Mi-24P - What next ?

[Razorback]

There have been many improvements to the Mi-24P but for some time now, apart from a few small changes such as the improved Petrovitch messages, it is difficult to get an idea of what still needs to be implemented.
The module is still in Open Beta...What improvements or achievements still need to be implemented to have a module that will not be modified in the future?
For exemple, a pilot watch, a new helmet where presented but there is no news for months now. And it's only a 3D modelisation exemple...
It might be interesting if ED could give us a more precise idea of the adaptations of future improvements that should be added to the module...
No need to specify priorities or give a release estimate but just mention what the developers still want to bring to the Hind.
Thanks in advance,

 

[AeriaGloria]

I know for release that they are working on the pilot model you mentioned. That they also are working on full manual. They promised campaign on caucuses as well with module for free. 

They have also promised to allow both map sizes to work for all ED maps. 
 

I reported SPO-10 innacuracies a while ago, and the feedback seemed to be that it would be looked at. I really hope that gets improved. In addition there is still some desync between cockpit seats, I hope that is added. And a few more keybinds such as the Lcntrl + T for gunner to bind axis. 

 

I can’t think of much else that wouldn’t add any new features outside of the original release scope 

[kotor633]

Hi,

In addition to what AeriaGloria has already listed, I would think of an additional display (see screenshot, analogous to the Mi-8 or UH-1) for Sling Load operations. And isn't it (according to Chuck's guide) that the bombing system isn't fully implemented yet? That would still be a point. One question: would the UPK-23-250 be an topic as an armament for the Mi-24P?

null

[AeriaGloria]

4 hours ago, kotor633 said:

Hi,

In addition to what AeriaGloria has already listed, I would think of an additional display (see screenshot, analogous to the Mi-8 or UH-1) for Sling Load operations. And isn't it (according to Chuck's guide) that the bombing system isn't fully implemented yet? That would still be a point. One question: would the UPK-23-250 be an topic as an armament for the Mi-24P?

null

The bombing system is fully implemented. The timers work and the sight can be depressed 30 degrees. What’s missing for employment is bomb drop tables for CPG. If you want the ones for 250 kmh, you can find them in my weapons guide. Someone pointed out recently that since the charts indicate -3 degrees pitch at 250 kmh, you have to add/subtract the difference to your sight depression 

[hannibal]

On 3/28/2023 at 10:04 AM, AeriaGloria said:

I reported SPO-10 innacuracies a while ago, and the feedback seemed to be that it would be looked at. I really hope that gets improved. In addition there is still some desync between cockpit seats, I hope that is added. And a few more keybinds such as the Lcntrl + T for gunner to bind axis.  

 Also joystick axis assignments for mi24P Gunner with trackir/VR needed

It nice to know there are to do items for the hind, start to wonder if it was out of early access. I think i recall the Ed team last did major work for the Ai menu and behavior for mi24/ah64

[AeriaGloria]

7 hours ago, kotor633 said:

Hi,

In addition to what AeriaGloria has already listed, I would think of an additional display (see screenshot, analogous to the Mi-8 or UH-1) for Sling Load operations. And isn't it (according to Chuck's guide) that the bombing system isn't fully implemented yet? That would still be a point. One question: would the UPK-23-250 be an topic as an armament for the Mi-24P?

null

UPK-23-250 is an export only weapon. ED has based their weapon options on Russian only used weapons. Only export Mi-24 is compatible with UPK-23-250

 

47 minutes ago, hannibal said:

 Also joystick axis assignments for mi24P Gunner with trackir/VR needed

It nice to know there are to do items for the hind, start to wonder if it was out of early access. I think i recall the Ed team last did major work for the Ai menu and behavior for mi24/ah64

I don’t think it will be officially released until we have campaign and manual 

[Tormox]

Moreover, I think that more Petrovich (and George) updates should be expected, I recall plans about them helping during startup and ground checks. A Tomcat-style assisted startup that goes through checklist and system checks would be amazing.

[AeriaGloria]

7 hours ago, Tormox said:

Moreover, I think that more Petrovich (and George) updates should be expected, I recall plans about them helping during startup and ground checks. A Tomcat-style assisted startup that goes through checklist and system checks would be amazing.

I think it’s pretty lucky to have George so closely linked to Petrovich. Look how Hornet is still being developed and even F-16. The son of Peter being the older brother of George has ensured us many years of updates for George being ported over to the Mi-24 or simultaneous updates as George/Apache. I expect development of that system to be part of core DCS development from now on. 

[Stratos]

On 3/29/2023 at 6:00 PM, AeriaGloria said:

UPK-23-250 is an export only weapon. ED has based their weapon options on Russian only used weapons. Only export Mi-24 is compatible with UPK-23-250

This is so ridiculous, that even after all this time makes no sense.

[Razorback]

1 hour ago, Stratos said:

This is so ridiculous, that even after all this time makes no sense.

I totally agree….I can’t understand this decision…

More than that it’s a very basic weapon’ alredy modelized and easy to add to the Hind.
More used than the capacity of firing 8 Ataka or to had a Kord in the cargo bay…

Edited March 30, 2023 by Razorback

[AeriaGloria]

1 hour ago, Razorback said:

I totally agree….I can’t understand this decision…

More than that it’s a very basic weapon’ alredy modelized and easy to add to the Hind.
More used than the capacity of firing 8 Ataka or to had a Kord in the cargo bay…

 

 

2 hours ago, Stratos said:

This is so ridiculous, that even after all this time makes no sense.

I think our only hope is a Mi-24P 2 upgrade focusing on these export additions. 
 

23mm pods, more S-8/13 variants. SPO-15 (first would preferably be a more deeply modeled SPO-10 with a variable beep frequency). Cyprus used Mi-35P like ours but painted black for NVG compatibility, shortened wings, 8 rack Ataka launchers. And fixed gear all for decreased weight. 

Edited March 30, 2023 by AeriaGloria

[gorzasty]

I think they need to work hard on FM and DM. I can make a barrel roll and cobra maneuver. It is funny how bad it flies now :)

Wysłane z mojego SM-G960F przy użyciu Tapatalka

[AeriaGloria]

7 hours ago, gorzasty said:

I think they need to work hard on FM and DM. I can make a barrel roll and cobra maneuver. It is funny how bad it flies now

Wysłane z mojego SM-G960F przy użyciu Tapatalka
 

What else would you change with FM? 
 

There is recorded instances of rolls being done at a display in Afghanistan for Mil executives. And while the cobra is realistic, the helicopter would mush and pitch up violently, what’s missing is blades striking the tailboom. It seems from my reading this should happen if you keep pulling the stick back after the mush/cobra/rotor-stall happens. There has even been times that 24s returned home with dents on the top of their tail booms. That is the only thing that seems to truly be missing from the FM as I understand it, but there might also be a good reason such as lack of information on this dangerous occurrence

[Lace]

I would like the CPG sight image to be actually displayed in the sight, so that in VR I just lean over and look down the tube, rather than an immersion breaking transition to a flat screen sight.

[gorzasty]

7 hours ago, AeriaGloria said:

What else would you change with FM? 
 

There is recorded instances of rolls being done at a display in Afghanistan for Mil executives. And while the cobra is realistic, the helicopter would mush and pitch up violently, what’s missing is blades striking the tailboom. It seems from my reading this should happen if you keep pulling the stick back after the mush/cobra/rotor-stall happens. There has even been times that 24s returned home with dents on the top of their tail booms. That is the only thing that seems to truly be missing from the FM as I understand it, but there might also be a good reason such as lack of information on this dangerous occurrence

Can you share some data from Afghanistan? I was looking for any info about these manoeuvres and could not find any. 

[AeriaGloria]

2 hours ago, gorzasty said:

Can you share some data from Afghanistan? I was looking for any info about these manoeuvres and could not find any. 

It is a sometimes repeated but apparently truthful story. Most accounts seem to mention barrel rolls, and in Yefim Gordon he mentions at this particular display for Mil by the “hoolilgans” in Afghanistan also included turns at 60 degrees bank, right at the limit. 
 

“In such a kill-or-be-killed environment, Hind crews acquired a certain edge. Their own brass called them "flying hooligans"; in the US military, they would have been called "cowboys" or "hairy-assed". Early in the war, Marat Timoschenko had visited Afghanistan to see what the troops thought of his helicopters, and gunship crews put on spectacular displays for him. They even demonstrated maneuvers, such as barrel rolls, that the design engineers considered impossible. An astounded Dr. Timoschenko had to comment: "I thought I knew what my helicopters could do, now I'm not so sure!"

from http://www.airvectors.net/avhind_1.html

When it comes to Afghanistan, you have two really good sources. Soviet/Ex Soviet authors, giving primary accounts or the recorded primary accounts of the war. And also declassified CIA docs can be interesting, such as one totaling Soviet losses and comparing it to Soviet number. 
 

One Russian account I have read and found becuase it was shared on ED forums, was this http://otvaga2004.ru/boyevoe-primenenie/boyevoye-primeneniye04/afgan-vertolety-mi24/

I had fun using Google translate on this one. There are many others I do not have written down. 
 

Also, to stay on topic, L166V was never part of original features. So it follows that as a paid upgrade, you could have the introduction of L166V function as well as earlier generation MANPADS, including their useless with newer systems. 
 

I also think there are people that wish they could have soldiers in the windows with AK/PKT guns. I know it was found to be pretty useless during the Afghan war, but it would make an interesting dynamic to troop transport, being able to have four of them manning the window guns, the pot trying to give the gunner’s extremely small FOV the best chance. 

  I know there’s people that would love to have NS430 in 3D, in perhaps the front seat. But that’s a different story as that’s usually it’s own paid “module” as well. 
 

What would be a gift is a campaign showing how fun it can be…..

[Deimos]

YES, a campaign !

Ground-target mode for R-60.

GPS device  (seen in Hind cockpits. mounted in place of the original map or close to the window)

the option for more ammo in the 30mm gun  (isn´t it 470 rounds max?)

 

btw

while playing with track-IR i can´t go as close to the window (canopy) as i could in VR. seems like i have a huge,virtual cosmonaut helmet on, that bumps 

against the glas. In the beginning of the Hind-module that wasn´t he case. i could even lean outa the open door and look at he 30mm gun. 

 

[AeriaGloria]

3 hours ago, Deimos said:

YES, a campaign !

Ground-target mode for R-60.

GPS device  (seen in Hind cockpits. mounted in place of the original map or close to the window)

the option for more ammo in the 30mm gun  (isn´t it 470 rounds max?)

 

btw

while playing with track-IR i can´t go as close to the window (canopy) as i could in VR. seems like i have a huge,virtual cosmonaut helmet on, that bumps 

against the glas. In the beginning of the Hind-module that wasn´t he case. i could even lean outa the open door and look at he 30mm gun. 

 

No, 248-250 rounds is max. There is some websites that used to say 700, but I have a feeling this number comes from a video game, and was widely disseminated as people went “LOOK 700 30MM ROUNDS.” 

 

 

[lei]

i would like to have the ability to configure radio channels on the ground...

[randomTOTEN]

2 hours ago, lei said:

i would like to have the ability to configure radio channels on the ground...

the mission you're playing isn't finished.

[Logan54]

I wish ED will work at engine shoot down effect  when shooting non guided rockets in hover mode. Shoot down with small S-5 and S-8 but not with S-13 and S-24. Also I asked about adding S-25 non-guided rockets, that  were officially used a couple of times in Afghanistan. May be u can ask yor eng community about it, bc no answer on my questions.

See u guys also want SPO-15 as me, so I found russian Mi-24 (not sure about P version) with board numbers on tail boom. Seems it can be as modernised P as D version.  Need to check. 

Edited April 8, 2023 by Logan54

[Logan54]

that photos of Mi-24 with russian numbers and star can be the proof of using this version not only as foreign modernisationnullnull

Edited April 8, 2023 by Logan54

[AeriaGloria]

3 hours ago, Logan54 said:

I wish ED will work at engine shoot down effect  when shooting non guided rockets in hover mode. Shoot down with small S-5 and S-8 but not with S-13 and S-24. Also I asked about adding S-25 non-guided rockets, that  were officially used a couple of times in Afghanistan. May be u can ask yor eng community about it, bc no answer on my questions.

See u guys also want SPO-15 as me, so I found russian Mi-24 (not sure about P version) with board numbers on tail boom. Seems it can be as modernised P as D version.  Need to check. 

 

It was used a few times. But was it a regular part of the arsenal? It’s a fine line. For example it is easy to find Mi-24 manuals from 1984-1987 that describe S-13/24 use, give you tables, restrictions and such. But not so for S-25. This tells me it’s use was much rarer and more restricted then the others 

I think in Zambia and Croatia they also added Mk 40/44 torpedoes. I played on a BSD server where we had it missed to exchange bombs for the Mk 40 torpedoes. It’s lots of fun 

[Razorback]

Well, it seems that the community has some interesting ideas.

I had hoped for some participation in this discussion from ED but it seems that this module is maybe not interesting enough to have a small reply or comment...
It's good to share some work still in process (new helmet, gloves, watch,...) even if not really relevant but if it's to share zero news afterwards (even during many months), I don't really see the point excepted to get frustrations from the community...
Petrovitch was improved during the last months (in my opinion, essentially because "George"s is improved as well), some bugs were fixed and some additionnal minor changes were added which is a good thing.
I know that all the ED teams are working hard but it could be interesting to have a checklist of what has to be still developed for each module (not only for the Mi-24P).
A sort of basic roadmap whitout any date of release but with just the job that has still to be done by the teams...
The AH-64D has a clear roadmap of what is expected in the future, why it's not the case for the Mi-24P ?
I think it's a shame to not have a roadmap for a module that is still in development...
No news from Alexander's team since months now. During his last interview, He mentioned a possible implementation of multicrew for the Mi-8 (after the end of the Mi-24P development)...That's for sure not for tomorrow

Edited April 13, 2023 by Razorback

[admiki]

22 minutes ago, Razorback said:

Well, it seems that the community has some interesting ideas.

I had hoped for some participation in this discussion from ED but it seems that this module is maybe not interesting enough to have a small reply or comment...
It's good to share some work still in process (new helmet, gloves, watch,...) even if not really relevant but if it's to share zero news afterwards (even during many months), I don't really see the point excepted to get frustrations from the community...
Petrovitch was improved during the last months (in my opinion, essentially because "George"s is improved as well), some bugs were fixed and some additionnal minor changes were added which is a good thing.
I know that all the ED teams are working hard but it could be interesting to have a checklist of what has to be still developed for each module (not only for the Mi-24P).
A sort of basic roadmap whitout any date of release but with just the job that has still to be done by the teams...
The AH-64D has a clear roadmap of what is expected in the future, why it's not the case for the Mi-24P ?
I think it's a shame to not have a roadmap for a module that is still in development...
No news from Alexander's team since months now. During his last interview, He mentioned a possible implementation of multicrew for the Mi-8 (after the end of the Mi-24P development)...That's for sure not for tomorrow

Today's update just came out...nothing about the Mi-24P.
I am somewhat resigned and I don't expect much more...
 

Check again :))))

Got me too!