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Which Is More Complex?


BuzzU

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1 hour ago, Coole28 said:

From my personal experience, wrapping my head around the HOTAS logic for the A-10 was a massive pain in the ***.  Having to memorize the functions of all the different switches was overwhelming as a rookie.  China hat, coolie hat, boat switch, data management switch, target management switch… its a lot.  F-18 has one hat switch you have to memorize functionality for, pretty much everything else is buttons that are labeled by their functionality (e.g. to expand the FOV on your FLIR, you hit the button labeled “FLIR FOV”).  I think the F-18 is a far less frustrating module to learn if you have no prior experience.  

Plus carrier ops are way more fun than land based ops IMO.

I agree completely. The Hog HOTAS got worse with the Hog Killer. You should see the look on my friends face when I showed him the Hog HOTAS layout he'd have to remember. He also didn't like the HUD on the Hog. Then he saw the HOTAS for the Hornet and smiled. He also got excited watching the carrier landings. Wait until he tries it. 🙂

I think his mind is made up.

Buzz

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18 hours ago, markom said:

Funny how different brains work differently. To me, this is the most logical, straightforward concept. Absence of it on F/A-18 still messes with my brain after months of flying it. I want my SPI and SOI on Hornet! 🙂

I didn't say it isn't logical or straightforward, just more complex. In the Hornet you always only have one target designation that drives everything, and that usually is a very concious decision to do as well. Your waypoint isn't your target automatically, unless you conciously designate it as such. Where your TGP is looking isn't your target automatically, unless you conciously designate it as such. I find that to be logical and straightforward.

 

In the Hog (and to a certain extent the Viper), your STPT may automatically be the target designation, the SPI. Or maybe your TGP is driving it. Or something else. You kinda always have to double-check: what is my current SPI generator, because it may be very different from what you expect to be. Mind you: I don't think it is HARD or ILLOGICAL, it is just more complex than in the Hornet. It also possibly gives you greater flexibility, coming from it's greater complexity.

(and my point of view comes from teaching noobs all three modules and their comments on those thing. Had they started with, say: learning the Hog on their own their view might be different. But generally everyone I taught how to use those said that "SPI and SOI" were complex to wrap their head around)


Edited by Shimmergloom667
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I started with F-18.

Now I am learning A-10.

The Problem: A-10 feels like a downgrade now. It's a nice module, but the F-18 is the "better" plane.

The better experience would be to start with A-10 and upgrade to F18 later.

Futhermore the A10 feels like a plane (requires trimming etc.) while F18 is like a train on rails.

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One last question and this one is for me too. He's ready to order a WinWing. I have the Viper stick on mine but the Hornet throttle grip. I was thinking of getting the Hornet stick too but have neve never handled one. The Hornet stick has less buttons than the Viper but it's fine for flying the Hornet. Plus, my Viper grip has the extra buttons, so it really has more buttons.

My friend has flown the Hornet with my Viper stick and likes it but he knows it's not the Hornet stick and wants it. So my question is for those who have both sticks or have at least handled both. Which one do you like best? Which feels more comfortable. Reach for button comfort? It makes more sense for me to order the Hornet stick with his HOTAS order. We can work out the shipping charges and both save some money.

All opinions welcome.

Thanks

Buzz

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4 hours ago, Ingo Kognito said:

I started with F-18.

Now I am learning A-10.

The Problem: A-10 feels like a downgrade now. It's a nice module, but the F-18 is the "better" plane.

The better experience would be to start with A-10 and upgrade to F18 later.

Futhermore the A10 feels like a plane (requires trimming etc.) while F18 is like a train on rails.

I have start with the A-10 when released by ED ( before i had the BS1 and BS2 then Huey, P51 and FA 18, )  the A-10 is complex to learn, it is all on the system, meaning you need learn all aspect of how function the avionics, flying the hog is not hard, but his avionics are terribly complex to learn if you dont know a bit about them.  But when you know use all the computer system it is really a breeze to prepare the action plan and then do it.   

For sure when you have learn one plane (modern), then when learning an other it is way more easy. So i think it is really hard to say what plane is more complex to learn than another.

You know what you want of achieve and just need find how you will need do it in the other plane ( Hotas command for start, TGP, sensor switch, enter coordinate etc ). The concept stay the same, the way of achieve need learn and adapt


Edited by Lane

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33 minutes ago, BuzzU said:

On the Hornet forum. Nobody uses a Hornet stick?

I do not use one, because i have an old hotas, but i will think that it is more natural to use and you will not need to do key bindings as everything is in the right place and every function/command/button are covered defacto. Now i think it is too pretty easy to configure any hotas to work with any plane anyway.  you have all buttons for sensor switch, TDC,etc. it is just the position who differ.

So on the end. I will say it is more a question of " do i want spend money for 2 grips or not " ? 


Edited by Lane

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- XIfi Titanium HD

- Win 7 x64Pro

 

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38 minutes ago, BuzzU said:

On the Hornet forum. Nobody uses a Hornet stick?

I do not be cause my Warthog HOTAS is on my desk and the Hornet stick ergonomics would make it very awkward...it would need to be lower and between my legs to work well.

"You see, IronHand is my thing"

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7 minutes ago, Steel Jaw said:

I do not be cause my Warthog HOTAS is on my desk and the Hornet stick ergonomics would make it very awkward...it would need to be lower and between my legs to work well.

I thought of that but in my case I think it would be more comfortable. I have my stick on my right side and it's lower than what is comfortable for the Viper stick. So, maybe the Hornet stick is a good choice for me?

I do like the extra immersion of using a Hornet stick for the Hornet. I can use the small switch for zoom and clicking stick and pilot off.

Buzz

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BUZZU hey I use the VIRPIL VFC warbrd and left Constellation grip and I love it alot I had the X -55 Rhino stick before and I wore it out.   I fly mainly the FA- 18C for modern stuff and P-47D for WW2.

There are 2 categories of fighter pilots: those who have performed, and those who someday will perform, a magnificent defensive break turn toward a bug on the canopy. Robert Shaw

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vor 1 Stunde schrieb BuzzU:

On the Hornet forum. Nobody uses a Hornet stick?

I ordered three Thrustmaster Hornet Grips from Amazon. All three had "sticky" switches (4-way-switches do not return to the middle position by themselv). Crap...

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I haven’t used or even seen the Hornet stick with my own eyes, but I did hear in a couple of YouTube reviews that it can feel a little uncomfortable/awkward if using it as a side-stick on your desk.

Something to do with how the real deal is turned slightly to one side (the left I think). All good if you have a centre stick with extension though.

Please bear in mind all of the above information is third hand, and may only apply to the thrustmaster offering. 🙂

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55 minutes ago, Digitalvole said:

I haven’t used or even seen the Hornet stick with my own eyes, but I did hear in a couple of YouTube reviews that it can feel a little uncomfortable/awkward if using it as a side-stick on your desk.

Something to do with how the real deal is turned slightly to one side (the left I think). All good if you have a centre stick with extension though.

Please bear in mind all of the above information is third hand, and may only apply to the thrustmaster offering. 🙂

That's the kind of info I wanted to get. Ok, I can see it being made that way being a center stick in the real plane. The Viper being a side stick feels perfect as a sidestick.

Ok, you saved me some money. My friend is also going to mount the stick on his side like a Viper. I'll tell him to get the setup I have. He liked it.

 

Thanks

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Buzz

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13 hours ago, BuzzU said:

That's the kind of info I wanted to get. Ok, I can see it being made that way being a center stick in the real plane. The Viper being a side stick feels perfect as a sidestick.

Ok, you saved me some money. My friend is also going to mount the stick on his side like a Viper. I'll tell him to get the setup I have. He liked it.

 

Thanks

No worries, if your heading to the bar mines a pint of Ale 😉

But like I said, I don’t know if the same is true of the WinWing one. 

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16 hours ago, BuzzU said:

On the Hornet forum. Nobody uses a Hornet stick?

Why would I? I am flying a good dozen of modules and my VKB Gunfighter MCG Pro covers all of my aviation needs

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2 hours ago, Shimmergloom667 said:

Why would I? I am flying a good dozen of modules and my VKB Gunfighter MCG Pro covers all of my aviation needs

That's you. Not everybody.

Why do you think Winwing and other makers make a HOTAS for a specific plane?

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Buzz

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4 hours ago, BuzzU said:

That's you. Not everybody.

Why do you think Winwing and other makers make a HOTAS for a specific plane?

I was just talking about me, though?

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