Feedback Thread - F-14 Tomcat Patch June 22nd 2022

[Hummingbird]

@IronMike@fat creason

Did something happen to wing sweep rate? Asking as I'm noticing the wings struggling to keep up with the CADC command even at rather low change rates. It doesn't seem like its achievning the 7.5-8 deg/sec sweep rate. This is at 1 G too btw, haven't checked if anything changed under G load yet, but you should be able to get 4 deg/sec @ 7.5 G (i.e. sweep rate only just about halfed at that G).

Edited June 28, 2022 by Hummingbird

[AvgeekJoe]

4 hours ago, Nealius said:

Although unrealistic and a trigger for the gate keepers here, I tend to cruise in TO HUD mode since it repeats the VVI info. 

I have to say flying the Tomcat in DCS is like stepping back in time.  Like going from flying a 737 MAX to a 737-100, or from the A-10C Tank Killer II back to the A-10A off of the Fairchild factory floor or driving an original Ford Mustang versus today's Ford Mustangs.  It's like going from the modern whiz-bang to a time where stick... and rudder really mattered.

[Hummingbird]

Also noticed that the throttle wing sweep aft & forward buttons (wing sweep cover down) don't work on the ground anymore, even after pressing the master reset button. Used to be able to to adjust wing sweep on the ground using just the buttons on the throttle. 

 

In addition to this the sweep indicator also no longer automatically switches to "auto" after take off when you've reached ~300 kts speed, eventhough the CADC appears to have actually taken control.

Edited June 28, 2022 by Hummingbird

[near_blind]

Works on my end. did you put the wings into auto after doing the CADC reset before trying to use the control hat?

[captain_dalan]

Also make sure the handle clicks into the detent before resetting the CADC. 

[Jackjack171]

On 6/26/2022 at 2:46 AM, AvgeekJoe said:

Thanks for that as I was about to report in the same problems w/ the autopilot.  Rarely works for me now as I learn flying the F-14B.  At least my Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog has a good trim tab.

Speaking of trim... when I take off it takes a lot of trim down to get the jet to stop wanting to naturally climb/pitch up even after setting it level on the HUD.

Finally, enjoy the screenshot:

Trim should be set to 0 on the CAT shot. Nearing the end of the stroke, apply a little aft stick. IRL it looks like a lot of aft stick but in DCS little to none really is ok. But you may be trimmed up a bit so check that trim gauge and that should do the trick.

[IronMike]

On 6/28/2022 at 11:45 PM, Hummingbird said:

Also noticed that the throttle wing sweep aft & forward buttons (wing sweep cover down) don't work on the ground anymore, even after pressing the master reset button. Used to be able to to adjust wing sweep on the ground using just the buttons on the throttle. 

 

In addition to this the sweep indicator also no longer automatically switches to "auto" after take off when you've reached ~300 kts speed, eventhough the CADC appears to have actually taken control.

 

Same as near blind, sweeps and button work fine on my end on the ground as well. Sounds like the handle is not properly in the spider detent before hitting master reset maybe.

[sLYFa]

16 hours ago, Бойовий Сокіл said:

And depending on weight you might not need AB or only zone 2.

Do you have any source for zone-2 launches being a thing? From what I know its either MIL or zone 5 (depending on weight) since these give the largest stall margins. Anything in between and you risk loosing an engine during/after the cat shot

Edited June 30, 2022 by sLYFa

[Nealius]

17 hours ago, sLYFa said:

Do you have any source for zone-2 launches being a thing? From what I know its either MIL or zone 5 (depending on weight) since these give the largest stall margins. Anything in between and you risk loosing an engine during/after the cat shot

I'm curious on the same. I have a fuzzy memory of a Zone 3 shore takeoff but I haven't been able to find written confirmation of that. Unless the throttles have detents for each AB zone, it would seem difficult to hit a specific Zone other than max with how long the light delay is.

[draconus]

2 hours ago, Nealius said:

Unless the throttles have detents for each AB zone, it would seem difficult to hit a specific Zone other than max with how long the light delay is.

Assuming we're talking about the A there're nozzle indicators plus the AB on RL throttle takes almost half of the whole range.

Perphaps it's misunderstanding of the A NATOPS, which says that for shore AB take off both AB should be lit (both nozzles positions at 2 minimum, which means the zone 1 AB fully lit) before break release - this is to check the proper operation of AB before take off, which can be done SE if not able to hold it on breaks.

[Hummingbird]

20 hours ago, IronMike said:

Same as near blind, sweeps and button work fine on my end on the ground as well. Sounds like the handle is not properly in the spider detent before hitting master reset maybe.

What about the sweep rate? Seems abit slow and lags behind the CADC command even at low change rates, did something change? 

[Indianajon]

Hi all, maybe I'm being stupid but since the latest update I can't get the wings back into the oversleep at the end of a flight. I'm in vr and using the mouse. I've never had any issues and reading the changelog it's clear you have implemented something on purpose but I can't for the life of me work it out. What am I doing wrong?

Also, great job on the A4 falklands campaign! Loved it! Felt a proper beast in the last couple of missions!

[Indianajon]

16 hours ago, Nealius said:

I'm curious on the same. I have a fuzzy memory of a Zone 3 shore takeoff but I haven't been able to find written confirmation of that. Unless the throttles have detents for each AB zone, it would seem difficult to hit a specific Zone other than max with how long the light delay is.

I can't remember if I read or heard on the Tomcat podcast that the A model launched predominantly in zone 5 or MIL dependant on its load out due to the poor thrust of the TF30s. By contrast the B and D models launched primarily on MIL but could (if their take off weight was near the limits) use zone 2, which was the equivalent of the A model in zone 5. Nothing greater was allowed as the F110s could buckle and/or melt the surface blast shield if used.

However normal procedure if heavy was to go light on fuel and immediately top up after launching.

[WarthogOsl]

1 hour ago, Indianajon said:

Hi all, maybe I'm being stupid but since the latest update I can't get the wings back into the oversleep at the end of a flight. I'm in vr and using the mouse. I've never had any issues and reading the changelog it's clear you have implemented something on purpose but I can't for the life of me work it out. What am I doing wrong?

Also, great job on the A4 falklands campaign! Loved it! Felt a proper beast in the last couple of missions!

I'm having a lot of issues with this too since the patch.  Even when the stab authority caution light goes out, I am sometimes never able to move the handle backwards.

My procedure is:

1. Sweep the wings all the way back to 68 using the throttle switch

2. Open the cover and click the handle to pop it up.

3. Wait for the stab authority light to go out.

4 Attempt to move the handle all the way back.  Sometimes it works, sometimes it never can be moved back.

[Karman]

On 6/26/2022 at 11:11 AM, draconus said:

But you didn't follow the advice

Sorry, I didn't understand "dead zone". I applied a dead zone of 5 and indeed it works the plane holds the altitude in turns. I still hope it will be fixed later. I recognize that the sensation is not too altered despite this setting. Thanks for clarifying...

[Callsign JoNay]

7 hours ago, WarthogOsl said:

I'm having a lot of issues with this too since the patch.  Even when the stab authority caution light goes out, I am sometimes never able to move the handle backwards.

My procedure is:

1. Sweep the wings all the way back to 68 using the throttle switch

2. Open the cover and click the handle to pop it up.

3. Wait for the stab authority light to go out.

4 Attempt to move the handle all the way back.  Sometimes it works, sometimes it never can be moved back.

Manually sweeping the wings back to 68 before pulling the handle out of the detent is what breaks the oversweep. Instead go to bomb mode, then pull emergency sweep out of the spider detent, pull back to 68, wait for the warning panel light to go out, and then you can pull all the way back to oversweep and push back into the detent.

 

Edit: Actually you can disengage the lever from the spider detent from 20/auto too, and then pull it back to 68 deg while detached. Wait for the warning light to go out, then sweep all the way back. As long as you are disengaging the handle from the spider detent from an auto mode (bomb mode shows auto flag now), it will work. If you disengage from a man flag mode you won't be able to pull the lever back to oversweep after the warning light goes out.

Edited July 2, 2022 by Callsign JoNay

[Indianajon]

3 hours ago, Callsign JoNay said:

Manually sweeping the wings back to 68 before pulling the handle out of the detent is what breaks the oversweep. Instead go to bomb mode, then pull emergency sweep out of the spider detent, pull back to 68, wait for the warning panel light to go out, and then you can pull all the way back to oversweep and push back into the detent.

 

Edit: Actually you can disengage the lever from the spider detent from 20/auto too, and then pull it back to 68 deg while detached. Wait for the warning light to go out, then sweep all the way back. As long as you are disengaging the handle from the spider detent from an auto mode (bomb mode shows auto flag now), it will work. If you disengage from a man flag mode you won't be able to pull the lever back to oversweep after the warning light goes out.

 

Thanks both!

Likewise I have always gone to ful sweep and then lifted the handle so its a case of reteaching myself. I'll give it a shot tonight. 

[captain_dalan]

On 6/28/2022 at 6:55 AM, Hummingbird said:

@IronMike@fat creason

Did something happen to wing sweep rate? Asking as I'm noticing the wings struggling to keep up with the CADC command even at rather low change rates. It doesn't seem like its achievning the 7.5-8 deg/sec sweep rate. This is at 1 G too btw, haven't checked if anything changed under G load yet, but you should be able to get 4 deg/sec @ 7.5 G (i.e. sweep rate only just about halfed at that G).

 

@Hummingbird is this the sweep rate you are getting? Takes about 9-10 seconds from 20 to 68 or the other way around, averaging at about 5 deg/s
 

 

[Hummingbird]

Yeah looks about right, although I measured it between 40 and 30 deg, to makes sure it was up to speed, where I got about 6 deg/sec. But most curious is in flight where the sweep is constantly lagging behind the CADC command indicator, even at slow accelerations and thus slow sweep change commands.

The sweep is lagging behind even at sweep change commands no faster than 1-2 deg/sec. 

Edited July 3, 2022 by Hummingbird

[captain_dalan]

@IronMike? Is this behavior a feature or a bug? 

[Uxi]

Wing sweep on ground works for me but I never see the flag indicator telling me I can go to oversweep anymore.  Is that deliberate?

[AvgeekJoe]

19 minutes ago, Uxi said:

Wing sweep on ground works for me but I never see the flag indicator telling me I can go to oversweep anymore.  Is that deliberate?

Same here.

[Yott]

I can't close Jester menu while track playbacking. It opens ones at a moment when I opened it while I record a track, but stays opened till the end of track.

Is it a bug, or I'm doing something wrong?

[draconus]

1 hour ago, Yott said:

Is it a bug, or I'm doing something wrong?

bug

[karapus78]

Let me ask, is it just me that the Taxi light doesn't work?