The Rookie Thread

[Yurgon]

Turned out I had some time to do it now. So, here's a track. Trimming after every maneuver really helped with stability, but I wonder if I'm doing something wrong, or is it just lack of practice. Download link: http://puu.sh/anACo/9975464e40.trk

 

Great flying technique! You sure you've only been doing this for two days? Because my Ka-50 flying looked a lot worse after just two days. :)

 

In any case, your pattern looked really smooth and well flown. Right after take-off and during the final approach I observed what you called "diagonal flying", and I'm sure that it's indeed you fighting the auto-pilot channels because you weren't trimming enough in these phases of the flight.

 

There's this famous

. You can hear the trim clicking really often. That's how it's done in the real thing. :thumbup:

 

Basically, the "Russian" or "Eastern" doctrine is to trim often, even (especially) during maneuvers. If you learn how to do that, you can have the Ka-50 fly turns and all kinds of maneuvers hands-free, which is quite a great help because there are enough tasks left to do, given its single-seat layout. :)

 

On a side note, your sudden descent (when IAS MAX was beeping) was pretty well flown. Most newbies would have created rotor blade salad in that situation. :D

[Isegrim]

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha not a trim issue hahahahahahahahahahahaha good one :D

 

In the KA, every issue is a trim issue. The concept of trimming in that chopper is quite different from any other thing that flies. Yes, it would be wise to read about trimming and autopilot in the KA in the first place. Which makes me wonder: are you actually using autopilot channels?

 

As two of us told you, post a track. We will redo it for you and point your problem accurately.

 

 

Thats simply wrong. Trim proplems are only a part of the proplems new pilots have with the KA-50.

BTW the shark is flyable without trim too. But its stick forces(IIRC of 5 kg only without trimbutton pressed or FD On) will make your arms muscles tired very soon.

 

 

@ Trase The key is to control the helicopter the whole time. You should never have a lag on that!! There will be no time you can left your hand from stick and collective, exept you have trimmed super ultra exact (and this for sure needs some practise).

 

Ise

Edited July 24, 2014 by Isegrim

[Trase]

Great flying technique! You sure you've only been doing this for two days? Because my Ka-50 flying looked a lot worse after just two days. :)

 

Well, I flew them in GTA games, if that counts :lol:

 

Since I recorded the track, I find it easier to just depress the trimmer before starting a maneuver, and letting go of it when I'm finished, so it doesn't fight my input during it. The pilot in real video only presses it after the maneuver, but he has a real stick, while I don't even have force feedback. I hope I'm not doing this really wrong, since it feels extremely good, and no more diagonal flying.

[Isegrim]

Well, I flew them in GTA games, if that counts :lol:

 

Since I recorded the track, I find it easier to just depress the trimmer before starting a maneuver, and letting go of it when I'm finished, so it doesn't fight my input during it. The pilot in real video only presses it after the maneuver, but he has a real stick, while I don't even have force feedback. I hope I'm not doing this really wrong, since it feels extremely good, and no more diagonal flying.

 

No its absolutely correct like that !!!!!!:thumbup:

[Flagrum]

I hope I'm not doing this really wrong, since it feels extremely good, and no more diagonal flying.

There are basically two "schools" of Ka-50 pilots here. Those who say, trim often and deliberately, especially during maneuvers ("eastern style"; click-trim) and those who prefer to hold the timmer during maneuvers and releasing it after the helo is stabilized in the new attitude ("western style"; hold-trim).

 

And then there are those who believe that the "eastern style" is in fact working differently - more like a mix of both styles: HOLD trim all the time but release it often and deliberately ... like a "negative click"-trim. Which could make quite some sense - you can maneuver freely but if you have to release the trim button, the AP will not try to get the helo in a totally different direction - as the last trimming only occured a few seconds ago (as opposed to an eternity since the begin of the maneuvre)

Afaik the last style only came up not too long ago - after a discussion about the video that was linked earlier in the thread. Some thought they heared not a press-release ..... press-release ... press-release but rather a press ..... release-press .... release-press ...

 

Anyhow, I prefer "western style", but just do what works for you best.

[Isegrim]

And those who trim as less as possible.

Especialy during Combat manouvers.

[tsumikae]

Thats simply wrong. Trim proplems are only a part of the proplems new pilots have with the KA-50.

 

No. I've been perfect since day one. Never had any proplems :D

[Yurgon]

There are basically two "schools" of Ka-50 pilots here. Those who say, trim often and deliberately, especially during maneuvers ("eastern style"; click-trim) and those who prefer to hold the timmer during maneuvers and releasing it after the helo is stabilized in the new attitude ("western style"; hold-trim).

 

This!

 

Interestingly enough, I use the western style for the Ka-50 and the eastern style for the UH-1H. :music_whistling:

 

I think if a pilot understands the trimmer, it's okay to use any style that just "feels" right, regardless of whether any real-life pilot would do it that way or not. :thumbup:

[ctguy1955]

Its been a long time sense I last played a Flight Sim. Now that I have a really great PC that has 2 video cards in SLI and a cpu that hits 5.0, Im ready to do something besides BF4 FPS.

 

I downloaded the free game, and the free p51 mustang, and now I cant do anything at all to

get out of the p51 and back to the normal game. My joystick is a logitech Extreme 3D and

Im not having much luck setting that up either.

 

Back in 1988, I bought every flight sim under the sun for my Amiga 500 !!!

 

 

Edited September 3, 2014 by ctguy1955

[Milli]

Not sure that i understand your problem. You want to exit the p-51 and return to the main menu? Try pressing the ESCAPE key, that will bring up the menu allowing you to go where you want.

 

Regards,

Milli

[ctguy1955]

Not sure that i understand your problem. You want to exit the p-51 and return to the main menu? Try pressing the ESCAPE key, that will bring up the menu allowing you to go where you want.

 

Regards,

Milli

 

I ended up uninstalling the p-51 and then was able to get into game.

I can fly the free russian jet and my joystick works fine, but I cant fly

the p-51. It ends up being like watching a video.

 

I know a man who flew them in Korea and I would love to get this

up and running on my three screens and have him come over and

give it a try. He is in his 80's but sharp as a whistle.

 

I just dont have the money right now to buy the p-51 39 dollar

program, but I will eventually if I have to in order to be able to

fly it and have Him come over.

 

Thank You for your help.

 

 

When I fly the sim in 5760 X 1080 with everything on high, its so Awesome !!!

 

 

 

((( This is BF4, not a flight sim )))

[ctguy1955]

SO I purchased the P51 on sale and then got rid of all the other mods. I can fly the plane

and most things work ok. Im such a newb that I cant land without breaking the prop.

 

I also cannot get many things to work, My joystick setup is not that great but sometimes

none of my keyboard keys do anything. Not even escape key. I end up going into task

manager and stopping the game and then re-starting it.

 

Its going to take some time for me to work my way though many problems, and even my

keyboard has started to mess up. The lights that illuminate the keys stopped working.

I will RMA the keyboard soon.

 

If I try to play the dogfighting scenario, I cant shoot any bullets. Oh well, time will tell.

[ctguy1955]

So I just setup the Saitek X36F and this time in the gunfight setup I was able to

fire my 50 cals. I cannot get any of my F1 - F10 keys to do anything.

 

I am wondering if there is a pre-setup that I can download for my stick setup ?

I cant get the Saitek software to see my setup, but win 8.1 does see it and Im

able to do use all of the buttons.

 

When I am in the combat scenario, I cant get any F1 keys to work and if I crash the plane

to end the sim, ESC or anything but a control alt delete can help me.

I am clueless as to what to do. I downloaded and just read the manual for my new plane,

but there was nothing about trouble shooting at all.

 

I know there is a game mode and sim mode, but I cant wrap my head around that either.

 

I was able to download some skins, but dont see where I can change them.

 

Other then the manual I downloaded for my P51, is there a WCS manual ?? I will look now.

 

Thanks for any help you can give me, I really appreciate it.

[ctguy1955]

DUMMY !!!

 

ALL my fault. I had erased all of the keyboard side and tried to get the

joystick working better. Now Ive uninstalled the main program and the

P-51D program and its still missing. I do not know how to get them back ????

 

At least now I know it was my fault !!!

[Flagrum]

ALL my fault. I had erased all of the keyboard side and tried to get the

joystick working better. Now Ive uninstalled the main program and the

P-51D program and its still missing. I do not know how to get them back ????

 

At least now I know it was my fault !!!

DCS stores all the settings you make under "Options" of the main menu in the folder C:\Users\<your_windows_username>\Saved Games\DCS

 

Your controller settings (which includes your settings for the keyboard) can be found in the sub-folder "Input".

 

You can now delete this folder C:\Users\<your_windows_username>\Saved Games\DCS\Input and the next time you start DCS, it will re-create it with new default settings. Then you should have all the keyboard functions back.

 

 

PS: you are posting here in the Ka-50 Blackshark subforum. For general problems you should better post in the appropriate subforum somewhere under ED Forums » English » Digital Combat Simulator » DCS World » Bugs and Problems

[arkroyale048]

Is this still the right thread ?

 

Few questions popped up during my flights.... (Last time I was on this thread, I was barely flying the Shark, now I'm older and wiser :)

 

 

 

Anyways.

 

Is the auto pilot hold (that 4th button) in any way affected by the trimmer ?

 

Say I have all four channels active; I hold the trimmer... Maneuver (and possibly change altitude)... release the trimmer. Does that mean that the autopilot now holds the latest altitude set after releasing the trimmer ? Or will it try to get back to the old altitude (as per limits of it's authority) ?

 

Second question: What is the relationship between the altitude hold channel and the flight director ?

 

 

 

My experience so far is that upon first switching on the altitude hold channel. It works just fine. But if I want to make a small correction/ maneuver by holding trim > maneuvering > releasing trim. It seems that the altitude hold doesn't really work as much. Work around is to switch off then on again the altitude hold channel.

[Flagrum]

Is this still the right thread ?

 

Few questions popped up during my flights.... (Last time I was on this thread, I was barely flying the Shark, now I'm older and wiser :)

 

 

 

Anyways.

 

Is the auto pilot hold (that 4th button) in any way affected by the trimmer ?

 

Say I have all four channels active; I hold the trimmer... Maneuver (and possibly change altitude)... release the trimmer. Does that mean that the autopilot now holds the latest altitude set after releasing the trimmer ? Or will it try to get back to the old altitude (as per limits of it's authority) ?

 

Second question: What is the relationship between the altitude hold channel and the flight director ?

 

 

 

My experience so far is that upon first switching on the altitude hold channel. It works just fine. But if I want to make a small correction/ maneuver by holding trim > maneuvering > releasing trim. It seems that the altitude hold doesn't really work as much. Work around is to switch off then on again the altitude hold channel.

Altitude Hold is not affected by the trim button but the collective brake. When you release the collective brake, the AP will (try to) maintain the current altitude.

 

The collective brake is the lever at the collective that you have to actuate in the real helo in order to actually be able move the collective up and down (so you don't have to apply forces by hand all the time). In DCS and with our gaming devices this behaviour is replicated by a separate function which you can map to a button. Then you would press that button whenever you move the collective (HOTAS throttle). Or alternatively - and a bit less authentic - you just press the button whenever you want to set the desired altitude - similar to an additional fictional "trim collective"-button.

 

When you fly in FD mode, the altitude hold is disabled like every other AP channel. Instead you get visual cues on the HUD that tell you if you are too high or too low (similar to the other channels as well). Check the manual for how that looks like in detail. :o)

Edited October 11, 2014 by Flagrum

[arkroyale048]

How about the relationship between the trimmer and flight director ?

 

While in flight director mode.. I still can seem to 'trim' the aircraft into a behaviour that I like. (i.e. transitioning to hover, trimmed for forward movement, etc.)

[Flagrum]

How about the relationship between the trimmer and flight director ?

 

While in flight director mode.. I still can seem to 'trim' the aircraft into a behaviour that I like. (i.e. transitioning to hover, trimmed for forward movement, etc.)

The trim button performs two separate functions: 1. trim the aircraft for the current attitude by setting a "new center" for the cyclic stick so that you don't have to apply forces if you don't want to change the attitude and 2. tell the AP to keep the current attitude

 

The first function is only physically "fixating" the the current settings of the control surfaces so that under unchanged physical conditions the attitude won't change. But in reality everything constantly changes - you get faster, you correct for a tiny amount of banking, etc. That is what the AP takes care of - the AP actively steers the helo and changes the control surfaces so that the attitude is always correctly kept.

 

When flying in FD mode, the part of the AP is disabled.

 

The difference in practice is then, if you trim the helo in FD mode, it will keep the attitude more or less. If you now would let the helo fly "hands free", you will eventually crash - after 5 ... 10 or 20 minutes.

 

If you do the same with AP on (FD mode off), the AP makes sure that the helo will fly ... until the fuel runs out.

[arkroyale048]

Another question:

 

Now, I know the Shark that we have in DCS isn't really configured for night ops. But anyways; at night does it really mean that the Shkval is a 'manual' aim kind of thing ?

 

Meaning I'd have to hover as stable as I can and point my Shkval at a target and hope it does not drift.

 

 

 

On a side note:

 

Does anyone have the link for that mod that turns back the Betty into Russian; while still using the english cockpit ? Been searching all night and I get erroneous results.

[Alkaline]

Wow! I've had the Ka-50 for 2 days now and I FKING LOVE IT!

Im gonna say something that has been said a dozen times, but it couldnt be more correct!

Once you learn the autopilot and the trimming, that bird is a fking war machine! :D

[Rogue Trooper]

Yes.. she is awesome.

[Steel Jaw]

that bird is a fking war machine! :D

 

...in daylight, sure. ;)

[Baasar]

I just got this Black Shark 2 mod a few days ago. I don't have a throttle stick or pedals yet but this is awesome. Just learning how to control it now.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxG3El6J42A

 

My low alt moving target practice in free flight. Cant wait till I get my Saitek x52 pro. I've just been trying to fly at fixed trim, meaning I trim it once at beginning of flight for hover and don't trim after that. Its fun flying 2-10 ft off the ground at 100+ and making a breaking 180 turn and taking out a target. With a 3 hat switches locking up target while hauling ass will be easy.

Edited December 12, 2014 by Baasar

[Flagrum]

I just got this Black Shark 2 mod a few days ago. I don't have a throttle stick or pedals yet but this is awesome. Just learning how to control it now.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfPUwccq1Bk

 

My low alt moving target practice in free flight. Cant wait till I get my Saitek x52 pro. I've just been trying to fly at fixed trim, meaning I trim it once at beginning of flight for hover and don't trim after that. Its fun flying 2-10 ft off the ground at 100+ and making a breaking 180 turn and taking out a target. With a 3 hat switches locking up target while hauling ass will be easy.

Quite impressive flying - especially just after 2 days!

 

You might want to try out using the gun in fixed mode - that would eliminate the need to lock your targets altogether. That would make your style of flying perhaps even more fun. :o)