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Crus page: Homeplate steerpoint selection


Rubberduck85

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Hi,

this maybe be a bug or a WIP.

With the last open beta (v 2.7.15.25026) ED modeled the cruise page, accessible on DED by pressing ICP button 5 (thank you!!!).

The submode "HOME" should give me the optimal cruise speed & altitude to a specifically designated HMPT wich I believe stands for Homeplate, or my designated location for landing and ending my flight.

However i noticed that the steerpoint (STP) selection for this submode is the same for the currently selected (active) STP.

Example: if i have a 10 STP flight plan, with 10 being my homeplate, if i'm flying the leg between 4 and 5 (with 5 selected as active STP), HOME shows optimal data for STP 5. I cannot select a different STP in the submode without changing my active STP. 

Shouldn't the selected HMPT be indipendent from my currently active STP?  

While flying with autopilot (alt hold + strg sel), in order to see the optimal profile i force the plane to make deviation from the flight plan.

 

Regards

Rubberduck

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Hi, 

the information we have is that it is correct as it is, if you have unclassified information it should be different please feel free to DM me. 

thank you

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At least per MLU M1 Pilot's Guide you could change CRUS HOME Home Point (HMPT) without affecting current steerpoint and navigation.

When you enter CRUS HOME, current steerpoint is selected as HMPT (p. 101 and figure 2-18 on p. 102). However, in CRUS HOME the steerpoint (HMPT) can be changed without affecting current STPT and navigation (p. 98). This is different from other CRUS pages.

Obviously you might have better info and better references, but that's at least per the M1 guide.

Best regards,
itn

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5 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

Hi, 

the information we have is that it is correct as it is, if you have unclassified information it should be different please feel free to DM me. 

thank you

Hi, one of the document I was thinking of has already been mentioned by user itn.

4 hours ago, itn said:

At least per MLU M1 Pilot's Guide you could change CRUS HOME Home Point (HMPT) without affecting current steerpoint and navigation.

When you enter CRUS HOME, current steerpoint is selected as HMPT (p. 101 and figure 2-18 on p. 102). However, in CRUS HOME the steerpoint (HMPT) can be changed without affecting current STPT and navigation (p. 98). This is different from other CRUS pages.

Obviously you might have better info and better references, but that's at least per the M1 guide.

Best regards,
itn

Yes, it refers to mid-life upgrade of older variants and i think it makes sense also for block 50.

I can also refer to block 50:

unsure if these are classified so i will not post excerpts.

I do not intend to be cheeky here, this consideration is based on logic: it is at the very least impractical and potentially dangerous IRL to have the plane change course just to check remaining fuel estimates.

Also, the HOME subfunction should trigger a FUEL advisory on the HUD (bottom left) if the estimated remaining fuel over HOME Point is less than 800 lbs, telling the pilot that it's really time to go home.

Edit: this is pretty much similar to the FPAS page on the F/A-18C.

Kind regards

Rubberduck

 


Edited by BIGNEWY
1.16
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Understanding is that HMPT is independent of current STPT selection but engaging CRUS HOME guidance will change STPT to match HMPT at the moment of engagement. It's a convenience feature as if you want CRUS HOME guidance to HMPT you probably want navigation guidance there too.

But you can fly around all day with HMPT set to whatever and have constant bingo monitoring to that HMPT even as current steerpoint is different.

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16 minutes ago, Frederf said:

Understanding is that HMPT is independent of current STPT selection but engaging CRUS HOME guidance will change STPT to match HMPT at the moment of engagement. It's a convenience feature as if you want CRUS HOME guidance to HMPT you probably want navigation guidance there too.

But you can fly around all day with HMPT set to whatever and have constant bingo monitoring to that HMPT even as current steerpoint is different.

Thank you!

Yes, that was what i meant and is also specified in the documents i mentioned.

One has to enable  through M-SEL the CRUS HOME to see cues on the HUD and "activate" the Steerpoint. But if CRUS HOME is not enabled through M-SEL we should be able to change and monitor the home steerpoint indipendently of the currently active one. 

As of now there is no way to select HMPT on the DED it with the "dobber" switch and change it with the ICP rocker switch.

Regards

Rubberduck

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Findings:

  • HMPT and STPT should be independent selections while CRUS HOME is not highlighted, currently they are not.
  • HMPT and STPT should be identical selections while CRUS HOME is highlighted, currently correct.
  • Selecting uninitialized waypoint causes HOME fuel calculation to be to the X=0,Z=0 point defined in the DCS terrain file, it should either be invalid or calculated to N0° E0° (not sure).
  • Placing * * around the HMPT number and entering the HMPT digits via ICP on line 2 is not possible in DCS, it should be.
  • On any CRUS page ICP keys 1-9 should replicate the SEQ function of the DCS, presumably excluding when * * would allow numeric entry (i.e. * * for HMPT entry, line 2 CRUS HOME page).
  • HMPT is a DTC-loadable value
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I will ask the team again 

 

Note, please do not paste text from real manuals in public. 

thank you

 

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What's also worth mentioning is the HOME BINGO function where, in addition to the manually set bingo fuel, the F-16 will give a home bingo alert once it estimates that you have just enough fuel to get back to home plate with 800 lbs of fuel remaining at 5,000 feet over the airfield. This would be a meaningless function if the HOME steerpoint would be the same as your active steerpoint.

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We have spoken with a SME and home plate should be set independently from the steerpoint, I have created a report for the team. 

thank you

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