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Real development status of BO-105


phant

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@The_Fragger @Zeus67 @Prowler111 @myHelljumper

Brief historical summary

  1. July 2015: Polychop-Simulations officially obtains the Third Party license for the development of SA-342M Gazelle and BO-105 PAH1A1.
  2. April 2017: Polychop Simulations and The_Fragger announce that their development path separates: MilTech-5 is born and will independently develop the BO-105 PAH1A1.
  3. January 2020: MilTech-5 and RAZBAM announce an agreement to advance the development of the BO-105 PAH1A1.
  4. January 2023: In response to a comment on the official MilTech-5 FB page, The_Fragger replies "We are waiting for the coder -> last contact was June. He applied for a new job...since then -> no response".

image.jpeg

  • Is the agreement with RAZBAM still in place (a recent podcast with RAZBAM mentioned three helicopters in development but it's not clear if the BO-105 is included)?
  • Is the recruitment of the new developer in June 2022 part of the collaboration with RAZBAM?
  • Many screenshots are posted that highlight the development and updating of the graphic assets (and this is good) but considering that we have entered the eighth year of development since the original announcement, it is possible to officially know the current and concrete state of development of the module BO-105 PAH1A1 at present?
  • Will there be an official report dedicated to the BO-105 PAH1A1 in the upcoming Eagle Dynamics NL dedicated to Third Parties?

Thanks in advance for any response you may have!

 

Bye
Phant


Edited by phant
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AMVI

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The collaboration with RAZBAM ist still active. The Coder has a new MAINJOB (!). 
One cannot assume that everyone has 98% of the time to take care of a module.
The long lasting time has nothing to do with me or RAZBAM.

These are a chain of negative events over which I and RAZBAM have no influence (!)
We need to face that and make the best out of it 🙂

That's life.

Thanks


Edited by The_Fragger
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This taking a while to get out of the door is probably frustrating for all parties involved. Especially for The_Fragger, this is his baby and I am sure nobody wants to see this getting released more then he does. Stuff out of your control can be super frustrating, respect for all the people that still want to make this happen after all this time. Good things come to those that wait. In the mean time we have plenty of stuff to enjoy in DCS and one day the Bo-105 will be there, Im sure!

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''Greed is a bottomless pit which exhausts the person in an endless effort to satisfy the need without ever reaching satisfaction.''

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I am also desperately waiting for this module….. I had the opportunity to spent one day in a German airbase of this helicopter in 1989…… 🙂

 

To be honest: I have bought the Gazelle because I thought that this would help for developing the BO-105.

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1 hour ago, ebabil said:

 

Please, don't quote any videos from that channel for information.

From what I see, he just takes scraps of publicly available information, adds lots of sensationalism and conjecture into it to collect clicks out of low effort content. He quotes no sources for the claims either.

Fragger himself denied it being on hold on Miltech-5 discord after seeing that video.

Are things rosy for Bo-105? No. Looks like coder who was supposed to work on it isn't available anymore, and they're looking for a new one together with razbam, and Fragger is continuing the 3d work. So the project is in a difficult spot alright, but it is ongoing anyway. But that channel ain't the place to look for reliable information, at all.

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Ist möglicherweise ein Bild von Luftfahrzeug

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2D/3D Artist

MILTECH-5 /PD

Lead 3D Artist - TrueGrit Virtual Technologies

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

 

BO-105 PAH1A1/VBH / HKP-9A / BO-105 CBS-5 KLH

Eurofighter Typhoon

https://www.facebook.com/PolyDynamicsDCS/

 

 

 

 

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Heavy Metal is the law ! :punk:

 

 

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On 1/14/2023 at 1:27 AM, phant said:

"We are waiting for the coder -> last contact was June.

:thumbdown: June? What are you waiting for? 

10 hours ago, The_Fragger said:

....

Cant wait, but looks like 2024, not before I suppose.


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On 1/17/2023 at 10:43 AM, The_Fragger said:


The collaboration with RAZBAM ist still active. The Coder has a new MAINJOB (!). 
One cannot assume that everyone has 98% of the time to take care of a module.
The long lasting time has nothing to do with me or RAZBAM.

These are a chain of negative events over which I and RAZBAM have no influence (!)
We need to face that and make the best out of it 🙂

That's life.

Thanks

 

The Coder has a new MAINJOB (!). Frankly, no module announcement should be made if the people involved are employees somewhere else.

Working in 'spare' time on a module is good for unofficial mods. 

Development itself takes time, what if a next coder is able to bring it to early access and then leaves the for 'other' job? Early access will be ONLY access. 

Good luck with finding a solid replacement! 

 

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26 minutes ago, Gierasimov said:

Frankly, no module announcement should be made if the people involved are employees somewhere else.

Working in 'spare' time on a module is good for unofficial mods. 

Well too bad then, you can kiss goodbye possibly all modules other than ED's.

Me meanwhile, will enjoy them 😉

The gall people have am I right?! How dare they think of making a living, or you know, what if a new 3rd party dev is only able to afford a part time/contractor kind of deal!

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Module announcement not module, right? 

I am waiting for Mudhen,my first third party aircraft module ...

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4 minutes ago, Gierasimov said:

Module announcement not module, right? 

I am waiting for Mudhen,my first third party aircraft module ...

No, very much module, as great majority of existing DCS modules were made with teams consisting of mostly part timers and contractors, including programming side. I think even ED works with contractors sometimes, but I believe in their case it's more often on the art or other less critical sides. Working part time, or working with non-permanent contractors is pretty much an industry standard.

Yes, it may come with a greater risk of burnout for devs, yes it may take longer overall, but it also makes things even possible at all in the first place.

Well careful with that purchase! As far as I know, Razbam's flight model coder isn't a full time DCS dev either, it may damage your DCS meticulousness! 🙂

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I know about RAZBAM, I know about third parties and their time to work on a module. 

What I said though, is that modules should not be really announced in situations if you have just one person coding /doing it the critical task.

Remember what happened to Hornet's A/G radar? It was one person job and that person left. ED had to find another person and that took time. So, yeah it can happen even to a big shots like ED, relatively speaking, IF there is no backup / contingency planned. 

Every asset should be doubled at least. That way if one person goes the other person picks up and continues. 

Businesses often think of disaster recovery / backup / high availability of the hardware, systems and data, but unfortunately often forget about their workforce, in this case a critical piece of the puzzle. 

Let's also not forget that it isn't just any programmer that's needed. It's specifically programmer who understands the concept and has the knowhow and skills required for the particular type of development plus there is a learning curve for ED specifics. 

Wasn't that one of the third parties that said that it took them a year to get their heads around DCS development tools and methods? 

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On 1/27/2023 at 5:14 PM, The_Fragger said:

Ist möglicherweise ein Bild von Luftfahrzeug

Keep up the out standing work and do not let a few irritated people distract you.  My old man worked for Aerospatiale (Air Bus Helicopters) and I remember when MBB became a part of Eurocopter.  They had the one they used in Mission Impossible out at the Grand Prairie plant.  I remember as a kid going out there and watching them fly.  Also went up a few times (back then you could).  I am very much looking forward to this Helo and very excited with all the hard work you have done.  We have plenty coming and plenty to keep us busy with DCS until you finish her.  This will be a day 1 for me.  Brings back very fond memories of growing up around the flight deck with my Dad.

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

Just my 2 cents but: A module like the Bo105 should be rather successful right? So wouldnt it be better to hire someone new to finally get the Module out and generate some income than waiting for XY to get back to work or making it his/hers full time job?

 

Its more complex than that, I get it. But then again 8 years is really long for not getting anything out of a module.

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  • 1 month later...
On 1/28/2023 at 5:48 AM, WinterH said:

No, very much module, as great majority of existing DCS modules were made with teams consisting of mostly part timers and contractors, including programming side. I think even ED works with contractors sometimes, but I believe in their case it's more often on the art or other less critical sides. Working part time, or working with non-permanent contractors is pretty much an industry standard.

Yes, it may come with a greater risk of burnout for devs, yes it may take longer overall, but it also makes things even possible at all in the first place.

Well careful with that purchase! As far as I know, Razbam's flight model coder isn't a full time DCS dev either, it may damage your DCS meticulousness! 🙂

I remember when ED was like five guys working in a garage. All of you guys think the waiting is rough now. You should have been there for the Blackshark development. There was a good stretch between 2006-2008 where it really looked like it wasn't going to happen. Or the Mig-21 the first third party module. That was a drama. These things take forever, and are never really real until they are sitting on our hard drive. I hope this helicopter happens. It'll be a great counterpart to the Hind. Same era totally different design philosophy. But if it doesn't so be it DCS will go on. As far as making demands or complaints about the time it takes to develop a modules, if you haven't paid into it you really don't have any room to complain one way or the other. 

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21 minutes ago, FlankerKiller said:

It'll be a great counterpart to the Hind.

Oh we need an 80s to early 90s AH-1W and/or F for that, we very much do need exactly that! Not one that's earlier, nor later. I can make do with earlier T maybe to a degree, but something like 2000s Z or upgraded W would be a huge shame. 75 to early 90s, and especially 80s stuff is the absolute stuff for DCS imo.

All that said, I am very much looking forward to Bo-105 for being a cool little agile and interesting helicopter, and also for having seen dedication of the person behind it to make it happen all through years.

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2 hours ago, WinterH said:
2 hours ago, FlankerKiller said:

It'll be a great counterpart to the Hind.

Oh we need an 80s to early 90s AH-1W and/or F for that, we very much do need exactly that! Not one that's earlier, nor later.

The A/H-1W would be awesome They had a Marine training unit that operated the W model just down the ramp from us. Even seeing them every day they were never less cool. The A/H-1W is just an awesome machine. 

That being said in Germany in the 80s if the cold war had gone hot then the.        BO-105 would have seen a ton of anti tank action. It would definitely have gone toe to toe with the Hind. It's a totally different design philosophy. But they would be doing the same work over the same battlefield. 

 

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Am 27.4.2023 um 03:49 schrieb Devil 505:

Old school demo video (VHS days) of the B0-105

 

1tens: Was für ein ARCHGEILER Sound dieser Hubschrauber hat. Bekommt man Gänsehaut.

2tens: Wir brauchen ENDLICH die Bo in DCS World!

3tens: Was für ein b e g n a d e t e r Pilot. Wie er den Heli in diesem Terrain rannimmt...Macht einen einfach sprachlos...!


Edited by kotor633
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We want the BO…..we need the BO!!! And thanks to theFragger we‘ll get the BO!!!

 


Edited by corbu1
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  • 3 weeks later...

Yes this will be a very special module when it arrives... it will be worth the wait!

 

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