in progress Radar refactoring progress?

[falcon_120]

What is exactly the main items and changes that are being developed in general terms? Any news on when will have updates in a newsletter?

[Temetre]

Id be curious as well. After seeing the F-15Es radar from RAZBAM, I really hope they gonna do a work-over of the A2G radar, which is very barebones currently and seems to lacks important functionality. From what I understand, the Hornet radar should have very similar capabilities to the Strike Eagle. Maybe not quite the same resolution and range, but enough to identify vehicle types by radar. Seen anecdotes from Desert Storm of Hornets doing that.

Edited May 28, 2023 by Temetre

[Tango3B]

ED had the following to say in their Newsletter from January 13th, 2023: "Radar Update. In parallel with refactoring the Flight Model and FCS, a refactoring of the Hornet radar is well underway. Key elements to address are improving the look-down, PRF, scan azimuth and more in order to offer improved detection and target tracking simulation."

So, ED said it is "well underway." Then again, ED went completely radio silent on this topic. Same goes for the promised white paper regarding radar performance. I would also like to hear where we currently stand with the progress made on the radar. Any official statement on this? Any news to share would be very much appreciated...

Thank you.

 

Link to said Newsletter January 13th, 2023:

 

[falcon_120]

I would be happy enough with a newsletter chapter explaining which are the main items being refactored and how ambitious is ED on this. What things like scan azimuth means in this context, what was wrong about that (:/?)

What about probabilities of detection, detecting chaff, behavior of prf other than different baked in detection ranges, introduction to basic RCS changes depending on aspect...

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[Temetre]

Am 29.5.2023 um 21:36 schrieb Tango3B:

ED had the following to say in their Newsletter from January 13th, 2023: "Radar Update. In parallel with refactoring the Flight Model and FCS, a refactoring of the Hornet radar is well underway. Key elements to address are improving the look-down, PRF, scan azimuth and more in order to offer improved detection and target tracking simulation."

So, ED said it is "well underway." Then again, ED went completely radio silent on this topic. Same goes for the promised white paper regarding radar performance. I would also like to hear where we currently stand with the progress made on the radar. Any official statement on this? Any news to share would be very much appreciated...

Thank you.

 

Link to said Newsletter January 13th, 2023:

 

So no comment an A2G radar, or even terrain avoidance functions? 

That makes me a bit concerned. Both Hornet and Viper are missing a bunch of really basic features, and theres no mention anywhere. I made a post asking about stuff like stores-damage through g-forces elsewhere, which is a pretty elementary thing for the F-16, besides the general damage model.

Edited May 31, 2023 by Temetre

[opps]

Typical ED's movement. ED announce something, then go completely radio silence for monthes or years. Thread like this will be ignored or closed.

[NineLine]

6 hours ago, opps said:

Typical ED's movement. ED announce something, then go completely radio silence for monthes or years. Thread like this will be ignored or closed.

When we have something new to share, we will. In the meantime, the team is actively working on this. We go quiet when we are busy working on these things, and as soon as there is something to share you all will be the first to know. This thread is neither ignored nor closed. Thanks. 

[falcon_120]

Thanks Nineline, I'm sure the team is busy and appreciate the feedback, if I may ask for something, for me part of the fun is also reading about what has been developed, kind of a white paper style as the team did for the Amraam refactoring some years ago. I really enjoyed that as much as just receiving the patch with the changes. If you have the opportunity please let the team know some of us would love something like this.

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[Tango3B]

2 hours ago, NineLine said:

When we have something new to share, we will. In the meantime, the team is actively working on this. We go quiet when we are busy working on these things, and as soon as there is something to share you all will be the first to know. This thread is neither ignored nor closed. Thanks. 

First of all thank you for your reply 9L, I really appreciate it. The slightly negative undertone of the previous speaker aside, I think many of us here in the community have really been patient beyond measure with regard to this very topic - with all due respect. The whole number has been dragging on for an entire year now, please don't forget that. I personally totally understand that certain things take a lot of development time, at the end of the day you want the result to be right. I totally get that. But... a brief intermediate status of things must be. I think it's totally understandable if some in the community are starting to get a little restless as this not only affects the F/A-18, but also the Viper. And we don't want to fool ourselves, please. On your credit side there is currently not much progress to be seen in this regard. Still, I think many of us are keenly interested in this very topic. And rightfully so. So please just think about what you could present to the general public in the near future as a kind of "update teaser"... you just can't come along without it at this point. We've heard long enough about promises and postponements. Now it's up to you to simply deliver.

And please guys don't derail this thread. Just leave these words as they are. No small wars please, everything else has been said on the subject, I think.

 

Thank you, good luck and all the best to the team.

[amalahama]

Are MSI improvements also included in this "Radar refactoring" task?

Edited June 1, 2023 by amalahama

[NineLine]

On 5/31/2023 at 12:52 PM, Tango3B said:

First of all thank you for your reply 9L, I really appreciate it. The slightly negative undertone of the previous speaker aside, I think many of us here in the community have really been patient beyond measure with regard to this very topic - with all due respect. The whole number has been dragging on for an entire year now, please don't forget that. I personally totally understand that certain things take a lot of development time, at the end of the day you want the result to be right. I totally get that. But... a brief intermediate status of things must be. I think it's totally understandable if some in the community are starting to get a little restless as this not only affects the F/A-18, but also the Viper. And we don't want to fool ourselves, please. On your credit side there is currently not much progress to be seen in this regard. Still, I think many of us are keenly interested in this very topic. And rightfully so. So please just think about what you could present to the general public in the near future as a kind of "update teaser"... you just can't come along without it at this point. We've heard long enough about promises and postponements. Now it's up to you to simply deliver.

And please guys don't derail this thread. Just leave these words as they are. No small wars please, everything else has been said on the subject, I think.

 

Thank you, good luck and all the best to the team.

I totally understand and appreciate the absolute patience you have all have shown. I understand the frustration in the development times and wish I could convey the care and work the team is putting into this. You should see an update of info on this soon, I hope that will help tide you over. 

And again, I cannot stress enough how much we on the team appreciate your continued support and patience. 

Thanks

[BIGNEWY]

Please see todays news for an update 

 

[falcon_120]

@BIGNEWY thanks a lot and cheers to the team, lovely info.

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[GGTharos]

@BIGNEWY the news says that HPRF can detect closing target only, but that's not quite correct (detection performance for tail aspects will be less than MPRF) - could we get a little clarification?

[Tango3B]

3 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

Please see todays news for an update 

 

Many thanks for todays update. You did a really good job, that's exactly what I meant with a brief update on your development work. I think the update was at exactly the right time.

[MARLAN_]

I also really hope the mention of bars & azimuth affecting detection range is just a weird way of saying that increasing your scan volume will reduce the frequency of hits, thus reducing chance to detect based on %Pd. Hopefully its not another arbitrary penalty like it is currently for look down.

[NineLine]

45 minutes ago, MARLAN_ said:

I also really hope the mention of bars & azimuth affecting detection range is just a weird way of saying that increasing your scan volume will reduce the frequency of hits, thus reducing chance to detect based on %Pd. Hopefully its not another arbitrary penalty like it is currently for look down.

Ill see if I can get an answer, it's also possible the white paper will hit before the release and help some, either way I will see if we can get some clarification.

[MARLAN_]

1 hour ago, NineLine said:

Ill see if I can get an answer, it's also possible the white paper will hit before the release and help some, either way I will see if we can get some clarification.

Thank you for looking into this, appreciate it.

[Xhonas]

3 hours ago, NineLine said:

Ill see if I can get an answer, it's also possible the white paper will hit before the release and help some, either way I will see if we can get some clarification.

Will the new radar update feature ground clutter (false returns) when flying at low altitude in both F/A-18 and F-16 radars like seen in this video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VseTWC_jSE0&t=251s  already timestamped.

[falcon_120]

Will the new radar update feature ground clutter (false returns) when flying at low altitude in both F/A-18 and F-16 radars like seen in this video? 

  already timestamped.

That would be nice, it would open up so many tactical considerations for low level flying, I think the mirage 2000 from Razbam already simulates this which is neat.

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[Northstar98]

17 minutes ago, falcon_120 said:

That would be nice, it would open up so many tactical considerations for low level flying, I think the mirage 2000 from Razbam already simulates this which is neat.

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It does.

The Tomcat also does in pulse-doppler modes, particularly amongst mountains and hilly terrain (as a result of the notch filter being disabled above 3°).

[Blackfyre]

6 hours ago, NineLine said:

Ill see if I can get an answer, it's also possible the white paper will hit before the release and help some, either way I will see if we can get some clarification.

I'm waiting for whitepaper even more than actual release of improvements. I genuinely hope that it will clarify many things about radars in DCS.

[dorianR666]

i wonder if gimbal limits of AG radar will be implemented

 

currently you can fly straight up and still be able to map the ground below you lol

Edited June 6, 2023 by dorianR666

[wilbur81]

On 6/2/2023 at 11:40 PM, NineLine said:

Ill see if I can get an answer, it's also possible the white paper will hit before the release and help some, either way I will see if we can get some clarification.

Just read the white paper (on the Hornet radar... Absolutely BRILLIANT work, fellas! The entire ED team should be beyond proud! Thanks for keeping the users in the loop regarding the complexity, care, and time being put in to these modules. 

White paper link: 

 https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/upload/medialibrary/751/420tvzzkl8vyxzukcdzamjf7gcrhwzmo/Eagle_Dynamics_Radar_White_Paper_v1.pdf?fbclid=IwAR1nYO05GSHwH0v8qkIaqklwi4ejWqt-bfAAgMNRkEyZXhuGswaDxt4yNN0

 

Edited June 9, 2023 by wilbur81

[falcon_120]

I had some flight tests yesterday, detection rangesin HI prf for the hornet are definetely better than before the patch. Also tried some high to low scenario (Hornet angels 26, hot f16 coming at 500ft AGL, and i had no problem picking him up on radar on HI PRF and VS mode a bit further than 40nm I think.

VS mode is particulary good at picking hot very fast target, you get good hits over 50nm for fighter size targets, which is great.