need more reserses to make nice picture. I don't know that just think about that, and that why I ask about help with that maybe someone had experiance with that, becasue i don't want spend lot of money and results will be the same.
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Edited May 16, 2022 by Ericcaff

[TylerPL666]

1 hour ago, Ericcaff said:

Is it help me increse FPS and stable work, if it is just incres 3FPS that is nothing

With 5GHz like me and 3080 u should run stable 45fps in Apache on Multiplayer, 60fps any other module, 90fps during freelook/lobby/menu. Just find the beauty (course) of tweaking, optimizing, benchmarking, compering, testing, more testing, more comearing.... its realy fun, and overwelming in first digging thru forums. But Im shure youre be ok. Im defenetly more than 2000h+ in air, and Im 100% sure same amount of time I spend "trying to run DCS with better FPS". 

Edited May 16, 2022 by TylerPL666

[Ericcaff]

20 minutes ago, TylerPL666 said:

With 5GHz like me and 3080 u should run stable 45fps in Apache on Multiplayer, 60fps any other module, 90fps during freelook/lobby/menu. Just find the beauty (course) of tweaking, optimizing, benchmarking, compering, testing, more testing, more comearing.... its realy fun, and overwelming in first digging thru forums. But Im shure youre be ok. Im defenetly more than 2000h+ in air, and Im 100% sure same amount of time I spend "trying to run DCS with better FPS". 

 

Yee you right, but im already spent lot of time for testings, im want playnig flying, not configurate my system  
Actaully im have around min 45FPS and more... but im playing with ASW i always disable, otherwise if it is on or force 45Hz i have stale FPS, but have object ghosting in Oculus Quest 2
I see you use HP Reverb G2 V2, that why I think maybe Oculus Quest work not well for PC VR gaming!  

[Mr_sukebe]

An interesting question.

We know that the 3090 is a little faster in raw horsepower, but at least in my opinion, not enough to justify the cost.

The question is whether an additional 14GB of VRAM will actually make a genuine and substantial difference.  We know that DCS will "allocate" it.  Would love to see some comparisons.

[edmuss]

As above, you have plenty of horsepower to drive DCS, but there are so many variables and system configuration options that you need to find out what's holding it back.  You can simply throw money at it (a 3090 in this case) but if the bottleneck is because you haven't set your RAM to it's correct xmp profile (for example) then it's going to make zero difference.

Before you can start to make choices as to which direction to go hardware wise you need to know what the problem is.  Get some performance metrics that give you CPU and GPU frametimes for the VR renderer (fpsvr for steamvr, openxr toolkit for openxr etc.) and then that should give you some indication of what's going on.

Plenty of people use the quest2 for DCS, technically not quite as high resolution as the G2 but by all accounts there is very little difference between the two.  Unfortunately if you can't beat refresh rate of the headset then you're going to have to live with ASW and any artifacts it might produce or suffer from a stuttery display with certain head movements.

Using openxr with my G2 and 3070 I can either: -

Reduce resolution to 75% and set the headset to run at 60Hz, disable motion reprojection (ASW equivalent) and run medium settings.  I can achieve >60 fps 95% of the time which gives a perfectly smooth experience with no artifacts, the offset is that the reduced resolution causes slightly more aliasing.

Keep resolution at 100% and set the headset to run at 90Hz, enable motion reprojection and run high settings.  With openxr it sits at 45fps and is perfectly smooth, when GPU load gets too high it drops to 30fps and is perfectly smooth, the offset it that you occasionally get some artifacts.

DCS isn't war thunder, unfortunately there's too much going on to make it a plug and play VR experience but there's plenty of information, knowledge and experience on here to get it sorted

[TylerPL666]

12 minutes ago, Ericcaff said:

Yee you right, but im already spent lot of time for testings, im want playnig flying, not configurate my system  
Actaully im have around min 45FPS and more... but im playing with ASW i always disable, otherwise if it is on or force 45Hz i have stale FPS, but have object ghosting in Oculus Quest 2
I see you use HP Reverb G2 V2, that why I think maybe Oculus Quest work not well for PC VR gaming!  

With OC CPU make shure that your Power Supply Plan is set to high performance, cause on Balanced my CPU was running at 800-1000MHz. Easy to check in Task Manager:

 

VS

 

[Ericcaff]

Just made video with multiplayer system monitoring, after flying around 50 minutes with stable 72FPS, than fly closer to ground objects FPS start jumping. GPU almost all time work on full  Look like really GPU not enough.

CPU usage 15%

GPU usage 99% VRAM 99%

RAM uage 75%

 

Edited May 16, 2022 by Ericcaff

[Ericcaff]

4 hours ago, TylerPL666 said:

With OC CPU make shure that your Power Supply Plan is set to high performance, cause on Balanced my CPU was running at 800-1000MHz. Easy to check in Task Manager:
 

 

Im have this on default, my system always on Max pawer plan and my CPU overclocked , but anyway CPU usage is about 20%, but GPU totally on Max.

 

[Ericcaff]

5 hours ago, edmuss said:

As above, you have plenty of horsepower to drive DCS, but there are so many variables and system configuration options that you need to find out what's holding it back.  You can simply throw money at it (a 3090 in this case) but if the bottleneck is because you haven't set your RAM to it's correct xmp profile (for example) then it's going to make zero difference.

CAN YOU PLEASE EXPLANE WHAT IS XMP PROFILE?

Keep resolution at 100% and set the headset to run at 90Hz, enable motion reprojection and run high settings.  With openxr it sits at 45fps and is perfectly smooth, when GPU load gets too high it drops to 30fps and is perfectly smooth, the offset it that you occasionally get some artifacts.

ALSO PLEASE CAN YOU EXPLANE WHAT IS THAT openxr, HOW IT IS WORK AND HOW I SET IT AND CONFIGURATE FOR MY QUEST2?

 

 

Edited May 16, 2022 by Ericcaff

[edmuss]

23 minutes ago, Ericcaff said:

 

 

The current ram speed will be shown on the performance/ram tab in task manager, alternatively install cpuz and that will tell you what is currently running at and what the spd profiles are (these are the same as the xmp).

There's a small thread on here about setting up openxr, it's primarily intended for WMR headsets but people with quest2 have used it and reported good improvements. It won't necessarily improve performance massively though.

[dburne]

ED needs to provide native Open XR support. Does a pretty good job with MSFS 2020. Offer that along with TAA anti-aliasing would be very nice.

However I am sure it is not on their list of things to do at this time.

[ismaeljorda]

A few weeks ago I replaced my 3080Ti (12GB) for a 3090Ti (24GB) and found that running DCS on a 4K monitor the RTX 3090Ti only performs 10% more fps than the 3080Ti, but things change when we fly in VR, getting 150% extra performance. For some reason 3090Ti's 24GB of VRAM suits DCS VR just fine. This is a very aggressive and disproportionate test since everything is maxed out, but it makes the comparison even more impressive. This benchmark isn't about speed, its about DCS using a lot of VRAM.

Please, ignore the Avg FPS because it is the average of the whole VR session, main menu included. Look at the fps in real time to make the comparison. 3080Ti: 15 fps / 3090Ti: 39 fps

I have done other tests with more reasonable graphics options and the percentage difference 3080Ti Vs. 3090Ti is very similar.

I've also noticed that my fps no longer suddenly drops from 45fps to 10-15fps for a few minutes like it did with the 3080Ti, but stays stable throughout the VR session. Also my experience with the 3090Ti is much smoother and stutter-free, so I'm afraid at this point DCS VR requires 24GB of VRAM, at least with high resolution HMDs. Perhaps other users can confirm this.

Cheers!
Ismael
 

 

[Ericcaff]

12 hours ago, ismaeljorda said:

A few weeks ago I replaced my 3080Ti (12GB) for a 3090Ti (24GB) and found that running DCS on a 4K monitor the RTX 3090Ti only performs 10% more fps than the 3080Ti, but things change when we fly in VR, getting 150% extra performance. For some reason 3090Ti's 24GB of VRAM suits DCS VR just fine. This is a very aggressive and disproportionate test since everything is maxed out, but it makes the comparison even more impressive. This benchmark isn't about speed, its about DCS using a lot of VRAM.

Please, ignore the Avg FPS because it is the average of the whole VR session, main menu included. Look at the fps in real time to make the comparison. 3080Ti: 15 fps / 3090Ti: 39 fps

I have done other tests with more reasonable graphics options and the percentage difference 3080Ti Vs. 3090Ti is very similar.

I've also noticed that my fps no longer suddenly drops from 45fps to 10-15fps for a few minutes like it did with the 3080Ti, but stays stable throughout the VR session. Also my experience with the 3090Ti is much smoother and stutter-free, so I'm afraid at this point DCS VR requires 24GB of VRAM, at least with high resolution HMDs. Perhaps other users can confirm this.

 

Thank you for your reply and opinion, but please tell me what VR device do you use, and in video comparing is it same PC with same VR headset just with different GPU?

[ismaeljorda]

hace 21 horas, Ericcaff dijo:

Thank you for your reply and opinion, but please tell me what VR device do you use, and in video comparing is it same PC with same VR headset just with different GPU?

That's right. Same PC with same VR headset (Varjo Aero @ 2932x2516 per eye which is 50% of total resolution) with different GPU 3080Ti (12GB) Vs. 3090Ti (24GB).
At the bottom of the video is the info.

[𝓥𝓲𝓵𝓮]

First off, don't buy a 3090 now, in three months the 4000 series will be released and it should be a massive upgrade in performance over the 3000 series.

Secondly, a Valve Index will not work any better then the quest 2, and the quality is much worse, as it has a lower resolution.

Anyway, you say you're getting bad FPS, but you're not saying how bad. Give us a number. I have a 3090 and i get 35-40 FPS while on the ground with a Quest2 in multiplayer. In the air it gets a little better, usually staying above 50. That's just the reality of running VR on a 2008 game.

We'll probably get a big performance boost when we'll get the Vulkan update, but other then that we really can't do much to get more frames.

[Ericcaff]

Thx all for any Info, yesterday get good deal change my Gigabyte RTX 3080OC 10GB to MSi RTX 3090 Vision x3 OC 24GB with some extra pay. 

 Actually in non VR performance about +10%, in VR I think also about +10% in total I want say different not big, but 3090 have little bit more resource that's why also can work little bit better. But in totally if you have 3080 and you plan buy 3090 for full price, im not recommended that!!!

With my new MSi 3090 im again still in testing progress abaout best optimal settings.

Edited May 21, 2022 by Ericcaff

[javelina1]

1 hour ago, Ericcaff said:

Thx all for any Info, yesterday get good deal change my Gigabyte RTX 3080OC 10GB to MSi RTX 3090 Vision x3 OC 24GB with some extra pay. 

 Actually in non VR performance about +10%, in VR I think also about +10% in total I want say different not big, but 3090 have little bit more resource what why also can work little bit better. But in totally if you have 3080 and you plan buy 3090 for full price, im not recommended that!!!

With my new MSi 3090 im again still in testing progress abaout best optimal settings.

cool!  you'll love the VRAM!

[Ericcaff]

Centinue testing, multiplayer mission in server around 15 players, almost all time work well on 72FPS just in some places where is lot of objects go down FPS to 35FPS, this is lowest what I saw.
CPU 15% : RAM 85% : GPU 90% : VRAM 90% (21GB used)
Game settings little bit increased:

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Edited May 22, 2022 by Ericcaff