[4YA] WWII - Project Overlord - historically accurate DCS 1944 server

[Skewgear]

Presenting the 4YA WWII server and the Project Overlord mission design team.

Project Overlord aims to recreate the aerial battlefields of June and July 1944 over Normandy during the Allied invasion of Occupied France. We strive for as-close-to-perfect historical accuracy as we can get within the limits of DCS.

The server runs missions based on particular dates within the Normandy campaign. At the moment these are scattered between different points in time ranging between 4th June and mid-July 1944 but we aim to fill in the gaps as our research archive expands and DCS evolves to let us build more cool new features into our missions.

In-game ethos is open play: we build the battlefield and set out mission objectives to complete (bombing, strafing and flying reconnaissance sorties, shooting down and escorting bomber flights, and so on) but what you do on each sortie is up to the pilot. You can also connect LotATC for fighter controller duties, vectoring your fellow players to their targets and away from enemies, and we're rolling out Combined Arms flak guns that can be manned at strategic points around the map.

The DCS F10 map shows you the frontline and where the ground targets are. The in-game comms menu shows you target status (destroyed or complete) and can be used to turn on or off our EWRS, which tells you where the two nearest enemy aircraft are at intervals of around 5-7 minutes.

 

Statistics

We have a simple stats system on the Project Overlord website: https://projectoverlord.co.uk/stats/

There you can track your kills, broken down into various categories. We're working on deaths and bailouts and hope to have these up soon.

The stats page sorts by username as default so you can also see how your squadron mates are doing. At the time of writing we have around 450 active pilots who've scored a kill (the true number on the server is higher than that - not everyone scores a kill!)

 

Scoring

We have a server-side scoring system that determines mission victory for each side, with plans to integrate the number of mission wins into the stats server later down the line. For now the in-mission points system assigns lots of points for completing a mission objective, varying depending on how hard each one is; lots of points for successfully escorting bombers (defined as more than 3/4 or so making it home in one piece); and slightly fewer points for destroying units dotted around the map. Points are allocated to each side in-mission.

 

History

We are very dedicated to historical accuracy and are polishing our missions to incorporate actual WW2 objectives and sorties as part of server gameplay. Lots of the history can be found online for free but we've also invested in subscriptions to various historical reference sites so we can fully research our mission elements. Here's an example: https://projectoverlord.co.uk/blog/2022/05/15/the-most-historically-accurate-objective-in-4ya-ww2-recon-4th-june-1944/

The bedrock of our research is a library of around 100 digitised operational record books relating to Second Tactical Air Force squadrons of the RAF, downloaded from the National Archives, and the German equivalent for JG27. From these we extract details of raids, sorties and ground targets, and we have a number of spreadsheets with each of these details painstakingly entered and cross-referenced. We also use published historical reference books about the Normandy air war as well as these primary sources.

 

Squadrons and finding a wingman

There are a number of active squadrons, or groups of likeminded players, on the server. Details of these can be found in the 4YA Discord (look for the WWII section). If you're not already on Discord it's a little fiddly to sign up but once you're in the 4YA server our WWII channels are a great way to chat about tactics, aircraft operation, ask for help and to hang out with likeminded folk. Click here to join: https://discord.gg/xVsfvpRdpa

 

To join the 4YA WWII server you must have the Normandy map, the TF-51D and the WW2 Asset Pack installed. We're rolling out recon missions for the TF-51D so there is a growing number of tasks you have to complete in that airframe - a great way to check it all out!

We also strongly recommend SRS, the DCS radio standalone client. The server is SRS enabled and used for pilots to talk to each other in-game as well as for radar operators and ground flak gun crews to communicate.

 

We look forward to welcoming you into the skies of Normandy 1944!

[Callsign112]

Kudos for the recon missions and giving the TF-51D a role on your server.

[Skewgear]

On 6/4/2022 at 2:53 PM, Callsign112 said:

Kudos for the recon missions and giving the TF-51D a role on your server.

It's slowly getting there - digging out the historical information on photo-recce F-6s takes time. For the moment we're building them in as 400 Sqn RCAF sorties, as we have 400's ORB in our research archive and access to 400's detailed sortie routes via the National Collection of Aerial Photography, although the TF-51D doesn't have an RAF livery so it's a little bit inaccurate...

Seeing as everyone has the TF-51D (it's free!) I figure it's a good way of dipping your toe into DCS WW2. The asset pack is a barrier to entry but if you pick it up on a sale it's less of a hit.

This link is an interesting quick read about photo-recce Mustang production: https://erenow.net/ww/mustang-thoroughbred-stallion-of-the-air/7.php

[Callsign112]

Agreed! As you suggested, I think it's a great invitation to expand interest in DCS WWII, and MP game play in general. One of the things that never ceases to amaze me about DCS World as a platform is the strength of its community. Thanks again to you and your group for all the dedication and hard work.  

[Spirale]

Great WW2 server , THX

[Mr_sukebe]

Is MW50 available or restricted?

[Skewgear]

Available. About a third of Me109K-4s per mission have MW50. Usually flying from Evreux or Goulet.

[Jafferson]

I play a lot on the server, most time allies. Sometimes I feel a bit lost in the first missions when allies spawn at the island to cross the channel, it's a huge area and everybody is all over the place. Don't know if this is historical accurate, but i would like to see the 30-NA with a beacon to find Flight leader and wingman.

I have noticed that axis got a really hard time RTB to Argentan and Euvrax, so they choose Lasay. Sad the direction finder still bugs, is it possible to add maybe Ballons or something else to find this bases?

Bad scoring is demotivating new players, good decision to not show the death count

I really enjoy this server, thx

[IIIJG52_Otto_]

11 hours ago, Skewgear said:

Available. About a third of Me109K-4s per mission have MW50. Usually flying from Evreux or Goulet.

So we will have only a third of P-47´s with ADI (Anti-detonant water-Methanol injection) too?? 

Edited June 6, 2022 by IIIJG52_Otto_

[Night Owl]

vor 11 Stunden schrieb IIIJG52_Otto_:

So we will have only a third of P-47´s with ADI (Anti-detonant water-Methanol injection) too?? 

 

I can hardly see why, as already in early 1943 P-47Ds were equipped with the water-injection system. 

[IIIJG52_Otto_]

17 hours ago, Night Owl said:

I can hardly see why, as already in early 1943 P-47Ds were equipped with the water-injection system. 

Soo, remove the P-51D who did'n enter in service in Europe until March of 1944, when Bf-109 G6ASM, G-10, and K-4 were deploying.

[71st_AH Rob]

5 hours ago, IIIJG52_Otto_ said:

Soo, remove the P-51D who did'n enter in service in Europe until March of 1944, when Bf-109 G6ASM, G-10, and K-4 were deploying.

Do you know when D-Day happened?

And maybe you should check the dates on the K-4 deployment.

Edited June 8, 2022 by 71st_AH Rob

[IIIJG52_Otto_]

3 hours ago, 71st_AH Rob said:

Do you know when D-Day happened?

And maybe you should check the dates on the K-4 deployment.

 

As far as i know, the P-51D had not enter in service in Europe at june 6th of 1944, (D-day), moreover, 2/3 of Spitfires in service were Mk-V. 

So to disable the MW-50  system of the Bf-109K4's arguing "historical accuracy" is only a ugly lack of sportsmanship,

Edited June 8, 2022 by IIIJG52_Otto_

[Mr_sukebe]

Being fair to 4YA, it's their server and their rules.  Regardless of whether or not we ourselves might use the server, I'm just grateful that groups like 4YA are happy to spend the time, energy and money to host.

Edited June 8, 2022 by Mr_sukebe

[71st_AH Rob]

43 minutes ago, IIIJG52_Otto_ said:

As far as i know, the P-51D had not enter in service in Europe at june 6th of 1944, (D-day), moreover, 2/3 of Spitfires in service were Mk-V. 

So to disable the MW-50  system of the Bf-109K4's arguing "historical accuracy" is only a ugly lack of sportsmanship,

 

Well then, I suggest you check your facts then.

As @Mr_sukebe says, it is their server, their rules and I think that they are being more than sporting making concessions in allowing MW50 for the K-4 as is. 

Some quick facts:

Precisely 0 K-4, with or without MW50 flew over the Normandy or Channel maps.

Almost 20% of the P-51s in service in Europe at the time of the invasion were D models.

In all of France and Belgium, not just Normandy, on 6 June there were less than 125 Single Engine day fighters about 2/3 were Fw-190A models the remainder were obsolete Bf-109Gs that were relegated to intercept bombers. Yes after 6 June, Bf-109 équipes Gruppe were rushed to France as a stop gap but the Fw-190A-8 remained the best fighters available to the Luftwaffe for the duration of the battle.

Yes, there were Spitfire Mk.V still in service in England at the time, none participate in the invasion because they are allocated to trg squadrons and squadrons on rest or in-reserve status, they would not fly them on operations. The Mk V had been replaced in front line squadrons by the Mk IX in 1943. They had so many of them available that they had started to ship them to the Soviets to replace the Mk Vs they had given them earlier. You would be far more likely to see a Mk XIV over Normandy than a Mk V.

By the way, do you know when III/JG52 got the K-4? It was one of the first in Nov 44, while in Warzyn on the Eastern front. Most units didn't receive any until Jan 45.

[Jafferson]

Ain't think it's possible to recreate everything painstakingly, we can only use te stuff we got right now.

[IIIJG52_Otto_]

4 hours ago, 71st_AH Rob said:

As @Mr_sukebe says, it is their server, their rules

And yes!, all of us are agree in this. ..but as occurred before in here in DCS WWII, and IL2-GB servers, people finally could start asking why the server is empty of enemy pilots.
As @Jafferson said "we can only use te stuff we got right now" 

4 hours ago, 71st_AH Rob said:

Precisely 0 K-4, with or without MW50 flew over the Normandy or Channel maps.

Almost 20% of the P-51s in service in Europe at the time of the invasion were D models.

In all of France and Belgium, not just Normandy, on 6 June there were less than 125 Single Engine day fighters about 2/3 were Fw-190A models the remainder were obsolete Bf-109Gs that were relegated to intercept bombers. Yes after 6 June, Bf-109 équipes Gruppe were rushed to France as a stop gap but the Fw-190A-8 remained the best fighters available to the Luftwaffe for the duration of the battle.

Yes, there were Spitfire Mk.V still in service in England

Precisely ZERO P-51D´s flew over Normady the D-day, the totally of Mustangs in Overlord Operation were P-51B and C.

correcting myself about i said before. First pair of P-51D´s were delivered in Europe in july 1944. They were two Ex-USAAF airframes, re-named MUSTANG IV operated by RAF A&AEE a Test unit. 
The two aircraft were given the RAF serial numbers TK586 and TK589, both serving only at Boscombe Dcwn until they were struck off charge in 1946 and early 1947 respectively.
An order was eventually placed for 874 aircraft, the first of which were delivered in September 1944.
I.A.W the book; Haynes, North American P-51 Mustang Owners' Workshop Manual


First 75 Bf-109K4´s were delivered to JG77 fighter group for traning purposes in the second half of August 1944, at  Neuruppin air base (north of Berlin)
The first combat engagement of Bf 109K-4s with an enemy, took place on November 2, 1944, against a formation of 1174 bombers set out for the heart of Germany to raid petrol industry in Gelsenkirchen, Castrop-Rauxel and Leuna.  I.A.W. the book MESSERSCHMITT BF-109K by Janda & Poruba - JAPO PUBLISHING -
 
This mean there were not P-51D´s, and no were K4´s, in real "operation Overlord",..  so what kind of historic accuracy do we want?. 

[Skewgear]

23 minutes ago, IIIJG52_Otto_ said:

This mean there were not P-51D´s, and no were K4´s, in real "operation Overlord",..  so what kind of historic accuracy do we want?. 

Your posts here seem to be trolling for attention or to start an argument rather than asking genuine questions or making meaningful, positive contributions.

However, many more people read than post and this particular question should be answered.

We make do with what we have. The DCS plane set is really designed for January 1945, not June 1944. No P-51D, Me109K or Fw190Ds were flown during Normandy, in reality. But if we deleted those from the server we'd have very little left to fly (Spitfire, Mosquito, Fw190A). So we compromise. In reality every German airfield on the map except Evreux was abandoned long before the invasion, but we choose to ignore that in favour of fun gameplay. If Dreux airfield is added with the Paris expansion perhaps we can look again at historical basing.

If ED brings out a Me109G we'll certainly replace all 109Ks immediately, ditto for a P-51B/C or razorback P-47.

Edited June 8, 2022 by Skewgear
edit to mention Dreux

[Tree_Beard]

As time goes by, I find myself getting more frustrated at the frankly bizarre map development choices ED has made for DCS WW2 (assuming there was any communication between Ugra and ED prior to developing Normandy and Channel). Two literally overlapping maps of the same location with very limited relevance for the set of assets we have in the game. I mean come on. 

I applaud the creators of this server for trying to make something at least somewhat historically believable within these constraints. Keep up the good work, guys. 

[71st_AH Rob]

3 hours ago, IIIJG52_Otto_ said:

Precisely ZERO P-51D´s flew over Normady the D-day, the totally of Mustangs in Overlord Operation were P-51B and C.

 
This mean there were not P-51D´s, and no were K4´s, in real "operation Overlord",..  so what kind of historic accuracy do we want?. 

Again, I urge you to do your research.  Above you can see a photo of the 361st FG, 8th AF purportedly on D-Day, although I can find no evidence that they flew any missions on that day and it is likely the 7th of June when they flew support missions for the invasion, they strafed trains and veh traffic reinforcing the defenders on the beach..  Regardless you can be assured that it is in June 1944 because of the invasion stripes that were ordered painted on the 4th of June and removed from the upper surfaces at the end of the  month so it must have been taken between the 5th of June and the beginning of July.  you can see clearly a D model in the center of the photo. 

Here is a photo of the same group taken on the 8th of July, half of the a/c are Ds. 

There was a stockpile of D models in England.  There are two main reasons why they were not more common over the Normandy invasion:

They did not need to replace the B/C models since they were not being lost at the rate they anticipated and

The pilots were attached to their B/C models and in fact many preferred them because:

• They were Faster;
• They were more manoeuvrable; and
• They were more accurate because they were more stable.

There were disadvantages as well of course, all these things are a trade off.

• They only had four MG as opposed to six in the D model;
• The MG were more prone to jam when fired under high G;  and
• the D had greater range due to the wing redesign and therefore more combat time over Berlin which was the real reason the USAAF wanted them.

The K-4 without MW50 for outperforms any 109G with MW50 that was available at the time.  So, again, I think that the server is more than fair in the interest of appeasing the Luftwaffe player in allowing some to have MW50.  Hopefully we get a time appropriate Bf-109G soon so the K-4 can be removed.

[Bozon]

The only thing that bums me on this server is that the Mosquitoes are all in England, so it means spending 20+ minutes to cross the channel. Immersive, but usually means I will not have the time for more than 1 sortie per session (unless I die really fast, which is not comforting).

This would not be so bad had the Channel map were used - but then the action would not be over Normandy… oh well.

At least on earlier missions all allied are still based in England, so my Mosquito, my invisible navigator, and I are not alone and far removed from the action.

[Bozon]

Oh, remembered another things:

The server always resets the mission at the same real world hour. This always happens 10 minutes after my usual hours (late Euro evening) - so I take off from England (Mosquito) and a few minutes into crossing the channel I get the “20 minutes” mission end warning. This pretty much wastes half of my session without getting into any action.

Would it be possible to randomize the mission restart real-world hour by a small amount? 

[grafspee]

@71st_AH Rob You forgot to add that P-51 B/C model with fabric and with out angle of incidence modification of horizontal stabilizer, was prone to porpoising effect at high speed dives, it was fixed in late D models and later on applied to remaining B/C models and early D models as well.

DCS P-51 act exactly as late P-51 models, manual describes in high speed dives, after this changes significant aft stick deflection was required to maintain dive angle with speed increase, but porpoising effect was gone and plane become recoverable from every speed.

 

Edited June 9, 2022 by grafspee

[Skewgear]

9 hours ago, Bozon said:

Oh, remembered another things:

The server always resets the mission at the same real world hour. This always happens 10 minutes after my usual hours (late Euro evening) - so I take off from England (Mosquito) and a few minutes into crossing the channel I get the “20 minutes” mission end warning. This pretty much wastes half of my session without getting into any action.

Would it be possible to randomize the mission restart real-world hour by a small amount? 

This should already be happening. Maybe our randomisation of new mission lengths has accidentally lined them back up again. Will check.

This week's release of our 5th June mission should help, though. From the 4YA Discord (link to join is in first post of this thread):

Mission 5th June 1944 D-Day Night V1.22 - now in the regular rotation!

We are now launching our night mission as a 2-hour long intermission in our usual mission selection. Experience the challenge and thrill of night flying, and the excitement of taking part in the first hours of D-Day.

Mission features:
- Night time - check your DCS gamma setting in the options menu
- Illumination for airfields can be requested using F10 radio menu
- Large-scale C-47 wave of the airborne landings, following their historically accurate route
- Allied bomber raids carrying out historical missions
- Large invasion fleet, to be found and attacked by the Axis side
- Historical ground targets for Mosquito squadrons deep behind enemy lines

Edited June 9, 2022 by Skewgear
bold

[IIIJG52_Otto_]

12 hours ago, 71st_AH Rob said:

you can see clearly a D model in the center of the photo. 

Yes,  i can see that 1/8 of the P-51´s in that picture were P-51D.   I still don't see the reason to disable the MW-50 of the K-4, and nothing in the P-51D, or Spitfire Mk-IX.