T16000+Twcs advices in upgrade

[simo-dj]

Hi everybody. 
 

i have, as per title, T16000 and its Twcs controller (no rudder pedals) . I’m quite used to these controllers but twcs has started to give problems. First i had problems on erratic collective controls (partially resolved with unscrewing friction and by upgrading firmware. Now the analogic stick seems to be broken. 
 

question is: i’m evaluating a new throttle, logitech X56 in specific. Has this throttle rudder levers like twcs has or i have to buy pedals as well? 
i feel fine with t16000 stick. Is it possible to use this stick with logitech x56 hotas? (…i know x56 throttle and stick aren’t sold separately)

do you have a better stick and throttle to suggest with the same price? 
 

Thanks a lot! 

[bingbean]

Currently there is no other combat style throttle stick on market at TWCS price point. So if you budget is limited, then not much other option. TWCS is inspired by F18 HORNET throttle , winwing throttle is F18 replica as well, so it should by easy for you to adapt for it after using TWCS.  But winwing is 4 time so expensive.

 https://wwsimstore.com/view/goods-details.html?id=375

The Logitech X56 has mixed reviews. Many people complain about ghost inputs. This is such a common problem that even official logitech support recommends using a powered USB HUB with this HOTAS, which solves this problem.

In fact, TWCS also has a common problem.  The main throttle movement is sticky with default grease.  Is really shame, the thrustmaster dehonest his own product only by using incorrect grease for metal - plastic friction. The most recommended nyogel 767a i was not able to buy in my country and shipping from amazon will cost me more as TWSC it self. So it took me a few trial and error attempts with several different lubes until I found the MOGUL A00 which makes the lever movement really smooth.

 

[okopanja]

1 hour ago, simo-dj said:

Now the analogic stick seems to be broken. 

If you are talking about the drift, have you tried to clean it with canned air and contact spray?

[Beirut]

When my T16000 gave me problems... I bought a new T16000.

 

When my TWCS gives me problems... I will buy a new TWCS.

 

For the price, I think it's the best setup.

 

 

(Edit) Since we're here, can you run two TWCS throttles and the T16000 at once?

 

I've considered it and was curious.

Edited August 31, 2022 by Beirut

[simo-dj]

4 ore fa, okopanja ha scritto:

If you are talking about the drift, have you tried to clean it with canned air and contact spray?

I’m talking about the mini stick in the front of the throttle, just above the rudder levers. It’s completely out of axis. I run calibration software but it constantly bends toward left. 
 

i don’t think it’ll be fixed with Canned air but i’ll give a try! Thanks

[simo-dj]

4 ore fa, Beirut ha scritto:

When my T16000 gave me problems... I bought a new T16000.

 

When my TWCS gives me problems... I will buy a new TWCS.

 

For the price, I think it's the best setup.

 

 

(Edit) Since we're here, can you run two TWCS throttles and the T16000 at once?

 

I've considered it and was curious.

 

I have already bought a new one but it’s very annoying because the old one was 6/7 months old. I don’t want to throw a throttle away every half year. That’s why i considered X56. But what stops me it’s that i don’t know if this throttle has rudder levers as twcs or i have to buy rudder pedals as well. 
 

i never thought about 2 throttles and the stick. I think it’s quite useless, isn’it? 

[okopanja]

45 minutes ago, simo-dj said:

i don’t think it’ll be fixed with Canned air but i’ll give a try! Thanks

Over the time the fat, dust and hair will accumulate around ministick internals. This is causing the drift.

To repair it:

1. you need to open it without braking stuff or loosing screws

2. use canned air to blow up the dust

3. move the ministick in all directions

4. use canned air to blow up the dust again!

5. use contact spray on the ministick base (electronic parts soldered on board)

6. move the ministick in all directions

7. wait 5 mins

8. use contact spray on the ministick base (electronic parts soldered on board)

9. move the ministick in all directions

10. wait 5 mins

11. blow up the residue if any with air

12. assemble and try

So far I used contact spray to repair:

- 2 nintendo joycons

- Nintendo pro controller (has very similar ministick to the one wound in TWCS

- oven (wife was complaining we should return whole oven)

Save a lot of money already on this...

Buy canned air for electronics and contact spray.

E.g. I bought this one:

https://wd40.de/wd-40-produkte/schnell-trocknender-kontaktspray/

 

Edited August 31, 2022 by okopanja

[simo-dj]

28 minuti fa, okopanja ha scritto:

Over the time the fat, dust and hair will accumulate around ministick internals. This is causing the drift.

To repair it:

1. you need to open it without braking stuff or loosing screws

2. use canned air to blow up the dust

3. move the ministick in all directions

4. use canned air to blow up the dust again!

5. use contact spray on the ministick base (electronic parts soldered on board)

6. move the ministick in all directions

7. wait 5 mins

8. use contact spray on the ministick base (electronic parts soldered on board)

9. move the ministick in all directions

10. wait 5 mins

11. blow up the residue if any with air

12. assemble and try

So far I used contact spray to repair:

- 2 nintendo joycons

- Nintendo pro controller (has very similar ministick to the one wound in TWCS

- oven (wife was complaining we should return whole oven)

Save a lot of money already on this...

Buy canned air for electronics and contact spray.

E.g. I bought this one:

https://wd40.de/wd-40-produkte/schnell-trocknender-kontaktspray/

 

 

Wow! Thanks @okopanja

i’ll take both spray and canned air and try!

thanks a lot!

[okopanja]

One last thing: do not use normal WD-40!!!

Also: find the youtube video on how disassemble TWCS.

[Beirut]

1 hour ago, simo-dj said:

I have already bought a new one but it’s very annoying because the old one was 6/7 months old. I don’t want to throw a throttle away every half year. That’s why i considered X56. But what stops me it’s that i don’t know if this throttle has rudder levers as twcs or i have to buy rudder pedals as well. 

 

I got at least two-years out of my T16000. Then there was a problem with the twist sensor. I saw a video on how to fix it but I'm not great at that stuff so I just got another and the first is on the shelf. The throttle is fine, but I'm willing to get another if/when this one gets funky. 

 

1 hour ago, simo-dj said:

i never thought about 2 throttles and the stick. I think it’s quite useless, isn’it? 

 

It's only useless if you don't use it.  

 

Sometimes I'd like to have a few more buttons, and a second throttle, odd as it may seem, would give me a ton of extra switches. it was just a thought.

[bingbean]

X56 and any of dual throttle stick dont have cradle style rudder control. So you will need pedals or use twist on the joystick. 

[Sacarino111]

Hi.

I can't tell for sure, but I m afraid that if both throttles are the same model/name , Windows will have a hard time telling them appart and in DCS config page you will have to do some testings to know which one is which, but once you got it, you should be able to config them separately with no problem. Be aware, from time to time, Windows will shuffle them, and you will probably need to uninstall them, then re install (from device manager) to have them in the "correct order" (I have 6 different joysticks with the same name, so I know what I m saying). My trick is to change their name in DCS (config tab/controls and RMouse on controller name to change it) and make always a backup, so you can load it if windows shuffle them or you have to un-install and install them back.

Saludos.

Saca111

[simo-dj]

2 ore fa, bingbean ha scritto:

X56 and any of dual throttle stick dont have cradle style rudder control. So you will need pedals or use twist on the joystick. 

Thanks a lot @bingbean

apart all these useful advices that’s i wanted to know. 

[simo-dj]

1 ora fa, Sacarino111 ha scritto:

Hi.

I can't tell for sure, but I m afraid that if both throttles are the same model/name , Windows will have a hard time telling them appart and in DCS config page you will have to do some testings to know which one is which, but once you got it, you should be able to config them separately with no problem. Be aware, from time to time, Windows will shuffle them, and you will probably need to uninstall them, then re install (from device manager) to have them in the "correct order" (I have 6 different joysticks with the same name, so I know what I m saying). My trick is to change their name in DCS (config tab/controls and RMouse on controller name to change it) and make always a backup, so you can load it if windows shuffle them or you have to un-install and install them back.

Saludos.

Saca111

Thanks a lot @Sacarino111 but a stick and two throttles is a solution i am not interested in. Maybe @Beirutwill be grateful and intesrested in this. 
 

As said i’ve already bought a new one but, sincerely, if this won ‘t last longer i’ll evaluate one of more quality and durable like x56 seems to be. 
i hope budget will allow me to buy rudder pedals as well (twisting stick while piloting apache it’s a thing i’ll never get used to. 
 

 

[Sacarino111]

2 hours ago, simo-dj said:

As said i’ve already bought a new one but, sincerely, if this won ‘t last longer i’ll evaluate one of more quality and durable like x56 seems to be. 
i hope budget will allow me to buy rudder pedals as well (twisting stick while piloting apache it’s a thing i’ll never get used to. 

Hi.

Yes, spend your money in rudder  pedals, (with toe brake) and try to repair the old one. The analog joystick should be replacable, almost sure.

If not, the X56 is a good replacemente.

Saludos.

Saca111

[simo-dj]

1 ora fa, Sacarino111 ha scritto:

Hi.

Yes, spend your money in rudder  pedals, (with toe brake) and try to repair the old one. The analog joystick should be replacable, almost sure.

If not, the X56 is a good replacemente.

Saludos.

Saca111

Thanks a lot @Sacarino111

exactly what do you mean with toe brake? 

[Sacarino111]

14 hours ago, simo-dj said:

exactly what do you mean with toe brake? 

Hi. 

The pedals can have two more axis, besides de rudder itself, which are in both sides of the pedals and are used to apply presure to wheel brakes (like in RL). They are usualy called toe brakes, as you most likely will use the toe to act them.

Saludos.

Saca111

[simo-dj]

Oops i did it again [cit.]

I bought a brand new TWCS, unboxed, and after (literally) 3 minutes of use the same problem showed up!

Before connecting i used virpil test to check and everything was fine.

Could it be that when i use the analog stick as button it "damages" connections? It's not a continous and repeatedly pression. I mapped this button for cursor switching betweend MFD's so i use it very very rarely.

New one was already sent back and asked for refund, now i'll try to disassembly it and use canned air and connection spray as suggested.

But i'm thinking that maybe is a communication problem between throttle and pc. Could it be?

Thanks a lot

 

p.s. forgive me @bingbean i completely missed your kind answer. That's a good suggestion and i'll keep it mind. Actually I'd prefer to buy an expensive throttle (and, hopefully durable) rather than continously buy a cheaper one that has problem just after unboxed.

 

 

 

[Funkysak]

There is an amazing TWCS Bearing upgrade kit on ETSY that is a must have for that throttle. It can be found here = https://www.etsy.com/listing/968346749/slider-upgrade-kit-thrustmaster-t16000m?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=twcs+upgrade+kit&ref=sr_gallery-1-3&edd=1&pop=1&organic_search_click=1

 

As for a better Stick that the Thrustmaster I recommend the KVB Evo.  It is the best mid range stick out there. It has many buttons and adjustable clutching and also comes with different spring sets to customize to your liking. If your a Helo only person you can even take the springs out all together.

[simo-dj]

Il 14/11/2022 at 23:38, Funkysak ha scritto:

There is an amazing TWCS Bearing upgrade kit on ETSY that is a must have for that throttle. It can be found here = https://www.etsy.com/listing/968346749/slider-upgrade-kit-thrustmaster-t16000m?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=twcs+upgrade+kit&ref=sr_gallery-1-3&edd=1&pop=1&organic_search_click=1

 

As for a better Stick that the Thrustmaster I recommend the KVB Evo.  It is the best mid range stick out there. It has many buttons and adjustable clutching and also comes with different spring sets to customize to your liking. If your a Helo only person you can even take the springs out all together.

Thanks a lot @Funkysak

I was aware about this upgrade, but, after i bought a new TWCS having the same issue i chose Winwing throttle... and it's really another planet!