Deka Simulations announces the DCS: J-8II for DCS World!

[Mike_Romeo]

[Naudiz]

Can't wait to see what this turns out to be.

Would be a lie to say I'm not slightly disappointed that they went for the version with western avionics, but if that's where Deka can get verifiable data and reliable documentation, that's understandable enough. In the end, it's better to have this than to have none at all, and it will still be on my wishlist for sure.

[F-2]

3 minutes ago, Naudiz said:

Can't wait to see what this turns out to be.

Would be a lie to say I'm not slightly disappointed that they went for the version with western avionics, but if that's where Deka can get verifiable data and reliable documentation, that's understandable enough. In the end, it's better to have this than to have none at all, and it will still be on my wishlist for sure.

I think it should be taken domestic Chinese avonics are unlikely. 
 

 

very exciting! Pl-11 is what I need.

 

 

Deka would you like some public documentation on APG-66 that I have?

https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA142075.pdf

https://www.scribd.com/document/429057021/F-16-Pulse-Doppler-Radar-AN-APG-66-Performance-1983

 

 

this is perfect for my 90s early 2000s East Asian scenarios!

APG-66.pdf Apg-66 2.pdf

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

I'd also have preferred the domestic avionics, but no looking a gift horse in a mouth. Work with what you can get. I'm hyped. Will get.

Edited February 10, 2023 by MiG21bisFishbedL

[Schmidtfire]

Interesting! Will Deka get the correct info and data on all this? From what I have read, only 2 (!) Peace Pearl prototypes was fitted with the western avionics. Incomplete and cancelled around 1989-1990. Im sure Deka can dig up info on individual systems, but maybe guesswork on how they are tied together? Anyways, interesting choice, will buy Day 1

[CaptJodan]

I'm torn on my feelings for the westernized version.  On the one hand, I'm all about that realism and authenticity.  And getting a redfor take on avionics design is always interesting.  On the other hand, I get more use out of aircraft that have a western feel to them.  The Jeff is in my permanent rotation because of it's western feel.  I'd love to say I have the time to learn all the aircraft I purchase, but I don't, and without trying, I lean to aircraft that are easier out of the gate to understand (aka western aircraft).  So as a practical matter only, I can get behind this choice largely because it will mean the plane is more likely to be a part of my hanger rotation.  

[ThorBrasil]

Is the cockpit digital or analogue?

[F-2]

4 minutes ago, ThorBrasil said:

Is the cockpit digital or analogue?

Both it’s kinda a mix

[Mr_sukebe]

I’m a bit confused by this.

From what I’ve just read, the PP never flew.  Is the intent to use an FM for a different variant?

[Torbernite]

 

I’m a bit confused by this.

From what I’ve just read, the PP never flew.  Is the intent to use an FM for a different variant?

PP doesn't include improvements on power or aerodynamics, so the data from existing subtypes could be good enough as an approximation. The only changeable factor is the weight or mass center, but the weight could be acquired from the remaining data, and the mass center may not be very different as the control system is conventional.

[F-2]

I think they or someone visited the surviving peace pearl aircraft a few years back.

 

 

I would take it this that getting info on retired Chinese avonics is difficult and they went with PP because of that.

[Krez]

Some were flown to the US for the PP upgrades and about 24 were produced. After the project was cancelled, he USAF kept them and tested them.
Of course this is not from a primary source. I'm sure Deka know what they are doing.

[WinterH]

I'll say it honestly: I am at the very least somewhat disappointed. But it is still somewhat interesting, and I'll probably get it.

Any Q-5, I'd have vastly preferred, a late J-7, I'd have vastly preferred. I know Su-30 is very unlikely, but even as someone who doesn't care much for later birds, I'd have vastly preferred. Even J-10 would be somewhat more unique.

But, given the latest hints, I was ready to learn to like a J-8, but any other J-8 II variant over this, I'd have vastly preferred...

Anyway, with that out of the way, it was probably more feasible to get information on this abortive variant with known-quantities for avionics, than the ones with Chinese avionics.

[Torbernite]

 

I think they or someone visited the surviving peace pearl aircraft a few years back.

 

 

I would take it this that getting info on retired Chinese avonics is difficult and they went with PP because of that.

Totally agree. And the project is not carried out fully by Americans. There were Chinese technicians sent to Grumman to work with the foreign cooperators. There could be documents in Chinese archives and Deka may have the access to them if allowed. The classification of those documents (if exist) is surely lower than those in service. Subsystems may have more info and mainly the overall design needed to put them together.

[uboats]

For 8PP, two finished upgrade and tested and flew.

US wanted to continue the program very much but asked too much money further, so China cancelled it in 1992

[Morri]

@PLAAF As I saw you're the man that knows his stuff for the J-8 variants and such, From all that I've read , it constantly says that J-8IIs were flown over to be upgraded as part of Peace Pearl but I can't figure out which variant was the one that was to be upgraded , so what is the base from which the PP is built? I'm assuming probably the B variant. Have you got any info on this?

[AdrianL]

Interesting article about the J-8PP https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/40396/the-u-s-once-helped-china-develop-a-modern-jet-fighter

[uboats]

16 minutes ago, Morri said:

@PLAAF As I saw you're the man that knows his stuff for the J-8 variants and such, From all that I've read , it constantly says that J-8IIs were flown over to be upgraded as part of Peace Pearl but I can't figure out which variant was the one that was to be upgraded , so what is the base from which the PP is built? I'm assuming probably the B variant. Have you got any info on this?

J-8B

[NineLine]

J-8II 
Deka Ironwork Simulations

During the 1980s, China’s J-7 and J-8 could nullno longer confront the threats of the Su-24 and Tu-22 from the north. Therefore, there was an urgent need for a fighter with medium-range interception capabilities that consequently gave birth to the J-8II. In order to install a larger radar, the nose air intake and its shock cone were replaced with an ogival radome and lateral air intakes. Benefitting from an upgraded power plant, using two WP-13B turbojet engines, the J-8II, as an interceptor, can carry medium-range air-to-air missiles and fly Mach 2.2 at 12,000 meters.

The upgraded J-8II by Grumman (a.k.a J-8PP) was fitted with APG-66(V) radar, 1553B bus, and other western devices. For the first time, the 1553 data bus concept was introduced to the Chinese aviation industry. To launch and guide Aspide/PL-11 medium-range missiles, a Chinese made continuous wave emitter was installed to work with the APG-66(V) radar. The J-8PP can perform medium-range interception against low-altitude / high-speed and high-altitude / high-speed intruders. It also has limited ground attack capability.

The DCS: J-8II module will include the flyable J-8PP and the AI J-8F.

Key features of J-8PP include:
AN/APG-66V-PRC-F8 radar with NAM, STT, ACM, GM, and AGR modes
AWG-27 for loadout management
Fire Control Computer from Westinghouse
LN-39 INS
HUD from GEC
Head Down Display from Honeywell
Air Data Computer (CPU-140/A) from GEC
Radar Warning Receiver SPJ/IFF
2 x WP-13B turbojet engines
Air-to-Air missiles: Aspide/PL-11, PL-8 and PL-5
Unguided weapons: 250kg GP bombs and 57mm/90mm rockets

We hope you enjoyed this preview of this fascinating new module coming to DCS. 
 

[Mike Force Team]

Looking forward to the module.

Mike Force Team

 

 

 

[yngvef]

I am excited! Deka has done a great job with the JF-17, so I am sure this project is in great hands!

[Mr_sukebe]

1 hour ago, Torbernite said:

PP doesn't include improvements on power or aerodynamics, so the data from existing subtypes could be good enough as an approximation. The only changeable factor is the weight or mass center, but the weight could be acquired from the remaining data, and the mass center may not be very different as the control system is conventional.

That makes sense and I agree with your logic about the key differences being probably weight and location of that weight.

Part of my question is really for Deka. A similar query is likely to be raised in the future of whether we’re getting a real production aircraft, or a “guesstimated” prototype.  It’s probably worth them anticipating that and preparing an answer for people who may well be significantly more belligerent than me.

[uboats]

5 minutes ago, Mr_sukebe said:

Part of my question is really for Deka. A similar query is likely to be raised in the future of whether we’re getting a real production aircraft, or a “guesstimated” prototype.  It’s probably worth them anticipating that and preparing an answer for people who may well be significantly more belligerent than me.

step by step

[gnomechild]

Of all the aircraft available to make, Deka has decided to make a jet that never existed beyond a prototyping phase. Really not sure what the thought process is here. "Full fidelity" simulation of a fantasy I guess

Edited February 10, 2023 by gnomechild

[uboats]

J-8II won dogfight over JF-17 in Pakistan years ago.

Unfortunately, J-8II has same gun deviation angle as JF-17 

Per 82 program office, 2 finished upgrade and many test (i.e. EMC, INS (around Edwards AF) etc), along with 4 avionics upgrade pack (radar, etc) were sent back to China later.

On 2/10/2023 at 9:59 AM, gnomechild said:

 

Edited February 13, 2023 by uboats