Attack Profile Manuals?

[tankaviator]

Are there any manuals specific to the A-10 employing A-G weapons (i.e. different attack profiles, pitch angles, altitude, airspeeds, etc)? I have found some user-made items for employing A-G in Falcon4, as well as an overall general discussion by an ex-Phantom driver, but nothing that takes into account the special needs of a Warthog.

 

For example I found an instructional manual for a T-45C, but the airspeeds (and I am guessing all cues) are not appropriate for an A-10. For a 30 degree dive the release airspeed is 450kts. The A-10s Vne is 450kts at sea level, so that doesn't work, and I expect lowering the airspeed will affect everything else.

 

I apologize up front if this is an oft-requested topic. I looked through the manuals but didn't see the "Look here dumb-a$$" comment I was hoping for.

 

Thanks

[ttaylor0024]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the A-10s Computer systems will automatically adjust release times for your weapons. You shouldn't need to worry about any of that.

[Rainmaker]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the A-10s Computer systems will automatically adjust release times for your weapons. You shouldn't need to worry about any of that.

 

 

I think he means something a little different....

 

Real weapons emplyment is still flown under a profile. I think that is what he's really meaning. Most folks just concentrate putting the pipper on the DMPI and getting the bomb on target. With the real life stuff, pilots spend a lot of time concetrating on being inside of certain perameters when emplying weapons. Certain profiles have different airspeeds, dive angles, etc etc. This goes with any airframe, be it an A-10, F-16, F-15. Such things as high angle stafes vs. low angle are practiced over and over to develope a routine. We, being armchair pilots and like watching things go boom, do not stress nor focus on this kind of stuff as much.

[ttaylor0024]

I think he means something a little different....

 

Real weapons emplyment is still flown under a profile. I think that is what he's really meaning. Most folks just concentrate putting the pipper on the DMPI and getting the bomb on target. With the real life stuff, pilots spend a lot of time concetrating on being inside of certain perameters when emplying weapons. Certain profiles have different airspeeds, dive angles, etc etc. This goes with any airframe, be it an A-10, F-16, F-15. Such things as high angle stafes vs. low angle are practiced over and over to develope a routine. We, being armchair pilots and like watching things go boom, do not stress nor focus on this kind of stuff as much.

 

Oh, I gotcha. I remember reading somewhere about 210 IAS... I think it may be the optimal release for Mk. 82s, and 84s at level flight? (Their LGB and GPU variants also) I am not sure about the Mk. 82 AIRs though...

[Merc]

There you go. It's a table from SimHQ's article on CCIP bombing. As unreadable as it may be, that's pretty much one of the only tables of this kind (on the net) I'm aware of.

 

Example on how to read this :

 

second data row Mk-82Low Drag : Nose Tail fuse, 3 bombs in Ripple single spaced 190milliseconds apart, in a 15 degree dive. [if you have to, depress the ironsight 218 mils - manual aiming] You'll release at 1600ft & 325 kias. Minimum alt to avoid bombing yourself is 1350ft. Pattern is N/A... expect 3 holes. The rest is Rollout and Base information on how to fly different parts of the attack. HW/TW-Mils/KT is a wind correction unit per knot of headwind / Tailwind. The one before is very hard to read so I'm not quite sure. Last 3 columns is information on how to perform a popup attack with this setup.

 

As far as you are concerned, the 15 degree dive, airspeed and altitude is the actual release parameter for this setup.

 

One last note : For Mk-20s, the density is misleading, it's given in sqft / Bomblet. For short the lower the number, the more dense (more bomblet per area) and the more effective it is. However the pattern will be tighter if the density is high so it's a tradeoff you should keep in mind to achieve the desired effect.

 

Hope that was useful, Enjoy !

Should you have any table for other bomb types, please share !

 

Edited March 30, 2011 by Merc

[Rainmaker]

Oh, I gotcha. I remember reading somewhere about 210 IAS... I think it may be the optimal release for Mk. 82s, and 84s at level flight? (Their LGB and GPU variants also) I am not sure about the Mk. 82 AIRs though...

 

 

Yes...

 

Something like that is I think what he is looking for

 

 

 

@Tankaviator

 

You may be able to pull a little info out of these docs, specifially the AFI's more than the -1. I would say more so the minimums or restrictions though as opposed to a specific profile. Most of that stuff is located in the weapons and tactics manuals that aren't for public consumption.

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1015425&postcount=3

[ttaylor0024]

Yes...

 

Something like that is I think what he is looking for

 

 

 

@Tankaviator

 

You may be able to pull a little info out of these docs, specifially the AFI's more than the -1. I would say more so the minimums or restrictions though as opposed to a specific profile. Most of that stuff is located in the weapons and tactics manuals that aren't for public consumption.

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1015425&postcount=3

 

Ahh... That puts my PDF database up to 15 different documents now... lol I have a LOT to read through... :pilotfly:

[ESzczesniak]

Oh, I gotcha. I remember reading somewhere about 210 IAS... I think it may be the optimal release for Mk. 82s, and 84s at level flight? (Their LGB and GPU variants also) I am not sure about the Mk. 82 AIRs though...

 

I believe 210 kts has actually been thrown around as a minimum attack speed actually, not ideal speed. Below this the A-10's cornering performance drops off dramatically, you have a low energy reserve for evasive maneuvering and you are a particularly slow target.

[tankaviator]

Thank you everyone for your responses. I am an old U.S. Army M-1 Abrams tanker and yes every combat vehicle has tight tolerances for how, when, and why we fire a round. Its these SOPs I am curious about. For example:

 

1) When attacking an armored target using the gun you want a high angle to reduce the dispersion and increase the kinetic energy released on impact. What is considered a "high angle"? 30 degrees, 45 degrees? And what about minimum altitude and release airspeed?

2) When attacking a soft target or infantry using the gun a lower attack angle can be used. The dispersion of the rounds is a bonus here as it is harder to target the smaller individuals, and soft targets don't need the extra energy.

 

To relate this to what we are doing, in the first mission of Devils Cross the cloud ceiling is very low, we get a 9-line to go destroy some tanks that are surrounded by a bunch of AAA and MANPADS. What is the best way to attack them? Fly too high and you are eiher right in the envelope for anti-air or flying blind (in and above the clouds). Fly too low and you have to get close to deliver anything other than a Maverick, which puts you in the envelope for damn near everything (I swear I saw a simulated tank commander flip me off as I flew over, on fire and out of control :doh:). What is the best way to approach this situation? Pop up attack? Set SPI from a distance, climb above the clouds to a medium altitude and and use CCRP to drop bombs? What is it?

 

Its these questions I would like to be able to answer, and I am sure there are official SOPs for any situation. The biggest goal would be to recognize a bad situation, know the SOPs cold, and figure out a way to turn a bad situation into a good one. That does take thorough knowledge of SOPs, capabilities, and lots and lots of practice (which we are all able to get, W00T DCS).

 

If anyone wants to know what goes on inside of a tank I can tell you that. I have been on the wrong end of both F-16s and A-10s (in training of course) and I can tell you what we mostly say at these times is "Oh crap, we are dead".

 

I did see the depression tables but that isn't exactly what I was looking for. That gives the depression angle in mils for different ordinance, and it is great when needed, but I am hoping for a much larger picture here. I do have an associate who flew A-10s and another that flew F-14s and F-18s that I can talk to. I was hoping not to have to however as its a lot of info to explain and they are busy guys.

 

Again thank you very much for all of your comments. If I find anything I will post it as well as it seems that there are some others interested as well.

[GGTharos]

1) When attacking an armored target using the gun you want a high angle to reduce the dispersion and increase the kinetic energy released on impact. What is considered a "high angle"? 30 degrees, 45 degrees? And what about minimum altitude and release airspeed?

 

That depends on air defenses, but a 10 deg dive isn't bad. 30 deg dives are pretty good for avoiding spotlighting.

 

For any vehicles other than tanks, aim and fire a 1 sec burst at 1nm and then break off.

 

Against tanks, aim and fire at 0.5nm from the tank's rear, then break off.

 

2) When attacking a soft target or infantry using the gun a lower attack angle can be used. The dispersion of the rounds is a bonus here as it is harder to target the smaller individuals, and soft targets don't need the extra energy.

 

Actually no, because due to spotlighting you might attack a ranger area than you really want to. You also want to attack using HE rounds prefferably if that's your main concern, rather than loading CM which is mostly applicable to harder targets.

 

You can also attack infantry from 5nm out with the gun if you know exactly where they are, as long as you use HE.

 

To relate this to what we are doing, in the first mission of Devils Cross the cloud ceiling is very low, we get a 9-line to go destroy some tanks that are surrounded by a bunch of AAA and MANPADS. What is the best way to attack them?

 

With anything that you can drop from 15000' or higher. Mavericks, or any type of GBU or CCRP'ed CBU. If desperate, CCRP'ed iron bombs, and LOTS of them.

 

 

Fly too high and you are eiher right in the envelope for anti-air or flying blind (in and above the clouds). Fly too low and you have to get close to deliver anything other than a Maverick, which puts you in the envelope for damn near everything (I swear I saw a simulated tank commander flip me off as I flew over, on fire and out of control :doh:).

 

You need to know what altitudes you'll be flying before your mission if possible. If there are long or medium altitude SAMs, they'll push you into SHORAD. Not much you can do other than plan your approaches very carefully. Flying high gives you more reaction time, takes you out of the range of AAA, but more SHORAD can target you. Does the opponent HAVE 'more'?

 

What is the best way to approach this situation? Pop up attack? Set SPI from a distance, climb above the clouds to a medium altitude and and use CCRP to drop bombs? What is it?

 

 

All are valid. PLan according to your mission and desire to survive ;)

 

As for actual SOP's - I've seen bombing techniques, but NEVER SOP's quite as detailed as you want them. That would be revealing classified knowledge of the opposition's capabilities.