[SOUTH EAST ASIA] VIETNAM MAP 1200km x 600km, It's time to get this started.

[Mike Force Team]

@felixx75 Thank you for sharing the great news. It is reassuring to read the ED is starting the journey of creating a Viet Nam map.

[SOLIDKREATE]

Well that post deflated all of a certain someone's 'doomer' replies.  

[Gunfreak]

16 hours ago, SOLIDKREATE said:

Well that post deflated all of a certain someone's 'doomer' replies.  

"At some point" in ED time is within the next millennium 

[SOLIDKREATE]

8 hours ago, Gunfreak said:

"At some point" in ED time is within the next millennium 

 

[Beirut]

8 hours ago, Gunfreak said:

"At some point" in ED time is within the next millennium 

 

I applaud your optimism.

 

I was thinking more around when the sun goes nova.

[SOLIDKREATE]

4 hours ago, Beirut said:

 

I applaud your optimism.

 

I was thinking more around when the sun goes nova.

 

 

[Elf1606688794]

On 8/20/2022 at 1:06 PM, Rick50 said:

Personally I  don't  wanna fly "Vietnam: Desert Edition". I would want to fly the area as it appeared in the 1960's, and that means litterally TRILLIONS of bushes. TRILLIONS of tall grass blades. Last but not least, TRILLIONS upon TRILLIONS of trees. This is an absolute requirement, or it won't look like it should.

Why not use blocks of trees (jungle) as opposed to individual trees? That would likely cut the object count dramatically, and really, who pays attention to individual trees anyway? Especially when we're talking triple canopy jungle... speaking of which, why model all 3 canopies when you can likely only see the uppermost?

[Elf1606688794]

On 8/28/2022 at 3:09 PM, felixx75 said:

From the ED Twitter Account

[Rick50]

17 minutes ago, Elf1606688794 said:

Why not use blocks of trees (jungle) as opposed to individual trees? That would likely cut the object count dramatically, and really, who pays attention to individual trees anyway? Especially when we're talking triple canopy jungle... speaking of which, why model all 3 canopies when you can likely only see the uppermost?

 

I partially agree with you, I think that could be one of the "art / programming tricks" I was mentioning before. It has worked ok in the past for a couple sims.

HOWEVER... 

A Vietnam map shouldn't be "ONLY" for Phantom Phlyers doing Mach 2 with their hair on fire. Remember, we already have the UH-1 in DCS, and an OV-10 Bronco mod inbound.  I predict a Skyraider and Cobra will eventually be developed too. If the terrain looks like 'ass' up close, it might not sell very well. similar if frames are all stuttery.

Thing is, graphics are improving every year, expectations from players grows every year. You won't sell a map in 2026 that looks like it was made in 2003. At the same time, not all real visuals have to be represented, so obviously the lower canopies not seen by aircraft shoudln't be a factor... but the eyes do tricky things, so it's important for the artists to keep us from seeing some items lacking, and draw our eyes to see what the artists want us to see, in much the same way that movie special effects people used to do with models and stage gags, or magicians presenting a trick.

 

On 8/28/2022 at 5:22 PM, SOLIDKREATE said:

Well that post deflated all of a certain someone's 'doomer' replies.  

 

Oh wow, you sure "got me"!!! 

LOL!

[Mike Force Team]

It is possible that ED is working on the Viet Nam map but not tell us anything. They might wait one day to surprise us.

[Elf1606688794]

32 minutes ago, Rick50 said:

 

I partially agree with you, I think that could be one of the "art / programming tricks" I was mentioning before. It has worked ok in the past for a couple sims.

HOWEVER... 

A Vietnam map shouldn't be "ONLY" for Phantom Phlyers doing Mach 2 with their hair on fire. Remember, we already have the UH-1 in DCS, and an OV-10 Bronco mod inbound.  I predict a Skyraider and Cobra will eventually be developed too. If the terrain looks like 'ass' up close, it might not sell very well. similar if frames are all stuttery.

Thing is, graphics are improving every year, expectations from players grows every year. You won't sell a map in 2026 that looks like it was made in 2003. At the same time, not all real visuals have to be represented, so obviously the lower canopies not seen by aircraft shoudln't be a factor... but the eyes do tricky things, so it's important for the artists to keep us from seeing some items lacking, and draw our eyes to see what the artists want us to see, in much the same way that movie special effects people used to do with models and stage gags, or magicians presenting a trick.

 

 

Oh wow, you sure "got me"!!! 

LOL!

We're getting the map so all of this is moot...but....

Why make separate objects for paddies (filled and unfilled) dikes, rice plants etc etc when you can make the "object" complete, a paddy surrounded by dikes filled with water and healthy rice plants? You can make multiple rice paddies that vary in size and look and have one object instead of hundreds.

Your Huey can utilize landing zones in the jungle, so make jungle "objects" that look like a landing zone and make multiples that vary in size, shape, and terrain features but have one thing in common, the edges of the jungle have you oooooo'ing and ahhhhhing over the graphics but if you could step 10 feet into the jungle you'd see a very different story.

That same prinicple (one object over many) can be applied to many things on the map. Do we really need every village completely detailed when we can add detail (static objects) via the mission editor to the portion of the map we are currently using? I probably don't need/want a village 10 klicks west of Saigon having me enthralled by it's awesome graphics while I'm bombing Haiphong Harbor.

[SkateZilla]

On 8/25/2022 at 8:41 PM, SOLIDKREATE said:

Last I heard he got new legs. 

Indeed he did:

Despite Aircraft, 

ALOT of things involved with weapons and terrains would need to change for this to be a reality.,

[SOLIDKREATE]

6 hours ago, Rick50 said:

wow, you sure "got me"!!! 

LOL!

 

No, Eagle Dynamics got you. Please, relax man. I see you, I've met people like you. It always seem that you believe you know better. I get it, you have high passion about this because you didn't think of asking for it. Like I said earlier, this is just a request. No need to come in and start peeing all over it. 

Edited September 1, 2022 by SOLIDKREATE

[Elf1606688794]

5 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

Indeed he did:

Despite Aircraft, 

ALOT of things involved with weapons and terrains would need to change for this to be a reality.,

Someone, (to my knowledge ED didn't say who), is making a Vee Et Nahm map, it's coming and it's going to be a reality.

[SkateZilla]

26 minutes ago, Elf1606688794 said:

Someone, (to my knowledge ED didn't say who), is making a Vee Et Nahm map, it's coming and it's going to be a reality.

We shall see.

[Elf1606688794]

54 minutes ago, SkateZilla said:

We shall see.

ED said someone has taken it on as their first map. Being a glass half full kind of guy I tend to believe them.

[MAXsenna]

3 hours ago, Elf1606688794 said:

ED said someone has taken it on as their first map. Being a glass half full kind of guy I tend to believe them.

Pretty sure this is out of context, and "this 3rd party" and "their first map" solely refers to the Australia map, as it was suggested in other comments that ED (obviously) would do Korea and Nam themselves. 

About a year ago some user, (handle escapes me and I cannot find the post again), showed with screenshots how you can drill down in the MAPS with Model viewer or something, to find names of "new buildings". IIRC he showed with screenshots that there are buildings on the Persian Gulf map with Afghan names, and Vietnamese names on the Syria map. Which made me absolutely sure these would come/are in the works. Will Ugra make Vietnam? Don't think so, as it might make more sense for them to do Iraq/Kuwait, for a future expansion from Syria to the east. 

If someone else remember the post I'm referring to, it would be fun to luck up the buildings on The Marianas.

Cheers! 

[felixx75]

3 hours ago, Elf1606688794 said:

ED said someone has taken it on as their first map. Being a glass half full kind of guy I tend to believe 

No, the Twitter excerpt comes from a discussion about the australia map. ED said that this company chose australia as their first map and that a vietnam map will come at some point.

[draconus]

18 hours ago, Rick50 said:

...not all real visuals have to be represented, so obviously the lower canopies not seen by aircraft shoudln't be a factor...

Obviously parts that are currently obscured shouldn't be rendered but the objects need full representation from ground up. DCS is not only aircraft cockpit view from altitude and while helicopters can get really low and close there is also Combined Arms, where you view and control ground units and even MANPAD guys.

[SkateZilla]

[Elf1606688794]

7 hours ago, felixx75 said:

No, the Twitter excerpt comes from a discussion about the australia map. ED said that this company chose australia as their first map and that a vietnam map will come at some point.

2 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

That made me laugh, thanks.

[Rick50]

On 9/1/2022 at 7:38 AM, draconus said:

Obviously parts that are currently obscured shouldn't be rendered but the objects need full representation from ground up. DCS is not only aircraft cockpit view from altitude and while helicopters can get really low and close there is also Combined Arms, where you view and control ground units and even MANPAD guys.

Totally agreed... Similarly, there could be differences in LOD for the map, the Mach 2 dudes get a different LOD than say the guys driving M-113's and flying Hueys? I think that could work... might have issues for multiplayer, but I think it's probably a fairly easy thing to create. But I don't really know, sometimes what seems super easy, barely an inconvenience, turns into a mess of headaches requiring a rethink to solve. 

[Rick50]

 

From the tweet:

"...a vietnam map will come at some point."

 

I guess I had poor English teachers... but I'm still not sure how that statement translates into "ITS BEIN' MADE RIGHT NOWWW!!!1!  IN YER FACE, DOOMER!!"

 

I've stated many times that I do believe we will get a Vietnam map... but that I don't know how long it will take, a few months, few years, maybe a decade. 

Maybe the Mariannas map was a test run for 3d programming techniques for a Vietnam map?

Maybe we'll get an EA map for a section of Vietnam when the Phantom gets released?!  That would be a very cool surprise. 

Another bit of news, the C-130J is being made into a full paid module... now it's true that the J is far and away too new to be part of a Vietnam scenario, but the dev has stated that they hope to do other variants, so maybe they might cover earlier variants of the 1960's era? A scenario for the siege of Khe San might be interesting.

A long time ago I had a flight sim for a Huey UH-1 where you could operate from the back of a ship, fly to a jungle, pick up casualties and bring them to a MASH unit or back to the ship.  Little AI soldiers would move about, either shooting at each other, or carrying a stretcher with an AI casualty. I had an M-60 door gunner AI. It flew pretty decent for a "sim-cade" level of game/sim middle ground. Not realistic enough for pure sim, but physics that were too challenging for most arcade experiences. In rough seas the ship would rock and roll with the waves. The jungle was... well it wasn't convincing anyone, but it was a good effort especially considering the hardware limits of the time. The AI was... extremely limited, but it helped with creating a sense of being there in a mission. It was made using the same engine as another helicopter sim-cade product for Search and Rescue, of which I thijnk they made 4 versions?

https://www.myabandonware.com/game/search-rescue-vietnam-med-evac-gqg

At the time I was so hungry for anything with helos, that I took to this one and a couple  of the civie versions. It was ok for it's time, not greatness, but I could see the potential for future projects!!

Edited September 3, 2022 by Rick50

[SOLIDKREATE]

LOL, this dude. 

 

[felixx75]

43 minutes ago, Rick50 said:

Check the  link, seems the Phantom won't release in '22, as per latest from 

HB developer. But working hard to get it done, still planning a Navy variant after the E gunfighter!

The podcast doesn't say anything about a release date... So nothing about the F4 coming in 2022, but also not that it's not coming. So one can certainly assume that the original time window (2022) is still valid.