777coletrain Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 A high AoA roll when going less than 300kias will pull the airplane out of the slip stream. I'm able to do this rolling to the left and the right. F16 Spin 6 08 22.trk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightwolf Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 Noticed you can also induce an uncontrollable spin by just holding forward and lateral stick input below around 300 kts. The plane doesn't seem to be able to decide what rudder input it wants which wobbles the plane out of controlled flight. Once that happens even releasing all control inputs, the FLCS just holds inputs that keep it in that spin and it doesn't recover itself. "Fighter pilots have ice in their veins. They don't have emotions. They think, anticipate. They know that fear and other concerns cloud your mind from what's going on and what you should be involved in." -Buzz Aldrin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted June 8, 2022 ED Team Share Posted June 8, 2022 I'll have the team take a look. 2 Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exorcet Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 I'm not sure if it's too easy to enter a spin/deep stall, but once you do it being unrecoverable isn't too unexpected. You need to use manual pitch override to recover. It makes a massive difference. However, don't pitch down too much or it might make things worse. 1 Awaiting: DCS F-15C Win 10 i5-9600KF 4.6 GHz 64 GB RAM RTX2080Ti 11GB -- Win 7 64 i5-6600K 3.6 GHz 32 GB RAM GTX970 4GB -- A-10C, F-5E, Su-27, F-15C, F-14B, F-16C missions in User Files Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullMetal_cooKie Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 It's even happening above 300 knots... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullMetal_cooKie Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 I'm just going to leave this here Yeah nice work... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 (edited) 44 minutes ago, FullMetal_cooKie said: I'm just going to leave this here Yeah nice work... Calm down, this is a relatively small issue. Overall the FM has been MUCH improved with this latest update! Now that being said, I can recreate the scenario you're talking about above and depart the aircraft if I apply FULL roll & pitch command at 300 knots & below in dry power only, and it seems to happen only if you do a complete rotation in roll (360 deg). Based on what I can see, it seems to be the rudder causing the issues, the FLCS seems abit conflicted as to how much rudder & in which direction in needs to be applied in a high AoA rolling maneuver below 300 knots. In full wet (full AB) power however, I can do this crazy maneuver the aircraft doesn't depart (but still the rudder is abit funky): Edited June 8, 2022 by Hummingbird 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted June 8, 2022 ED Team Share Posted June 8, 2022 56 minutes ago, FullMetal_cooKie said: I'm just going to leave this here Yeah nice work... I moved this post back to this bug report, please do not hijack other peoples threads to promote yours. The dev responsible is on vacation right now, when he returns he will have a look, but you should supply more evidence that this isn't expected behavior. Right now, whether it is right or wrong, you are only giving opinion. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DummyCatz Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) Large, simultaneous pitch and roll command and consecutive 360 degree maximum command rolls are prohibited according to -1. This is to avoid departures due to inertia roll coupling, which is a prominent issue with a relaxed static stability aircraft such as an F-16. Although the FLCS may have means to suppress it, such as reducing the AOA limit and roll rate limit, it may still happen when the inertia coupling caused pitch-up moment overwhelms the pitch-down moment generated by the horizontal stab. An example of inertia coupling caused departure in an F-16B: (This is not a spin.) Edited June 9, 2022 by DummyCatz 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DummyCatz Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) 9 hours ago, Hummingbird said: Based on what I can see, it seems to be the rudder causing the issues, the FLCS seems abit conflicted as to how much rudder & in which direction in needs to be applied in a high AoA rolling maneuver below 300 knots. I'd like to mention that when AOA > 35 deg, a function called 'Yaw Rate Limiter' activates that commands the flaperon and rudder to negate any yaw rate built-up. (You can search for it in -1). Simply put, the flaperon will deflect into the yaw, and the rudder will deflect against the yaw. But it seems that currently in DCS, the rudder also deflects into the yaw, which seems to be another bug. Edited June 9, 2022 by DummyCatz 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) Yeah I agree @DummyCatz, it's the same conclusion I've come to. Edited June 9, 2022 by Hummingbird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
777coletrain Posted June 9, 2022 Author Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) I'm fine with this if it is accurate to the actual jet, although I have noticed the rudder is very strange when below 300kts and there is a lot of adverse yaw when rolling Edited June 9, 2022 by 777coletrain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) Yeah I've noticed the same @777coletrain, and I don't think this instability in yaw is correct behavior but more likely an unintended bug. But we'll see. At least the FM is basically spot on in pitch rate & stability now based on the information I have available. Edited June 9, 2022 by Hummingbird small typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
777coletrain Posted June 9, 2022 Author Share Posted June 9, 2022 I agree @Hummingbird, I just wanted to make a bug report so they knew. It's a pain to throw around the pattern now so the sooner it is fixed the better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 I'm sure they will be on it quick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zergburger Posted June 11, 2022 Share Posted June 11, 2022 in any spin or departure right now the rudder will hold deflection into the spin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts