Advice Required: Can I update this rig for a smooth VR experience?

[nachinus]

Hi all! I rented a Quest3 set some time ago just to test it and I quite enjoyed the sim experience even though I had to stick to simple missions and low visuals. I am now considering to update my PC sometime in the future and I would like to know if it's realistic to try to achieve a smooth VR experience with my rig with 'just' a GFX card update. 

MB: ASUS TF Gaming B450-Plus II

POWER: Aerocool 750W

Cool: Coolermaster 240L

Proc: AMD Ryzen y 5800X 3.8 GHz 32 MB L3

RAM: 64 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4

GFX: TUF RTX3060-012G

I can read minimum and recommended specs, but I reckon many of you guys have a lot of real ingame experience with VR in DCS by now so any input would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Edited September 21, 2024 by nachinus

[speed-of-heat]

Honestly it's a difficult question, compounded by the complexity of what is good for "me" is terrible for "you", further compounded by settings in DCS and VR and Windows and how that is configured and how and what you play ... your ram is "fine", i dont know how your are cooling your device but i would recommend a 7800x3d processor as well if you can ... as a rule of thumb if you had a monitor running at the total number of pixels per eye of your VR headset and you took measured your FPS... you would get between 1/2 - 1/3 of that frame rate in VR.. generally you will need either the refresh rate of your VR headset or half that number to be comfortable/smooth (albeit with some graphics artefacting )

[nachinus]

I just edited the first post: for cooling I have a Coolermaster 240L liquid cooler.

I'm not up-to-date with PC building knowledge, but Ryzen processors run quite hot. If I add a more powerful GFX card plus a faster processor I might have a cooling problem, right?.

[speed-of-heat]

7800x3d runs very cool by comparison a 240 AIO should be more than fine for that 

[CptBligh]

7800X3D would require DDR5 RAM and a new mobo.  I'd probably grab a RTX 5080 when they come out and then go from there.

[nachinus]

hace 15 horas, CptBligh dijo:

7800X3D would require DDR5 RAM and a new mobo.  I'd probably grab a RTX 5080 when they come out and then go from there.

Ufff, didn't know that. That would be almost a new PC.

It seems that my upgrade options are limited, your advice sounds wise.

[Ramstein]

On 9/21/2024 at 9:33 AM, CptBligh said:

7800X3D would require DDR5 RAM and a new mobo.  I'd probably grab a RTX 5080 when they come out and then go from there.

I can taste the new 5080 when it is ready for sale! I need it, my old 2080-ti sucks, and with VR it SUCKS 10x

[Hiob]

On 9/20/2024 at 5:59 PM, nachinus said:

Hi all! I rented a Quest3 set some time ago just to test it and I quite enjoyed the sim experience even though I had to stick to simple missions and low visuals. I am now considering to update my PC sometime in the future and I would like to know if it's realistic to try to achieve a smooth VR experience with my rig with 'just' a GFX card update. 

MB: ASUS TF Gaming B450-Plus II

POWER: Aerocool 750W

Cool: Coolermaster 240L

Proc: AMD Ryzen y 5800X 3.8 GHz 32 MB L3

RAM: 64 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4

GFX: TUF RTX3060-012G

I can read minimum and recommended specs, but I reckon many of you guys have a lot of real ingame experience with VR in DCS by now so any input would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

I would say, the most limiting factor here is still the 3060 GPU, followed by the 5800 non X3D.

Therefore I would (if saving up for a real platform upgrade isn't an option) first upgrade the GPU to a 3080/3090 or 4080 and then upgrade the CPU to a 5800X3D.

Both will give meaningful gains, depending on the exact situation your in.

Edit: Regardless of the GPU you eventually choose. Upgrading to a 5800X3D is dirt cheap, compared to throw out Mobo and Ram on top for a jump to 7XXX. And a 5800X3D can bring up a 4090 to speed.

Edit2: In VR you will hit a CPU bottleneck faster than in pancake, so normally I would probably start with an CPU upgrade. But your 5800 is at least okayish and your GPU is really a weak point.

Edited September 25, 2024 by Hiob

[nachinus]

Thank you Hiob! That was a very helpful post.

Is there really so much performance difference between 5800 and 5800x3d?

[Hiob]

2 hours ago, nachinus said:

Thank you Hiob! That was a very helpful post.

Is there really so much performance difference between 5800 and 5800x3d?

Apart from the 7000er X3Ds, it‘s the best gaming cpu you could get. The cache really works on games and VR particularly. Don’t take my word for it, just look in the interwebs for performance/benchmark tables.

It‘s not soo easy in your case, since you detailed that you want to upgrade with VR in mind. I would estimate the CPU frametime gaines you can achieve about 20 to 25% (based on my back to back testing with a 5900X and 5800x3d. However, that doesn’t help you much when you are GPU limited, which in most non-VR cases you will definitely be. Unfortunately your GPU is not the most powerful either, Actually I would place it even lower than the 5800x.

For VR - I‘d say either one needs an upgrade…….

Sorry if that isn’t really helpful.

All I can say is. Personally I would definitely go for the GPU upgrade first. I run the 5900x (yeah I choose that ultimately over the 5800X3D for different reasons) which for all practical DCS related purposes has the same performance as your 5800x. And I upgraded to a 4090 later. (1080ti -> 3080 -> 4090). Which was certainly the most meaningful performance upgrade for DCS. I‘m still GPU bound 99% of times but DCS looks gorgeous on highest settings. HOWEVER, and that’s the caveat - I don’t play VR (much).

last but not least, a GPU upgrade will definitely benefit you. At least everything will look nicer for the same fps (should you be CPU limited) And other than the CPU, you can carry the GPU over if you eventually make platform upgrade to AM5.

Edited September 25, 2024 by Hiob

[nachinus]

That's very helpful, thank you very much. 

[Nightdare]

Don't forget to check if your PSU can supply the GPU (Not just wattage, but also connections)

[nachinus]

hace 10 horas, Nightdare dijo:

Don't forget to check if your PSU can supply the GPU (Not just wattage, but also connections)

Mmmmh, I read that 750W should be enough... I don't know about connections though... what should I check?

[Nightdare]

8 minutes ago, nachinus said:

Mmmmh, I read that 750W should be enough... I don't know about connections though... what should I check?

How many PCIe power connectors does the card (or adapter cable) need

[Hiob]

1 hour ago, nachinus said:

Mmmmh, I read that 750W should be enough... I don't know about connections though... what should I check?

Have you decided on an upgrade path?

[nachinus]

hace 1 hora, Hiob dijo:

Have you decided on an upgrade path?

I think I'm going to explore the rtx 4080 path first, hoping the prices go down a bit as the 50s series are closer.

I reckon a cpu upgrade won't do much if I have a gpu bottleneck.

Edited September 28, 2024 by nachinus

[Hiob]

3 hours ago, nachinus said:

I think I'm going to explore the rtx 4080 path first, hoping the prices go down a bit as the 50s series are closer.

I reckon a cpu upgrade won't do much if I have a gpu bottleneck.

 

Correct. Only problem is, that can change multiple times in a session, depending on the scenery and mission. However it is save to say, that you will be GPU bottlenecked more frequently if you want some eye candy.

 But I think it is reasonable in most cases and in yours in particular to go GPU first.

[nachinus]

En 28/9/2024 a las 12:01, Nightdare dijo:

How many PCIe power connectors does the card (or adapter cable) need

Turns out checking this out was a really sound advice. The card has a 3 PCIe adapter cable and my PSU only has 2 such cables, none of them daisy chained.

From what I've read it's very common for PCIe cables to have a pigtail and that is good enough to make the 4080 work (1 single cable plus 1 + 1 pigtailed). Sadly my CoolBox DeepPower BR-800W isn't modular and comes with a fixed set of cables coming out of it. 

Being forced to change the whole otherwise perfectly valid PSU for just a cable issue drives me mad. Also it's a lot of work that I've never done before and it's holding me back.

Edited October 9, 2024 by nachinus