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Hope for another FC2 compatibility patch


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Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo

:worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy:

 

If DCS modules were fast released then no problem but it'll take long time to get at least 2 fighters ^^

 

Well time will tell, the most important is DCS evolves with or without compatibility but evolves :)


Edited by Boberro

Reminder: Fighter pilots make movies. Bomber pilots make... HISTORY! :D | Also to be remembered: FRENCH TANKS HAVE ONE GEAR FORWARD AND FIVE BACKWARD :D

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--- Is there anyone who would force someone to play Charlie in LO? No. It would have been played only by those who want that. So.... ;)

 

See - we agree: FC2 and DCS: Hog can co-exist peacefully ;)

 

It's like Coffee and Tea: First thing in the morning I'm as Cranky as a Constipated Bear and the only thing that helps is Coffee (2 spoons with a whiff of cream). Later in the day a cup of Earl Grey tea or two is welcomed. What I do not do is mix the two in one cup, stir and consume. Absolutely no reason why a person cannot fly both SIM's - just not at the same time.

 

One thing is however certain: Absence of FC2-compatibility will not fracture the Community: The Community will continue to grow with extra modules. There will always be persons who fly FC2 exclusively, those who fly both FC2 and DCS (myself included in this category) and those who fly DCS exclusively.

 

Vitally important to remember that we are still all part of the same Community - it's just now a wee bit more compartmentalised is all. How we attend to refine said compartmentalisation is important insofar as the allocation of time and resources is concerned, hence my opinion that FC2-compatibility would be counter-productive :)

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I hear ya, man. If it were possible for ED to even seriously complicate the FC2 planes to even half the DCS standard- this would not be an easy statement for me to make.

 

Community rules- true. But when I think over my thousands of hours of FC2 online-- there was no escaping some mildly irritating realities:

 

Apparent fear of contracting an Venereal Disease for joining a server's TS channel.. This resulted in tons of other problems.. Like people refusing to cooperate- i.e. fighters cover bombers, and all that. This avalanched into "airquake" complaints... Lonewolf flying purely for stats to the point that he's deliberately hosing the efforts of the "team"

 

Constant exploitation of poor modeling. (Not people hacking up files in notepad- Just taking advantage of deficiencies.) The shoot-n-run. No lock- nothing. Shoot a slammer at the TEWS symbol... Overbearing solutions to poor modeling- like the 15 second delay in jamming... wtf..

 

They just don't mix with DCS.. I would not have referred to LOMAC as arcade- until DCS came out. It's certainly no arcade game compared to many offferings. But it is compared to DCS..


Edited by S77th-konkussion
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No cooperation, no bombers' cover ect. ... do you think it can change in DCS ? I don't think so... I noticed browsing servers in Ka-50 there is no coop too. Long time ago in some threads we have mentioned reasons like no VoIP.... it would be good to have multifunctional and interactive map of war and so on. That IMHO would help.

 

@Viper - copy now ;)


Edited by Boberro

Reminder: Fighter pilots make movies. Bomber pilots make... HISTORY! :D | Also to be remembered: FRENCH TANKS HAVE ONE GEAR FORWARD AND FIVE BACKWARD :D

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Time will tell. I do see more inclination to join the TS channels, though. Which dovetails into a slightly different issue:

 

I believe more people are on a TS channel- their own squad's channel. This only makes sense- I know I do it too. But maybe we should all consider adopting a guideline to always endeavor to use the server's TS channel.. like when it's just you or 2 of you out looking to fly somewhere- not doing a squadron event so to speak..

 

I know I'm guilty of flying on one server- and sitting on my own TS. I didn't want to miss one of my guys showing up.

 

This would count as a good reason to enhance the current master server interface to at least display "who is where".

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Absolutely everything takes longer because it has to be done properly: There's no majik 'One-button lock and fire' process et al. At the end of the day it all adds up and with the Virtual Pilot workload in the A10C not being recriprocated by the other Airframes there's bound to be a Conflict.....Bottom-Line: A10C stands to lose.

 

Precisely. Case closed.

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Bullshit until you develop DCS ecosystem. I happily play with just a MS sidewinder joystick, and other with a Hotas Warthhog, pedals, trackir and 3 screens at 100fps. They have a HUGE advantadge and nobody moans about it because the important thing is we fly together seriously and everybody tries to stay within high realism parameters regardless of the simulator (except quakers in public servers, but those servers are a minority). Also, Ka-50 and FC2 is being played succesfully, before compatibility patch the ka-50 online community was on the brink of stalling if you remember. Yes, FC2 saved DCS:Ka-50 online community.

 

"it's the community, stupid" and you're gonna break it if you don't have more DCS modules before putting FC2 to bed.


Edited by Distiler

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"it's the community, stupid" and you're gonna break it if you don't have more DCS modules before putting FC2 to bed.

 

It's narrow-minded individuals and not modules/compatibility of said modules that will attempt to cause a rift, if any, within the Community. As stated before, there exists no reason why FC2 cannot continue to function as it has been: Nothing is changing or being taken away.....FC2 is not being put to bed.

 

I am struggling to comprehend the apparent lack of understanding: It's like Apples and Oranges.....I like both and eat both, just not at the same time. Others people like either/or: At the end of the day we all like Fruit and will continue to eat fruit, be it Apples or Oranges.

 

Time will Tell :)

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It's narrow-minded individuals
you mean those that don't see the community value in such a move...

 

Time will Tell :)
I think the same

 

 

 

 

ED is rethinking too, it seems. Might not be a so clear situation and have some value.


Edited by Distiler

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Join TS, and get some escort from FC2 fighters :) doesn't sound more interesting than killing AI targets?

 

If only that were the reality- when presented an environment to co-operate within the FC2 world- what usually happens?

 

Thank you.

 

At least in DCS there's a lot more investment of effort & time involved- thus the incentive to communicate, and fly towards the mission goals is greatly enhanced.

 

As the DCS modules come in- this should only get better & better. This very next module- the fighter- adddresses the exact concerns- the splintering of the community. It's not years away either.

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It occurs to me that all this discussion of the merits and drawbacks of integration may be putting the cart before the horse. What about a dedicated server for MP?

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The very next module is not confirmed to be a fighter? If it is where is it confirmed curious to know? And why is it not years away? The basic engine for A-10C was already there from Black Shark in 2008. However there is almost 3 years between the two releases. Yes FC2 was delivered in that period too but still we're not talking 12 months for DCS 3.

 

Developing a DCS module is not a trivial thing. By the time we get the next module it IS going to be 2013/2014 or maybe even 2015. Sure DCS has better avionics and FM, but if you're flying an A-10C and red has KA-50 and Su-25t (which are NEEDED to work together because of the ka-50 lack of long range SEAD + heavy strike capability), you are not needing to know whether the Su-25 pilot is pushing more buttons than you or not. Unless you think he has it EASY?

 

Once we master the A-10C it will be just as, even more effective than the Su-25t as it is a better aircraft. The ROLE of the aircraft and the TACTICS are still the same no matter how much of the avionics are modeled.

 

Air Quake fear? Then don't add fighters to your servers. Don't take a mission editors or a servers decision and put it in the hands of yourself because you think you know better.

 

Split communities are the worst situation, we'll have sims like cliffs of dover or rise of flight where the communities are still whole and they will be having much more large online events. Yes if you are hardcore DCS you will play only DCS but many of us will be pulled away into other sims if the multiplayer for DCS consists of "take off with others A-10s, shoot AI helicopters, blow up AI tanks, receive no fighter threat and no fighter cover, enemy side has no Su-25t or bomber jets etc".

Purely due to the key element that is the multiplayer... That's what keeps a sim alive for us in the long run.

 

It might be an acceptable compromise if say we had the two Su-25 brought into the DCS series, then both sides would have more even strike capability for some competitive play. Even if no fighters, at least we could make some fun missions that feel like human competition in the ground war.

 

A while ago I suggested not enabling the A-10a in combined servers with the A-10c. Would you believe that I was shouted down for that! I don't even believe it now after seeing so many not wanting FC2 combined... seems ideas have changed now A-10c is finally here people aren't FC2 lovers anymore and ready to dump it because they flew the A-10 and not the Su-25 hey?

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I think it is unjustified to maintain the argument that "simplicity of an aircraft breeds simple combat." Red Flags, ATC weekends, and ACM training within my own squad are evidence of the complexities, nuances, and strategy that are not mutually exclusive to DCS or FC2.

 

And guess what, until the interface and organization of multiplayer changes, it will still be 'airquake'. Just because there is an added time penalty to being shot down and starting up the aircraft does not change anything. At its core it will still be airquake, if anything 'slightly slower' airquake. I think as long as MP is limited to "pick a coalition, pick an aircraft, hit fly" gameplay, nothing will change. Sure private games will have an elevated level of coordination and teamwork, but haven't they always?

 

All I know is if the GUI and organization of MP doesn't change between now and DCS: Fighter I'm going to savor the moment when I see a thread complaining about the airquake in DCS. because as long as its basically team deathmatch that is what it will remain.

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The very next module is not confirmed to be a fighter? If it is where is it confirmed curious to know? And why is it not years away? The basic engine for A-10C was already there from Black Shark in 2008. However there is almost 3 years between the two releases. Yes FC2 was delivered in that period too but still we're not talking 12 months for DCS 3.

 

Developing a DCS module is not a trivial thing. By the time we get the next module it IS going to be 2013/2014 or maybe even 2015. Sure DCS has better avionics and FM, but if you're flying an A-10C and red has KA-50 and Su-25t (which are NEEDED to work together because of the ka-50 lack of long range SEAD + heavy strike capability), you are not needing to know whether the Su-25 pilot is pushing more buttons than you or not. Unless you think he has it EASY?

 

Once we master the A-10C it will be just as, even more effective than the Su-25t as it is a better aircraft. The ROLE of the aircraft and the TACTICS are still the same no matter how much of the avionics are modeled.

 

Air Quake fear? Then don't add fighters to your servers. Don't take a mission editors or a servers decision and put it in the hands of yourself because you think you know better.

 

Split communities are the worst situation, we'll have sims like cliffs of dover or rise of flight where the communities are still whole and they will be having much more large online events. Yes if you are hardcore DCS you will play only DCS but many of us will be pulled away into other sims if the multiplayer for DCS consists of "take off with others A-10s, shoot AI helicopters, blow up AI tanks, receive no fighter threat and no fighter cover, enemy side has no Su-25t or bomber jets etc".

Purely due to the key element that is the multiplayer... That's what keeps a sim alive for us in the long run.

 

It might be an acceptable compromise if say we had the two Su-25 brought into the DCS series, then both sides would have more even strike capability for some competitive play. Even if no fighters, at least we could make some fun missions that feel like human competition in the ground war.

 

A while ago I suggested not enabling the A-10a in combined servers with the A-10c. Would you believe that I was shouted down for that! I don't even believe it now after seeing so many not wanting FC2 combined... seems ideas have changed now A-10c is finally here people aren't FC2 lovers anymore and ready to dump it because they flew the A-10 and not the Su-25 hey?

 

Yup partially it would be great to transform Su-25A\T to DCS, but IMHO the best would be compatibility between DCS and FC. BS was merged to FC by one of reasons you fight against AI only. In A-10C will be exactly same. Giving compatibility to FC you raise your immersion - not only taking off alone or with next two Hogs, killing 10 tanks with two hogs and returning to base with two hogs. Repeat that to the death till next DCS fighter comes. Those who scare *they have more buttons to click than others* wouldn't be forced to play on that server - would they? Can play on DCS only.


Edited by Boberro
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Reminder: Fighter pilots make movies. Bomber pilots make... HISTORY! :D | Also to be remembered: FRENCH TANKS HAVE ONE GEAR FORWARD AND FIVE BACKWARD :D

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I think it is unjustified to maintain the argument that "simplicity of an aircraft breeds simple combat." Red Flags, ATC weekends, and ACM training within my own squad are evidence of the complexities, nuances, and strategy that are not mutually exclusive to DCS or FC2.

 

And guess what, until the interface and organization of multiplayer changes, it will still be 'airquake'. Just because there is an added time penalty to being shot down and starting up the aircraft does not change anything. At its core it will still be airquake, if anything 'slightly slower' airquake. I think as long as MP is limited to "pick a coalition, pick an aircraft, hit fly" gameplay, nothing will change. Sure private games will have an elevated level of coordination and teamwork, but haven't they always?

 

All I know is if the GUI and organization of MP doesn't change between now and DCS: Fighter I'm going to savor the moment when I see a thread complaining about the airquake in DCS. because as long as its basically team deathmatch that is what it will remain.

Spot on.

Ofcourse DCS fastjet will result in airquake, im sure A-10 will pan out in a similair fashion to Ka50 only on a larger scale which will only make it more apparent, 30 A-10's buzzing around a server, only a few actually communicating, shooting static targets, yep thats hardcore. Don't tell me just because someone has more buttons to press he suddenly becomes immune to airquake, you will always get those that want to go Rambo, that comes with the territory of having easy online access to servers.

 

Servers as always will for a big part will be uncoordinated messes of take off kill some s###/or die, go home/respawn and do it again.

The only workaround on this is to have servers with dedicated players only, that happens already.

 

The FC2 community for a large part is the DCS community (except those that don't own/want the other sim). Splitting what is already a very limited resource of dedicated teamplayers can only be a bad thing.

The only downside that is with a merge is the time constraint and if that is ED's main worry then it shouldn't happen.

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All I know is if the GUI and organization of MP doesn't change between now and DCS: Fighter I'm going to savor the moment when I see a thread complaining about the airquake in DCS. because as long as its basically team deathmatch that is what it will remain.

 

 

Then I tell ya what: thank Gawd for online squads and our dedicated CLOSED servers.

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Then I tell ya what: thank Gawd for online squads and our dedicated CLOSED servers.

 

Something about mouths and servers comes to mind. . .:P

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