VR performance

[Hammer1-1]

im thinking its tied together.

[YoYo]

Better textures incoming, Thx Razbam but what about optimalizations for trees/urban area?

 

[YoYo]

Numbers are hard to argue with, so I decided to show the problem of this map in VR (but as you saw, 2D users noticed the same problems). By comparison, I give Syria because it is the most demanding of all maps. With others (like Caucasus, PG or Nevada) the results are even better and an even greater gulf opens up. I  give a few selected examples. These are examples that describe the overall experience, not just the screenshot shown.

The most important thing here is the FRAMETIME GPU which affects FPS and reprojection performance (if someone has it enabled), so you can check frametime numbers. It should be noted that it should be in the range of 15-19 ms (of course the less the better), ideally for the image in VR should be smooth (which gives this range more or less).

1/ Forest - there is not much of it and these are smaller areas than, for example, in the Caucasus or in Syria but work worse (dont know why, maybe size of textures or too many unnecessary things / objects on the trees models? On SA map it has a MR problem, FPS cannot keep up if you fly close to the ground:

here is ok for me (and stable 45 fps)

Syria, great performace for me (stable 45 fps)

SA, 20-22 ms + unstable FPS, not a big drama but stutter is noticable, not like on Syria or Caucasus map 

2/ Urban Area.

Ok, the biggest problem for me, the most demanding place for FPS is Aleppo on the whole Syria map.

Unstable FPS, but not bad, 21 ms gives stutter like Forest on SA map, its noticable but not a tragedy.

Syria, medium city - its ok for me, 18-19ms gives near stable 45 fps still, not perfect but its quite ok.

Lets see SA map :

- notice, im far from the city!!! Unstable FPS too.

Other place, over city, stutter, stutter, not smooth flight at low alt too

This is the best place for test, what the hell is here? Big drama, yep (here, the FPS can drop even to 16 FPS ).

Port Stanley works for me like ... BIG Aleppo from Syria .... Acceptable, but in such a small town there should be no problem with FPS

3/ Other places (no urban area, airports and forest)

Of course, I also agree that the map is capable of generating good time and FPS, like here, or when you are above 1500ft over the ground or on high alt but that's normal in such a situation:

Summing up - in my opinion:

the map needs optimization of the objects for sure. As you can see in the example of other maps, you are able to do it calmly, maybe it takes some extra work or advices from ED side. I would like to enjoy the map, but now I cannot say it only and exclusively because of optimization. Please do not add anything else to the map until this problem is fixed, no new objects and new content (only higher resolution textures can be added, they do not affect FPS). Adding new content without doing any optimization work will only cause more problems for us VR users (but 2D too). Id like to add that Im on RTX 3090 so it's hard for me to imagine what the others have( my settings http://yoyosims.pl/sites/default/files/Obrazki/WMR/dcs_vr_settingsmain.jpg - mix of medium + high, nothing special, res 2600pxt) . There are some voices that the map works well, but from what you can see, someone is flying high or not paying attention to FPS, maybe not having experience in this topic how to test it (sorry to say). I approach the subject very objectively, if it is ok, I praise it, if I don't say what it's and what I see. I hope this helps diagnose the problem.

Pretty please take this into account and give us some hope and plan that you will work on it in the first place. Thank You!

 

Edited June 15, 2022 by YoYo

[Strikeeagle345]

On 6/9/2022 at 4:43 PM, YoYo said:

Sorry but It cant be true or you do inaccurate tests (you wrote also that near all in settings you have on High level). It isnt possible to have stable FPS on urban area and near trees (larger forest). If you are in the cosmos, you can reach good FPS or when you are on empty places - here right but not on low, urban/airports level below 1000ft. Im on 3090, not on 2080 and see here an issue, like many in this topic. What I wrote before, if your GPU has stable 45 fps and you gaurantee this, sell me it, I'll pay the price of 3090. 

Few next topic about performance problem (and you havent it, really strange):

(I see that on urban area some people in 2D have 25-30 FPS).

 

Don't know what to tell you. I don't have these issues, it runs great. Maybe I am lucky and it's just my combo of hardware, who knows. I am very happy with my setup. I will say, prior to my CPU overclock, I was running into those issues. I OCed it and it all went away.

Textures are all on high, water on high, heatblur off (looks like crap), traffic off, shadows low, in cockpit screen res. 512, msaa on 2x, ssaa off, clouds standard, trees and grass on max, preload max, chimney smoke off, anisotropic filtering 16x, terrain shadow default, raindrops on, rest is at default.

i7-9700K OC@ 5ghz
MSI pro-carbon MoBo
32gb 3200
NVMe Samsung Pro
GTX 2080

[YoYo]

1 hour ago, Strikeeagle345 said:

Don't know what to tell you. I don't have these issues, it runs great. Maybe I am lucky and it's just my combo of hardware, who knows. I am very happy with my setup. I will say, prior to my CPU overclock, I was running into those issues. I OCed it and it all went away.

Textures are all on high, water on high, heatblur off (looks like crap), traffic off, shadows low, in cockpit screen res. 512, msaa on 2x, ssaa off, clouds standard, trees and grass on max, preload max, chimney smoke off, anisotropic filtering 16x, terrain shadow default, raindrops on, rest is at default.

i7-9700K OC@ 5ghz
MSI pro-carbon MoBo
32gb 3200
NVMe Samsung Pro
GTX 2080

You didnt listen . I wrote before to you, if you guarantee (as only one) that the map works better than the others on low level and you have stable FPS at your home I can give you my 3090 and I'll take your 2080 LOL. What you wrote sounds totally incredible. Above you have exact arguments in the form of screenshots, timing and FPS. The settings do not matter completely because the comparison is to other maps with the same settings, so I don't know what it is for. If you want to show something, please take a screenshot, fire up fpsVR and test it. Give us both results on Ushuaia Heliport below 1000ft looking up close at the city (or better short movie with internal DCS FPS on). You also did not write on what goggles you fly and what precise resolution you have there. All my friends has the same problem, my friends on 2D screen has -50% fps in SA airports (land) compared to big airports from PG or Syria so sorry, I cant belive that "for me it works great" on urban areas here. It sounds unbelievable without any data for me. What you can see on this map the GPU is choking and clogging and uses near 19-20Gb of virtula memory (DCS feature so this is quite ok).

If its so good, where do the next such topics come from (and every day there are such new posts from others, 2D users too)?

 

Edited June 15, 2022 by YoYo

[Hammer1-1]

1 hour ago, Strikeeagle345 said:

Don't know what to tell you. I don't have these issues, it runs great. Maybe I am lucky and it's just my combo of hardware, who knows. I am very happy with my setup. I will say, prior to my CPU overclock, I was running into those issues. I OCed it and it all went away.

Textures are all on high, water on high, heatblur off (looks like crap), traffic off, shadows low, in cockpit screen res. 512, msaa on 2x, ssaa off, clouds standard, trees and grass on max, preload max, chimney smoke off, anisotropic filtering 16x, terrain shadow default, raindrops on, rest is at default.

i7-9700K OC@ 5ghz
MSI pro-carbon MoBo
32gb 3200
NVMe Samsung Pro
GTX 2080

I have a higher o/c than you do and I run into the exact same symptoms YoYo mention. You may indeed be lucky, but my system is seriously leaned out to max out performance just short of Process Lasso and really theres nothing else I CAN do to get better fps in SA. Quite literally nothing else; I use OpenOVR, shader mods, driver tweaks for nvidia, culled background programs that arent necessary and no aftermarket A/V software installed. Quite literally have to avoid half the map to get playable frames. The next thing I can do is add more memory and thats it.  The fact theres like 6-8 airports in the whole map makes it a little easier to avoid the map until a later date.

Edited June 15, 2022 by Hammer1-1

[Strikeeagle345]

20 hours ago, YoYo said:

You didnt listen . I wrote before to you, if you guarantee (as only one) that the map works better than the others on low level and you have stable FPS at your home I can give you my 3090 and I'll take your 2080 LOL. What you wrote sounds totally incredible. Above you have exact arguments in the form of screenshots, timing and FPS. The settings do not matter completely because the comparison is to other maps with the same settings, so I don't know what it is for. If you want to show something, please take a screenshot, fire up fpsVR and test it. Give us both results on Ushuaia Heliport below 1000ft looking up close at the city (or better short movie with internal DCS FPS on). You also did not write on what goggles you fly and what precise resolution you have there. All my friends has the same problem, my friends on 2D screen has -50% fps in SA airports (land) compared to big airports from PG or Syria so sorry, I cant belive that "for me it works great" on urban areas here. It sounds unbelievable without any data for me. What you can see on this map the GPU is choking and clogging and uses near 19-20Gb of virtula memory (DCS feature so this is quite ok).

If its so good, where do the next such topics come from (and every day there are such new posts from others, 2D users too)?

 

 

Like I said, it works fine for me. I am not selling anything from my setup since it works . I know people that have these issues as well and I have no idea what causes them and why I do not experience them.  I also do not have the time to grab test shots to post them for you. I am very busy. I am running on a Reverb G2. SteamVR is set to native resolution and in game PD is 1.0.

19 hours ago, Hammer1-1 said:

I have a higher o/c than you do and I run into the exact same symptoms YoYo mention. You may indeed be lucky, but my system is seriously leaned out to max out performance just short of Process Lasso and really theres nothing else I CAN do to get better fps in SA. Quite literally nothing else; I use OpenOVR, shader mods, driver tweaks for nvidia, culled background programs that arent necessary and no aftermarket A/V software installed. Quite literally have to avoid half the map to get playable frames. The next thing I can do is add more memory and thats it.  The fact theres like 6-8 airports in the whole map makes it a little easier to avoid the map until a later date.

 

Yeah, no clue man. As mentioned about, some of my buddies experience the same thing and it makes no sense to me. They have better systems than I do. I am not running any shader mods / vr mods. Everything is stock. I am afraid to change anything hardware wise on my system.

[YoYo]

I added few more tests (from the other topic):

my "favorite" Ushuaia airport. First Id like to show Aleppo and Dubai, on PG map great performace, near 16-18 ms (so like over Caucasus map) on PG reprojection works perfect plus very good FPS even on big Dubai +Intl airport, over Aleppo small stutter is visible. Notice too that PG buildings are very detailed too and we have a plenty of this in the city - no any problem here, Aleppo, most demending place for me for FPS in all maps (I have all):

And Ushuaia airport. Ground (for comparison, keep this runway and the same direction) and low level flight (500-800ft):

Tragedy  (now).

I'm surprised there is no feedback (why? rather, I think it's an obligation when the customer returns to the service with his car, for example) from the authors of this map (about plan to solve it), maybe I wrote more about it but we have many voices about this issue, even from 2D users (for example my friend who fly on 2D screen has ... 50% less FPS on SA map on airports than on Syrian, Caucasus or PG big airports. For him its ok (because he has still 35-55 FPS, normally he has about 100-120, but for VR users is very visible). Oddly enough, SA has less detail on and around the buildings, so the more the results should be much better than in Syria even. Something is not serious and strange here.

Really, I dont need new object now, it will only get worse. Please make this map work like Syria and it will be great (urban, forest and airports performance)! 

Edited June 18, 2022 by YoYo

[Deano87]

I have the exact same VR performance issues as @YoYo , with similar difference compared to other maps.

[XCNuse]

On 6/18/2022 at 5:00 AM, YoYo said:

maybe I wrote more about it but we have many voices about this issue, even from 2D users (for example my friend who fly on 2D screen has ... 50% less FPS on SA map on airports than on Syrian, Caucasus or PG big airports. For him its ok (because he has still 35-55 FPS, normally he has about 100-120, but for VR users is very visible). 

Consider your friend lucky then.

After an hour or so flight and returning to airfields, I'm generally ending up with <20 FPS in 2D

And I'm still trying to figure out why the others who fly in  group in VR seem to not have whatever this issue is that I'm getting!

 

There is something very very wrong with the map around airports; and definitely affects some of us more than others.

I watched one of my group Viper guys do a touch and go at Rio Gallegos; and my FPS dipped down to 3!

THREE!!!! FPS.

 

Something is very very wrong.

I've never had that low of an FPS in DCS before in my life.

[YoYo]

Ok, we are near one month after release. Dear devs, any news about your progress of improving FPS on SA map? Did you find a reason of poor performance in this map on low level, urban areas/forests? What we can expect?

[Raz_Specter]

On 7/2/2022 at 6:28 AM, YoYo said:

Ok, we are near one month after release. Dear devs, any news about your progress of improving FPS on SA map? Did you find a reason of poor performance in this map on low level, urban areas/forests? What we can expect?

Hi YoYo,

We are looking into this but as you can imagine we have had a bit of a list going on

thanks for you feedback

[YoYo]

8 hours ago, Raz_Specter said:

Hi YoYo,

We are looking into this but as you can imagine we have had a bit of a list going on

thanks for you feedback

Thanks for the feedback, however, pls remember, that adding new content like objects, cities etc will raise this problem only so according me better to solve it firstly, and next take care of new content, we can wait for content (no problem, really!), but can't wait for perfomance improvements .

Maybe this is an issue too:

I think that, unfortunately, the performance problem is causing a lot of people to drop out of the purchase at this stage, which isnt good. Of course it's EA, but I have to admit that right after the release on any DCS map I had no such problems as on SA, the exception of Mariana (Guam). Thank You and my fingers are crossed to solve it. 

 

Edited July 4, 2022 by YoYo

[=37.Sqn= Mjugen]

Well i will wait. Guam is very bad after one year. I want Syria performance from SA map.

[PLUTON]

Personally I would like to be able to taxi on the tarmac and take off and land with the same fps as in flight (ie today 50/60 fps) because for the moment below 800 feet my fps drops to the point that it becomes unplayable ( between 5 and 10 fps max) and that anywhere on the South Atlantic maps

[YoYo]

I saw one interesting post that this map was created on different SDK than Syria, PG and other maps. So maybe here is a reason of poor FPS at low level (below 1500ft)?  Maybe the conversion (3D objects only) would help. Just idea. 

20th F1 incoming so it will be nice to use it from airports level ;>.

 

Edited July 13, 2022 by YoYo

[PeneCruz]

On 7/13/2022 at 4:53 PM, YoYo said:

I saw one interesting post that this map was created on different SDK than Syria, PG and other maps. So maybe here is a reason of poor FPS at low level (below 1500ft)?  Maybe the conversion (3D objects only) would help. Just idea. 

I have fixed the poor below 800ft VR performance at low level by turning DCS options Terrain textures* to low. I now get smooth FPS in VR over the entire map. This is great as it means it just requires some optimization.

I do have quite a high end system so user experience may vary! but I was dropping from smooth flight to stutters every time I descended below 800ft AGL.

Edited July 19, 2022 by PeneCruz

[Hammer1-1]

ok, ummm...not to be that guy, but can I get a petition started to change the title of this thread to its correct spelling?

[YoYo]

51 minutes ago, Hammer1-1 said:

ok, ummm...not to be that guy, but can I get a petition started to change the title of this thread to its correct spelling?

Right! Done. 

[Bowman-011]

wow! The latest patch pretty much fixed the fps issue below 800ft (for me). Thanks RAZBAM

[YoYo]

7 hours ago, Bowman-011 said:

wow! The latest patch pretty much fixed the fps issue below 800ft (for me). Thanks RAZBAM

Are you sure? Maybe Placebo effect?  I dont see any word about improvements of performance in changelog 

however I didnt check this OB patch yet.

Edited July 22, 2022 by YoYo

[zb2oby]

Hey,

I've noticed a real improvment too on virgin regions. but i don't claim victory at all cause if i go on forest regions then the problem come back and after that i'm unable to recover my fps wherever i go on the map (even if i set trees to minimum in DCS settings).

But, if i relaunch the mission, and spawn wherever (except on forest) it is OK under 800ft !

=> It behaves just like there is a memory leak in forests regions

[Hammer1-1]

Ill do some trial runs this afternoon too and report back.

[fagulha]

Same performance issue below around 800ft. As soon i hit the deck, with F2 view, fps went from 120 to -45.

You can try it by yourself. Press F2, adjust the view so you´re on top looking down and zoom out/in and check fps from 800 ft below.

Edited July 22, 2022 by fagulha

[YoYo]

Ok, maybe not a deep test but according me they started to improve FPS here (if it isnt a luck of the last 1h of flying or my leak of memory ). My favorite airport USHUAIA, before patch I had it here 16-18 FPS (mostly, EDITED: however I checked my screenshots above and I had 32 too, so no any changes, stutter was present still), now I have about 32-33. Its still not perfect (stable 45 FPS for G2) and its far from the other map but it's small step forward. The other way - in Port Stanley city I dont see any differents before and after patch. So maybe they started to do something on few dedicated airports/city? I havent idea but it looks like. If they did something, the direction is good, however its still not the end according me, we are on half a way and the Team of SA map have to work on performance still to equal FPS level to for example of Syria map. Strange only that no any info in changelog so I don't exclude placebo still (or it isnt finished so they didnt decide to praise). I didnt notice any improvemnts over forest, so its a disadvantage still. Low fly on Apache again, so according me - not a big change after this patch (if there were any) and the map needs serious improvemnts still.

Edited July 22, 2022 by YoYo