RTX 3090 low performance

[Mars Exulte]

On 11/19/2022 at 1:24 PM, crazyave said:

Upgrading the CPU isn't going to matter much, maybe a few percent. 

An 8700 isn't going to feed a 3090 properly. All there is to it. We're not talking a small upgrade, this is a fairly old CPU, choked by VERY insufficient RAM quantity, paired with an ultra high end GPU. OP's system is low end of mid range with a top tier GPU. That combination will have issues, simple as that. It's actually very similar to the system I just upgraded from... but with less RAM, so I have a pretty good idea how it performs. 

Edited November 21, 2022 by Mars Exulte

[WipeUout]

Agree, CPU is the problem here.  I upgraded from a 9900k to a 12700kf and although I did not see a vast increase in FPS, the lows were much higher resulting in a completely smooth experience.  DCS is a single core game, you need a fast single thread processor to give breathing room to your GPU.  The GPU is fed by the CPU because the virtual world you are flying in reside in the computer's memory, not the GPU memory.

You can experiment the single thread nature of DCS by playing a heavily populated mission on your computer vs a dedicated server which effectively provide you a second thread.  You will see your CPU frametime getting much flatter.

Upgrade that CPU.  

[crazyave]

Interesting, I must have a magic 8700k, my CPU frame time is always 1/2 to 1/3 of my GPU frame time.  It ever exceeds it and I'm always 50-70fps no reprojection.  This is using the settings I posted earlier.  I have complex multiplayer missions with over a hundred units actively fighting and run a dedicated server install hosting the missions along with my client install on the same system.  I don't see why someone with the same setup can't get similar results, then again, it is DCS!  lol  Good luck!  Curious if you actually see a big difference, I'm actually considering a 13th gen just due to age of my system and future 4090 prospects.

[divinee]

18 minutes ago, crazyave said:

Interesting, I must have a magic 8700k, my CPU frame time is always 1/2 to 1/3 of my GPU frame time.  It ever exceeds it and I'm always 50-70fps no reprojection.  This is using the settings I posted earlier.  I have complex multiplayer missions with over a hundred units actively fighting and run a dedicated server install hosting the missions along with my client install on the same system.  I don't see why someone with the same setup can't get similar results, then again, it is DCS!  lol  Good luck!  Curious if you actually see a big difference, I'm actually considering a 13th gen just due to age of my system and future 4090 prospects.

I swapped from 9600k which run at 5,1GHz to 13600k which runs dcs at 5,8Ghz and i had about 5-6ms overall reduction in CPU frametimes. I adjusted the settings so that i'm always GPU limited with OC'd 3080Ti (~20500pts in timespy gpu score) and after the change i saw no reduction in GPU frametimes so the CPU wasn't bottlenecking the GPU. Overall smoothness especially when flying low is now maybe a little bit better but the step wasn't that big. Maybe with 4090 there can be bigger differences. 

Edited November 22, 2022 by divinee

[goliat26]

@crazyavewhat VR you have?

In few days i will swap my MB, CPU and RAM. I hope that FPS will increase:D. I5 13600Kf, 32GB DDR5 5600MHZ CL36 and Gigabyte Z790 Gaming X AX are waiting on my desk but i have to find time to swap it. I will report you about FPS on new hardware.

[crazyave]

I'm on a Reverb G2.

Too bad we won't know how much will be the doubling RAM or the CPU.  I'm on the lookoout for deals on a new rig, might join ya...

[goliat26]

Hello again after some break.
I upgrade my hardware and make some tests...
Now i have:
I5 13600 kf
32GB DDR5 5600MHz CL36,
RTX 3090

With settings from my 1st post (just high presset in game) now i have ~38 FPS so its the same count as before upgrade...


With settings from third post from the end of first page i have ~50FPS so its again the same count as before upgrade...


Soo.... CPU it wasnt bottleneck. Frame time on FPS counter details is little lower in CPU section but it dont change FPS.

[edmuss]

Have you tuned your system properly?

Follow Thud's guides explicitly and to the letter, you should be getting more performance than you have.

[goliat26]

23 minutes ago, edmuss said:

Have you tuned your system properly?

I have clean Windows 11 installation with clean Steam and clean DCS. Clean OpenXR and clean OpenComposite. All fresh installations.
I dont know what can i do more.

[edmuss]

That's likely your problems, there is a massive amount of bloat in windows alone.  Read the guides and follow them to the letter

[goliat26]

19 hours ago, edmuss said:

there is a massive amount of bloat in windows alone

What do you mean?

[Baldrick33]

7 minutes ago, goliat26 said:

What do you mean?

By default, Windows has lots of stuff running you don't need (want) for a gaming PC. e.g. productivity tools which can be useful for a general purpose PC but eat up CPU cycles, RAM etc. in the background. There are some useful guides of what to stop running, uninstall etc.

[goliat26]

And you really think that my old CPU with 5 years old windows 10 installation (with a lot of stuff installed) dont make difference with clean windows 11 installation??
On vr4dcs.com all posts are very old (2 years +) soo DCS change a lot (and windows and all another software) change a log ;/.

In this video

he can get 90 fps but game looks like.... sh***

I dont know what to say... Meaby its time to come to terms with low FPS...

[edmuss]

All of the stuff in the VR4DCS guides is still pertinent. With your machine you should be able to run medium high settings at 70-80fps, whether you choose to run reprojection or not, 90hz or 60hz is a choice you have to make

[goliat26]

I read all guides about Reverb G2 and dcs and apply few trics but no change. In my opiniom 90% of this settings is without sense (and make no difference for me). 

1 hour ago, edmuss said:

medium high settings

But what exacly settings :).

[Migo]

Have you tried to start with every setting at its lowest and look at the fps? You can then start to increase one setting after another, checking the fps at each step, until you reach your performance goal.

If your fps are still bad with everything low, then its not DCS, but something else causing the issue.

I usually follow this procedure as this gives you the most information and in the past I was surprised that options like water quality or civ traffic affected my fps the most.

Also install the latest Windows update, which improves game performance (https://forum.dcs.world/topic/313913-holographicshell-fix/)
and turn off Hardware Accelerated GPU Scheduling in Windows settings.

Hope you achieve an improvement!

[edmuss]

1 hour ago, goliat26 said:

I read all guides about Reverb G2 and dcs and apply few trics but no change. In my opiniom 90% of this settings is without sense (and make no difference for me). 

But what exacly settings :).

It's all about incremental gains, there is no one magic bullet but building up the performance 0.1ms at a time.

My go to settings are effectively VR preset with high textures/water/shadows, MSAAx2, sliders up a little, AF bumped up to 8x or 16x and terrain shadows off (for now till the flat option ditches the soft edges and returns 2.7 performance). G2 at 2700 resolution, FFR quality/wide preset, I'll typically get 11.5-15ms depending on where I am flying.

This is with all of the vr4dcs tuning applied, CPU undervolted, GPU undervolted and overclocked and all things running as they should.

[goliat26]

4 hours ago, Migo said:

Have you tried to start with every setting at its lowest and look at the fps? You can then start to increase one setting after another, checking the fps at each step, until you reach your performance goal.

No i dont check lowest settings FPS. I will try it.

 

4 hours ago, Migo said:

Also install the latest Windows update, which improves game performance (https://forum.dcs.world/topic/313913-holographicshell-fix/)
and turn off Hardware Accelerated GPU Scheduling in Windows settings.

Thanks, i will install this update and try HAGS off.
 

 

2 hours ago, edmuss said:

G2 at 2700 resolution

What do you mean 2700? It is x1 scale in OpenXR tool and x1 in game or lower setting?

 

2 hours ago, edmuss said:

FFR quality/wide preset

This is setting from OpenXR toolkit?

[crazyave]

Did you ever try the settings I shared?  You don't have to think, just use them and you should see the same/similar results...

[firefox121]

En 17/11/2022 a las 19:26, goliat26 dijo:

Hello.

Few days ago i bougth RTX 3090 (change from RTX 3070) especially for DCS. Rest of my CPU is i7 8700k, 16 GB RAM and M2 NVME SSD for system and another NVME SSD for games. I use HP Reverb G2 for VR.

Before i get RTX 3090 i used Oculus Rift S with RTX 3070. It was very smooth on High preset in VR. Then i change GPU for RTX 3090 and googles for Reverb G2 and High preset is unplayable. Max 40 fps and its too low for me because i fell sick when i see stuttering... I was hoping for at least 50fps and now i am dissapointed. I tried steam VR and OpenComposite with OpenXR tool. No difference in fps.

Here are my settings in DCS



And here is screen from Windows process manager


And FPS counter in game


As you can on process manager screen, GPU works on 100% and CPU on about 40% with sometimes pick to 90%.

Can you give me any advices to boost fps? Or meaby RTX 3090 users can tell me if it is normal FPS for this card?

 

Sorry if this has been said before, one of the most fps killing for mr are the two last settings, SSLR and SSAO, I always turns OFF both, indeed I wasn't able to see differences between on and off as far as the high drop of frames.

[edmuss]

From what you're saying, you haven't done any system tuning or optimisation, all of the things mentioned already are part of this and you would be aware of them if you had done it.

Without setting up the system properly it will perform suboptimally. DCS vr isn't plug and play.

Read the guides and follow them along with the advice given here, observe what works and what doesn't. It's a very personal choice regarding the image in VR and there is no one answer or setup for everyone.

[silverdevil]

there is always tweaking to do. windows has been this way since the beginning. get windows sorted and to your satisfaction. then work on dcs. scientific method

Edited December 3, 2022 by silverdevil

[goliat26]

2 hours ago, crazyave said:

Did you ever try the settings I shared?  You don't have to think, just use them and you should see the same/similar results...

Ofc i tried them but without steam VR settings because i was using OpenXR. I tested it with steam VR while ago and i got 50-60 fps like you.
But this settings are unplayable for me because of view range. I like low altitude flying so if trees or buildings shows to me 1km in front of me its hmm anoying :D.

With the same settings but with OpenXR (so 100% scaling - not 70%) and with OpenXR toolkit i got 55-70 fps with this settings.
I

This was my first try with this toolkit soo settings are not best i think...

 

1 hour ago, edmuss said:

From what you're saying, you haven't done any system tuning or optimisation, all of the things mentioned already are part of this and you would be aware of them if you had done it.

I made few of them... I turn off game mode in windows, turn off HAGS, install updates, config NVidia settings etc. Most of them like turn off default windows services or turn off background applications in my opinion is useless this applications havent impact on GPU.

If you mean specific guide please paste me link to it.

 

 

5 hours ago, edmuss said:

My go to settings are effectively VR preset with high textures/water/shadows, MSAAx2, sliders up a little, AF bumped up to 8x or 16x and terrain shadows off (for now till the flat option ditches the soft edges and returns 2.7 performance). G2 at 2700 resolution, FFR quality/wide preset, I'll typically get 11.5-15ms depending on where I am flying.

With the same settings (excluding "G2 at 2700 resolution" because i dont know what is it ) i have 45-50 FPS. I use AF x16 and sliders up about 30-40%.
I dont know how  you get 60-90 FPS with this settings.

Edited December 3, 2022 by goliat26

[edmuss]

1 hour ago, goliat26 said:

I made few of them... I turn off game mode in windows, turn off HAGS, install updates, config NVidia settings etc. Most of them like turn off default windows services or turn off background applications in my opinion is useless this applications havent impact on GPU.

 

1 hour ago, goliat26 said:

I dont know how  you get 60-90 FPS with this settings.

Because I've done all of the tuning and the system is set up and running very well....

100% resolution for the G2 is 3160 so 2700 is about 85%. It gains a ms or so back for absolutely minimal loss of clarity as long as you have MSAA enabled to smooth the edges.

[goliat26]

35 minutes ago, edmuss said:

100% resolution for the G2 is 3160 so 2700 is about 85%. It gains a ms or so back for absolutely minimal loss of clarity as long as you have MSAA enabled to smooth the edges.

Where you set this resolution? In OpenXR settings?

35 minutes ago, edmuss said:

Because I've done all of the tuning and the system is set up and running very well....

Hmm if you can, you can post screen with your settings and make FPS test in the same airplane, the same map, the same ramp and the same weather as me.

 

Btw... With settings when i have 60+ FPS i still see big stuttering of buildings when i fly on low altitude. Is it normal (without motion reprojection ofc).

Edited December 3, 2022 by goliat26