Sustained Turn Rate of Fighters

[Yo-Yo]

I should have been more clear... :)

Now the flaps are wrong and are to be fix for those planes where it is necessary as well as F-15 at low speed.

[*Rage*]

I should have been more clear... :)

Now the flaps are wrong and are to be fix for those planes where it is necessary as well as F-15 at low speed.

 

Thx!

 

Is it possible that we can get charts of aircraft performance as moddeled by ED (NOT the source material which im sure is ED property/classified/off the record pilot testemonial etc etc).

 

Community efforts to graph them despite good intentions will always have errors of measurement/consistency/uncontrolled variables/personal bias etc..

 

I just think a gold standard reference would be great for us dogfighters out there.

[Yo-Yo]

Thx!

 

Is it possible that we can get charts of aircraft performance as moddeled by ED (NOT the source material which im sure is ED property/classified/off the record pilot testemonial etc etc).

 

Community efforts to graph them despite good intentions will always have errors of measurement/consistency/uncontrolled variables/personal bias etc..

 

I just think a gold standard reference would be great for us dogfighters out there.

 

 

I plan to make the charts.

[*Rage*]

I plan to make the charts.

 

Awesome!

 

Looking forward to it.

[Yo-Yo]

Just testing F-15 and this is ROT graph.

TO means the points from the doc you have seen before, CALC means so called In Vitro tool and TEST means in game measurements using LUA-export.

 

9.15 kft has no test points because now I am sure that FM is the same.

 

The goal of tests is to achieve steady sustained turn for 10-12 s at several TAS and then ROT can be derived from averaged dHeading/dt.

 

This grap[h is for my current fixed F-15 :) be patient please. It will be yours soon.

Edited April 5, 2010 by Yo-Yo

[Sov13t]

Yo-Yo for president! :thumbup:

 

Superb.

[*Rage*]

Just testing F-15 and this is ROT graph.

TO means the points from the doc you have seen before, CALC means so called In Vitro tool and TEST means in game measurements using LUA-export.

 

9.15 kft has no test points because now I am sure that FM is the same.

 

The goal of tests is to achieve steady sustained turn for 10-12 s at several TAS and then ROT can be derived from averaged dHeading/dt.

 

This grap[h is for my current fixed F-15 :) be patient please. It will be yours soon.

 

Fantastic! Exactly as requested.

 

Now please...please same graphs for other flyables:pilotfly:

An overlay would be very interesting too.

[Yo-Yo]

Fantastic! Exactly as requested.

 

Now please...please same graphs for other flyables:pilotfly:

An overlay would be very interesting too.

 

 

What do you mean "overlay"?

[EtherealN]

I suspect several aircraft on the same graph - basically comparing the aircraft.

[Yo-Yo]

Me too but only to be sure.

 

Here they are... do not try to outturn it!

 

But please - do not start to cry: "They get blues down!!!" Remember that F-15 can outclimb any plane... except MiG-29...

Edited April 5, 2010 by Yo-Yo

[RvEFuSiOn]

Are these sustained turn rates or instantaneous turn rates in your last graph YoYo?

 

edit: nm they look like sustained turn rates,

 

Ps. If possible could you also please give us the instantaneous turn rate values please and the G values if not too much trouble on both graphs.

 

 

Thx!

Edited April 5, 2010 by =RvE=FuSiOn

[A.S]

Hi Yo-Yo

 

Good stuff, just one question.

 

In Faclon i used applications ( may it be doghouse or f4chart ) to extract the the data directly from the FM source file to convert it directly to EM-charts.

(basically the definition of the performances just plotted out without flight replication errors)

 

 

http://www.as-private.com/FlightDocs/F-16C-52-Performance-Charts.rar

 

here as reference another one, made by Mav-jp and Raptor one:

http://www.f-16.net/downloads_file5.html

 

 

Would that same procedure be possible in 2.0 ( i havent digged into it yet, just asking somewhat hasty)

If that is possible, im willing to help making a detailed book, with different configurations, altitudes, includung G-loads and radius lines etc etc and of course in Mach.

Edited April 6, 2010 by A.S

[3Sqn_Dubb]

@ A.S. Apology accepted... pffft, whatever man...

 

Just to make it clear to everyone on these forums, this example has clearly shown that A.S. is not the authority he claims to be on these matters. Don't take any statements as a given until you've checked things out yourself. As for his attitude, I think Tom Ace said it all...

 

@ Yo-Yo, don't apologise, ofcourse there's always some ironing out of slight errors with every new simulation, in fact I think I speak for all of 3Sqn when I say a wholehearted thankyou for fixing this issue in the up-coming patch. In fact it's actions like these which the community very much appreciates and will be the reason why we keep coming back!

 

Most of us will always prefer the Developer to provide patching and fixes which we can trust, as opposed to 3rd party software which always raises a host of questions, and in most cases, rightly so.

 

Thankyou for responding to the communities concerns,

 

3Sqn_Dubb

[A.S]

@ A.S. Apology accepted... pffft, whatever man...

 

Just to make it clear to everyone on these forums, this example has clearly shown that A.S. is not the authority he claims to be on these matters. Don't take any statements as a given until you've checked things out yourself. As for his attitude, I think Tom Ace said it all...

 

? :huh:

 

beside the warnings you will probably get from the admins here for those wrong claims, propoganda-nonsense and never ending "3Sqn-crybaby vs A.S agenda",

i also wanna add a final one here.

 

OK ! :devil_2: ...bring it on ;)

Edited April 6, 2010 by A.S

[Yo-Yo]

Hi Yo-Yo

 

Good stuff, just one question.

 

In Faclon i used applications ( may it be doghouse or f4chart ) to extract the the data directly from the FM source file to convert it directly to EM-charts.

(basically the definition of the performances just plotted out without flight replication errors)

 

 

http://www.as-private.com/FlightDocs/F-16C-52-Performance-Charts.rar

 

here as reference another one, made by Mav-jp and Raptor one:

http://www.f-16.net/downloads_file5.html

 

 

Would that same procedure be possible in 2.0 ( i havent digged into it yet, just asking somewhat hasty)

If that is possible, im willing to help making a detailed book, with different configurations, altitudes, includung G-loads and radius lines etc etc and of course in Mach.

 

 

Yes, I surely have the instrument like this... but it is not for endpoint users. I mean that it is in the form that is suitable only for me to use... a workbench. Very convenient to solve not standard tasks.

[Yo-Yo]

Are these sustained turn rates or instantaneous turn rates in your last graph YoYo?

 

edit: nm they look like sustained turn rates,

 

Ps. If possible could you also please give us the instantaneous turn rate values please and the G values if not too much trouble on both graphs.

 

 

Thx!

 

 

I'll try if I have spare time.

[EtherealN]

Guys, eyes on the ball, not discussions about who has what attitude. That's not productive and only serves to derail the thread. Keep rule #1.6 in mind, please.

[Yo-Yo]

More info to discuss. Planes from the patch of course.

 

Please do not forget to take GW in account... F-15 has more fuel than it need.

[A.S]

 

What we just found out in a quick (not full accurate, but good enough) test with ACS failure enabled. ...i thought you might just have a few thoughts on that...

[Yo-Yo]

Thank you, :) but we are testing different builds. Be patient please.

[A.S]

I have full Thrust ...ups Trust in you :D :smilewink: ....

[RvEFuSiOn]

YoYo i did some testing, With ACS failure on, the aircraft all feel much more realistic, try it and see what i mean.

If ACS limiter is taken off, all that someone would have to do is adjust their curve settings on the pitch axis other than that, all AC fly great.

When you pull hard with the ACS Failure on, you can feel the immense drag on the jet, which is excellent otherwise you don't feel this...

IMO this should be removed in all jets, that would fix a lot of issues too that we feel with excessive thrust and all that...

[Yo-Yo]

YoYo i did some testing, With ACS failure on, the aircraft all feel much more realistic, try it and see what i mean.

If ACS limiter is taken off, all that someone would have to do is adjust their curve settings on the pitch axis other than that, all AC fly great.

When you pull hard with the ACS Failure on, you can feel the immense drag on the jet, which is excellent otherwise you don't feel this...

IMO this should be removed in all jets, that would fix a lot of issues too that we feel with excessive thrust and all that...

 

 

That's good... but you have to switch GLOC failure on.. to bear the Gs w/o risk to get GLOC.

For example F-15 now can hit more than 9g of instantenious turn but I think it won't help you... :)

[RvEFuSiOn]

Yeah, well before you GLOC you can pull 13-14G's for a split second on an instantaneous turn, it all comes down to pilot skill when you have the ACS limiter off.... Which is how its supposed to be.... F15 IIRC doesn't have a limiter.Currently with it on it feels like a simplified flight model which doesn't require much skill to dogfight in. You don't have to turn off any GLOC failure....

 

Any chance this will be done in the next patch?

Edited April 6, 2010 by =RvE=FuSiOn

[A.S]

I know this expression is going to provoke scientific minds, but me FEELs, that something is not fully ok with the limitter, trying them on and off and replicating same situations while watching the stick discipline it requires in both cases and the AoA and G relations. Sorry i cant tell more right now, its just my feeling, as it was with to much thrust in certain regimes from the very beginning.

Edited April 6, 2010 by A.S