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how is the varjo aero Performance with a high end PC today? June 2022


darkman222

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I know that there are quite a of lot tests with the varjo aero out there on YouTube. But those tests mostly are from people being sponsored by varjo.

So I need an honest opinion about it.

I have a decent gaming PC. Intel I 12900k and RTX 3090 and 32 GB ram.

Playing with a pimax 8Kx currently, but thinking about to switch to a varjo aero.

The Problem with the pimax is that I need to run it at 60 Hz on multiplayer servers. It is designed to run at 90 Hz but my PC can't deliver frame rates higher than 70/80 fps. So the eyes get out if sync. 60 Hz Mode is a solution which causes image refresh flickering on the other hand. Like on old CRT Monitors.

How are the frame rates with the aero, which also wants to run at 90 Hz? Does it stutter because the PC won't reach the Target frame rate of 90 Hz? Or is the Hardware demand lower from the aero so the PC actually will reach 90 fps? Or can the refresh rate be set to a lower fps for example 60hz, like with the pimax to free up needed performance if the PC can't deliver solid 90 fps.

How are the experiences of aero users around here concerning the frame rate and performance?


Edited by darkman222
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  • darkman222 changed the title to how is the varjo aero Performance with a high end PC today? June 2022

No refresh rate is locked at 90 Hz. No Motion Smoothing/Reprojection yet either. I find for me flying single player only performance to be about the same was I was getting with Reverb G2 and Vive Pro 2. I do not see any game breaking stuttering with fps of at least 45+. This is a very subjective thing though dependent on the individual. And the image clarity across virtually the entire lens is a sight to behold,

I love my Aero headset but will warn you, of late they are having a lot of issues with their headsets. Not even sure I could recommend then now based on what I have been seeing reported over on the Varjo Discord.


Edited by dburne

Don B

EVGA Z390 Dark MB | i9 9900k CPU @ 5.1 GHz | Gigabyte 4090 OC | 64 GB Corsair Vengeance 3200 MHz CL16 | Corsair H150i Pro Cooler |Virpil CM3 Stick w/ Alpha Prime Grip 200mm ext| Virpil CM3 Throttle | VPC Rotor TCS Base w/ Alpha-L Grip| Point Control V2|Varjo Aero|

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Thanks for the reply. I really think if you have a smooth experience with 45+ fps there must be some kind of motion smoothing running under the hood .

If not, the aero must be working differently to the pimax. I have 68-70 fps but no way to have a smooth experience with the pimax at 90 Hz. Would be unplayable without 60 Hz Mode...

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My 2 cents. Smooth experience in OpenXR mode due to superior frame pacing, not necessarily performance.  You can still get similar smooth experience in OpenVR mode if fps is 45+ and either vsync on or frame lock at 45 fps using Varjo Base app. 
 

OpenXR mode wins however if fps is below 45.  This is based on my experiences with the Aero which may or may not apply to other headsets. 


Edited by Supmua

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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Thanks for the reply. I really think if you have a smooth experience with 45+ fps there must be some kind of motion smoothing running under the hood .
If not, the aero must be working differently to the pimax. I have 68-70 fps but no way to have a smooth experience with the pimax at 90 Hz. Would be unplayable without 60 Hz Mode...
The base software has the ability to vsync at 45 or 30, as stated there is currently no motion smoothing / reprojection. My experience is similar to to @dburne. I came from a G2. I lock at 45 using vsync in Varjo base and whilst it occasionally dips it is on the whole solid and smooth. The image in comparison to a G2 is far superior as is the edge to edge clarity due to the lens design. One thing of note is that the vertical FOV is smaller than my G2 and initially it was a little off putting. It took a few hours to get used to it, but id say on the whole I'm very happy with the upgrade. 12900K 3090ti...3090 self destructed a week ago!

12900KF | Maximus Hero Z690 | ASUS 4090 TUF OC | 64GB DDR5 5200 | DCS on 2TB NVMe | WarBRD+Warthog Stick | CM3 | TM TPR's | Varjo Aero

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Okay. Thanks for the opinions so far. My main concern is that the frame rate will be as bad as in the pimax. That's why I am asking. Do you have the chance to startup fpsVr in steam (or a comparable service) and check the actual frame rate your systems are running?

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Framerate doesn’t tell the whole story like frametimes, since it doesn’t tell you whether the bottleneck is GPU or CPU.  And even having good frametimes won’t guarantee smooth performance especially if frame pacing is uneven.

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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Exactly. With my current pimax setup the frame times are often lower than the Target frame rate of 90Hz. That's why I have to use the flickering 60hz mode.

But it seems like aero users don't care too much about about CPU frame times as no body is complaining about stutters even at 90 Hz / 90 fps native with the aero...

 


Edited by darkman222
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I can’t speak for others but the Aero is my 7th VR headset, and I just don’t have any significant issue with it especially in terms of stuttering compared to those other headsets that I have had.  It doesn’t have motion smoothing at present, but I’m fine without it.

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PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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  • 2 weeks later...

And my Varjo Aero arrived yesterday. The image clarity is awesome. But the stutters even on the default preset in the varjo base too are very bad.  If if roll in the aircraft the horizon is giving double ghosted images. No multiplayer just an empty mission with my F16.

Looks like the 60 Hz mode the Pimax has is now missing here. The pixel density of the Aero is close to the Pimax' but it wants to go up to 90 Hz which does not seem possible even for my high end PC. Intel I 12900k and RTX 3090 seem not to be enough for a smooth experience here.

I reinstalled everything , tried Windows 11 and now I am on Windows 10. In DCS is everything on "low" setting.

How do you guys manage to have a smooth experience with a good resolution. When I switch the Varjo Base down to "low" I almost have a non-stuttery image. But this way the image looks like an old low res headset from 5 years ago.

 

 


Edited by darkman222
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Check out the Varjo guide in the other thread, only a short read and might save hours of uninstalling and reinstalling.

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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3 hours ago, darkman222 said:

And my Varjo Aero arrived yesterday. The image clarity is awesome. But the stutters even on the default preset in the varjo base too are very bad.  If if roll in the aircraft the horizon is giving double ghosted images. No multiplayer just an empty mission with my F16.

Looks like the 60 Hz mode the Pimax has is now missing here. The pixel density of the Aero is close to the Pimax' but it wants to go up to 90 Hz which does not seem possible even for my high end PC. Intel I 12900k and RTX 3090 seem not to be enough for a smooth experience here.

I reinstalled everything , tried Windows 11 and now I am on Windows 10. In DCS is everything on "low" setting.

How do you guys manage to have a smooth experience with a good resolution. When I switch the Varjo Base down to "low" I almost have a non-stuttery image. But this way the image looks like an old low res headset from 5 years ago.

 

 

 

Similar specs here and I get very few stutters. Are you using Vsync mode in VB? If not then try it.

12900KF | Maximus Hero Z690 | ASUS 4090 TUF OC | 64GB DDR5 5200 | DCS on 2TB NVMe | WarBRD+Warthog Stick | CM3 | TM TPR's | Varjo Aero

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11 minutes ago, zildac said:

Similar specs here and I get very few stutters. Are you using Vsync mode in VB? If not then try it.

 

Also be sure motion prediction/reprojection is turned off in Varjo Base. It currently is broken.

Don B

EVGA Z390 Dark MB | i9 9900k CPU @ 5.1 GHz | Gigabyte 4090 OC | 64 GB Corsair Vengeance 3200 MHz CL16 | Corsair H150i Pro Cooler |Virpil CM3 Stick w/ Alpha Prime Grip 200mm ext| Virpil CM3 Throttle | VPC Rotor TCS Base w/ Alpha-L Grip| Point Control V2|Varjo Aero|

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6 minutes ago, dburne said:

 

Also be sure motion prediction/reprojection is turned off in Varjo Base. It currently is broken.

Interesting, I've been using it since I got mine a few weeks back (enable if supported), never tried with it off. Was it broken in 5.x too?


Edited by zildac

12900KF | Maximus Hero Z690 | ASUS 4090 TUF OC | 64GB DDR5 5200 | DCS on 2TB NVMe | WarBRD+Warthog Stick | CM3 | TM TPR's | Varjo Aero

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35 minutes ago, zildac said:

Interesting, I've been using it since I got mine a few weeks back (enable if supported), never tried with it off. Was it broken in 5.x too?

 

Yep has always been broken. Latest from Varjo is it is on their roadmap but no timeline for it at this time. 

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Don B

EVGA Z390 Dark MB | i9 9900k CPU @ 5.1 GHz | Gigabyte 4090 OC | 64 GB Corsair Vengeance 3200 MHz CL16 | Corsair H150i Pro Cooler |Virpil CM3 Stick w/ Alpha Prime Grip 200mm ext| Virpil CM3 Throttle | VPC Rotor TCS Base w/ Alpha-L Grip| Point Control V2|Varjo Aero|

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I flew F16 Marianas Freeflight in SteamVR mode and it was fairly smooth, even though the framerate was mostly below 45 fps.  There is motion blur on the ground with flyby which is better than juddering imo, it seems frame pacing has improved and is comparable to OpenXR mode now.  This is quite different from my past experiences with the Aero and SteamVR.

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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Yep has always been broken. Latest from Varjo is it is on their roadmap but no timeline for it at this time. 
Thanks, I'll give it a go without, but it seems to have been running nicely, if it's even better that'd be great.

12900KF | Maximus Hero Z690 | ASUS 4090 TUF OC | 64GB DDR5 5200 | DCS on 2TB NVMe | WarBRD+Warthog Stick | CM3 | TM TPR's | Varjo Aero

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Does it actually work? Looks like clickbait?!

How do I display the current frame rate with the Aero?

45fps is half the frame rate of 90fps for 90 Hz. How can it be even smooth without motionsmoothing?

I tried almost everything. Vsync on and off. Open XR on and off.

Do you guys dogfight with it? If the bandit shows double images, like the horizon does for me when rolling the aircraft, the Aero is pretty useless if there is an algorithm trying to smooth that out or interpolate from 45 fps up to 90 fps.

 


Edited by darkman222
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