The T-50 (PAK-FA) Thread

[Pilotasso]

Btw why is it such a big deal if one goes M2.0 and the other goes M2.1 or vice versa? This ain't Formula 1 race. Unless there's a big speed difference it shouldn't matter that much. If high speed was such a huge factor for an air superiority aircraft, then we would have noticed 5th+ gen fighters resembling A-12 and Mig-31. Yet none of the current fighters and the near future concepts presented so far are designed to go that fast.

 

Agreed. And apparently so does VVS. Same thing with some uninformed fanboyz either believing that T-50 will carry more than 6 missiles internally or act like they hold teh thruthz that it *does* carry more than 6. (with no proof to back it)

 

Aircraft will be measured for their maximum cruise speed these days. If we calculate medium speed for each flight mission then supercruise speed will probably trump top speed attained by legacy aircraft using afterburners because this can only be attained for shorter periods of time.

[Namenlos Ein]

New prototype?

Yes, a non-flyable prototype for structural tests.

 

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZfSIvU7lvc

[Fri13]

I know that. They can still keep the 3D thrust vectoring and increase the stealth characteristics by putting three paddle nozzles like in X-31. Having 3D thrust vectoring vs 2D vectoring is also a questionable advantage. It might give you a slight edge in some situations but meh, the concept of stealth in the first place is to stay undetected and fire first avoiding dogfighting, so if a stealthier aircraft enables you to do that you'd probably be willing to sacrifice a bit of your maneuverability.

The idea of stealth is to launch first before the target gets to range launch its missile at you. On BVR you need to guide any missile to terminal phase and you are a visible anyways to everyone when over enemy airspace, you are just "slippery" against X-band radars (missiles and common 3-4th gen fighters).

 

Its no where near "they can't spot me, they don't even know we are here and they don't even see I launched a missile at them and I can be flying at home when missile hits to target".

 

It eventually comes to dogfighting or rapid maneuvering and every benefit is a benefit.

[lazduc]

Who cares. If a fighter can do Mach 1.5 or 2.0. My radar can see you from 70 miles or 100 with satellite info and my missiles can track and blow you outta the sky, what difference does speed make to the intercept point?

 

 

Close in dog fighting is past. You cannot see your opponent anyway for more than a few seconds and if you do you will probably be dead in short order. It will be shooting at dots on your hud. With modern technology dog fighting with older generation fighters is a death trap. Do you think a Mig 21 or a F4 would stand a chance against a generation 5 aircraft coming at each other from 100 miles apart? The new missile will get the older fighters before they would even know they were being tracked. Point being the older systems assure more close in fighting due to their inferior capabilities.

 

I really cannot imagine modern fighters getting within 20 miles of each other without both having let loose a salvo of missiles. 2400mph closing speed....ya cannot visually see your opponent. Especially if you are in the clouds.

Being the best fighter pilot(Top Gun) does not make a difference at 20 miles. The best radar, fastest missiles and the quickest trigger finger wins.

 

If you find yourself in a close-in dog fight in modern times....your equipment let you down. LOL. BVR fighting is boring. WW2 was the best. Imho.

[GGTharos]

Who cares. If a fighter can do Mach 1.5 or 2.0. My radar can see you from 70 miles or 100 with satellite info and my missiles can track and blow you outta the sky, what difference does speed make to the intercept point?

 

It makes a huge difference. The 'can intercept' vs 'cannot intercept' difference.

 

Close in dog fighting is past.

 

No, it isn't.

 

I really cannot imagine modern fighters getting within 20 miles of each other without both having let loose a salvo of missiles.

 

You have poor imagination then :)

 

Being the best fighter pilot(Top Gun) does not make a difference at 20 miles. The best radar, fastest missiles and the quickest trigger finger wins.

 

You also have poor knowledge of air to air combat. Yes, being the best fighter pilot makes a huge difference.

[NOLA]

New prototype?

T-50-7, static frame of "stage 2" T-50, note the composite cowlings. T-50-6-2 will be flying frame of "stage 2" T-50, due to fly in spring.

[BronzeBuddha]

According to Jo Asakura on Key Publishing forums, the starboard cowling isn't circular, which I'm not quite seeing.

[Pilotasso]

T-50-7, static frame of "stage 2" T-50, note the composite cowlings. T-50-6-2 will be flying frame of "stage 2" T-50, due to fly in spring.

 

Oh cool, I'll be watching. :)

[Namenlos Ein]

 

 

 

 

[bengo]

T-50 project in trouble.

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2015/0327/Grounded-Russia-s-answer-to-US-next-gen-fighter-hits-the-skids#.VRXxl55iBTA.twitter

[Pilotasso]

They will spread the acquisitions longer through the years, no word of hard factual fleet reductions. It seems the only sane reactions to a slowing economy, much like everyone else has done.

[pepin1234]

I think is a question of the real needs they have. The Su-35 and other variants are showing a big capability, so they don't need too much pack-fa at the moment.

 

This situation was warned time before the Pak-fa take the first flight

[Pilotasso]

Su-35 is an awesome upgrade form the soviet era Su-27S, but is not anything special compared to some of its counterparts to the left side of the globe. The emergence of the Su-50 makes sense if the AA capability is to be maintained in RuAF for the next few decades.

[pepin1234]

Su-35 is an awesome upgrade form the soviet era Su-27S, but is not anything special compared to some of its counterparts to the left side of the globe. The emergence of the Su-50 makes sense if the AA capability is to be maintained in RuAF for the next few decades.

 

With a high performance modern radar and some big improvements in avionic and the performance in general, is good enough to beat a 5 generation aircraft. Also the new missile generation are in the last stage of developed. All that is the Su-35, this aircraft can beat a 5° generation aircraft at the present and near future.

[Basher54321]

With a high performance modern radar and some big improvements in avionic and the performance in general, is good enough to beat a 5 generation aircraft. Also the new missile generation are in the last stage of developed. All that is the Su-35, this aircraft can beat a 5° generation aircraft at the present and near future.

 

Not looking too hopeful for the Su-35 it must be said.

[karambiatos]

I always saw the su-35 as more of an export for countries needing a advanced jet with long range, but not having enough money to develop their own or buy 5th gen.

[Pilotasso]

The Su-35 is not exactly cheap either. Only the older more basic models remain competitive in price.

[GGTharos]

The Su-35 is considered a gen 4.5 aircraft. Sure, a 4.5 'could' defeat a 5th gen aircraft. Just like a MiG-21 could take out a Su-27 ... it's just that you'd lose all your MiG-21 airforce to shoot down a handful of Su-27's.

 

With a high performance modern radar and some big improvements in avionic and the performance in general, is good enough to beat a 5 generation aircraft. Also the new missile generation are in the last stage of developed. All that is the Su-35, this aircraft can beat a 5° generation aircraft at the present and near future.

[pepin1234]

Sorry guys. I said you again. Only a new made high performance radar and of course the missiles for that is enough to kill and splash one two or three times a de actual 5t generation. This is the Su-35

[NOLA]

T-50 project in trouble.

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2015/0327/Grounded-Russia-s-answer-to-US-next-gen-fighter-hits-the-skids#.VRXxl55iBTA.twitter

 

Well, they certainly took a shitty article from a non trustworthy news outlet which got info from an "anonymous source", and ran with it. Sigh.

 

I always saw the su-35 as more of an export for countries needing a advanced jet with long range, but not having enough money to develop their own or buy 5th gen.

 

Well, Su-35S *was* an export oriented project to start with.

[Basher54321]

Sorry guys. I said you again. Only a new made high performance radar and of course the missiles for that is enough to kill and splash one two or three times a de actual 5t generation. This is the Su-35

 

 

An upgraded Su-27 / F-15 makes no difference really - hence PAK-FA / F-22 etc etc

[Pilotasso]

It always make some difference but not enough to avoid the renovation of the fleet by more modern hulls.

[pepin1234]

It always make some difference but not enough to avoid the renovation of the fleet by more modern hulls.

 

Is not avoid the renovation. they just don't need the amount planed at the beginning for the Pak-fa. The Su-35, Su-30SM, Mig-29K plus the reduced Pak-Fa units are enough at the moment.

[Weta43]

Well, they certainly took a shitty article from a non trustworthy news outlet which got info from an "anonymous source", and ran with it. Sigh.

 

Bad news about Russia makes good news in the West at the moment.

[wilky510]

Well, they certainly took a shitty article from a non trustworthy news outlet which got info from an "anonymous source", and ran with it. Sigh.

.

RT does the same thing about the F-35, yet Russians always use that information as 'testament' of the F-35 being crappy.

 

Just ignore those kind of articles :P