Need a little translation with jtac terms

[robert123456]

So after a lot of trying i finally finished the first of the instant action missions in full sim mode!.

 

On the last target (waypoint 6: column) you are asked to attack a group of tanks going through the road and you may contact the jtac playboy on x radio frequence.

 

So i contact him and automatically send a message which says my bearing info and the current payload of me and my wingman. He then says something about the 9 line (i think he called it) and gave a set of info:

 

1,2,3 N/A

4 2600 feet msc

5 tank column road heading southwest

6 coordinates mm333623

7 marked by wp

8 friendlies south 3000 meters troops

9 egress east

 

This is what i remember now so there might be one or two words missing somewhere but i think its pretty close to what he said.

 

So my first question is what all these means in terms of information to engage the target, specifically i dont know what means numbers 4 and 6. What am i suppoused to do with the coordinates of 6, i imagine is the tanks location but how do i use it? Also what does it mean that 1,2,3 are N/A not available?

 

I ended up completing this last part of the mission with a combination of patience, common sense and some swearing too but of course would like to understand and learn whats all that about.

 

Thanks for any info.

[Kaiza]

Check out page 646 of the manual. It decodes the 9 line for you. In short a "9 line" is a standard operating procedure for passing a target for close air support from a ground or air unit to a supporting aircraft.

 

4 is the altitude and 6 is the position of the target. You can enter those coordinates into the CDU and create a waypoint on your target.

 

When the JTAC says 1,2,3 N/A, it means that they are not applicable as a "Type 3" attack is being used.

 

You can find more out about type 1, 2 and 3 in the manual and also here:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=72701&highlight=close+air+support+%289-line%29

 

If a JTAC is SADL equipped he will send the data via datalink. This will appear as a red triangle. You can hook this position in your TAD and attack it rather than entering the position manually.

 

Check out this guide for additional reading:

 

http://www.google.co.nz/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&ved=0CB4QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.eagle.ru%2Fattachment.php%3Fattachmentid%3D43043%26d%3D1286623016&ei=TMOMUPn5E82iige26oHgAQ&usg=AFQjCNFKTHTxnKke7VZ4G9wcf0gXLHB7aw

Edited October 28, 2012 by Kaiza

[ApoNOOB]

After you talk back and forth a few times with the JTAC he will send you coordinates on your TAD. They will be red and you just slew your TAD cursor over that and press TMS long or short (or both?) to make it SPI and set your TGP to it (SPI) with ChinaHat up long.

 

No numbers or any other info are really important for you at this stage - only maybe what kind of target it is. I was really confused at the start of my DCS career with JTAC's too. :)

[robert123456]

Thanks a lot for the fast and detailed replies. I will check all this info and replay the mission and see if i can use it to do a better and cleaner attack.

 

Yes i like that when you think you know something a whole load of new info appears or someone starts shooting at you in ways you havent anticipated :D

 

P.s. Kaiza that pdf was detailed and helpfull thanks.

Edited October 28, 2012 by robert123456

[Cookie]

Robert,

 

I suggest checking out YouTube for tutorials on this topic, especially on entering coordinates given to you by JTAC. Sure, sometimes they will also send you the target coordinates via SADL, but what if the JTAC is not equipped for it (which is actually quite normal IRL)? In multiplayer you will never get the magic red triangle, you will always have to enter the coordinates yourself. Therefore it does make a lot of sense to learn how to enter them manually, and by watching tutorials on YouTube you can easily see what button needs to be pressed when and what to enter where.

 

It may seem daunting at first, but with a little bit of practice it quickly becomes second nature and can be done real quick. Sometimes I am even faster manually entering the coordinates than I am slewing the cursor on the TAD to the triangle, so my advice would be to practice, practice, practice. Just as with everything when it comes to the A-10. ;)

 

As for the 9-line, Kaiza already pointed you to the appropriate pages in the manual. The 9-line is quite simple really and mostly even self-explanatory. JTACs in real life use the 9-line for two reasons:

 

- To enhance safety. By using a fixed formular it is being made sure no vital information is missing

 

- To enable different partners to work together. In Afghanistan, the following would be nothing out of the ordinary for example: A german JTAC on the ground talks to a British Apache overhead, while a USMC Harrier circles over them with a Dutch F-16 providing top cover. The F-16 runs out of fuel and the replacement, a Rafale from France, is already on the way and needs to be filled in on what´s happening.

To make sure in a situation like this, with multiple nations and doctrines involved, everybody is on the same page, a standardized 9-line is used.

 

When dealing with JTACs, you also need to understand that the JTAC is the one who "buys" the weapon. He will tell you what kind of ordnance he wants, where he wants it, when and how. It is NOT up to you to decide anything here, you are just simply the means of delivery. He is the one who tells you what he wants, and he is the one and only person who clears you in hot.

If you are not happy with what he is asking you to do, you can always tell him or refuse his command, but once you are commited to the strike, you cannot change a thing about it, not one! In real life, sticking to that is a matter of life and death.

 

You will also notice that a JTAC will never give you coordinated of friendlies, just a vague description like "friendlies 2000 meters north" or some such. They will never give you exact coordinates, even though sometimes you need to be visual on friendlies before you start your attack run.

This is done because in the past it happened that pilots mixed up the coordinates in the heat of the battle and actually attacked friendly troops. As you have probably already found out, from up there they all look the same. ;) So yeah, the only coordinates you will ever get are those of the bad guys. Make sure you doublecheck anyway before you start the attack run. Nothing worse than blue-on-blue.

 

Btw, if you are interested in all this JTAC business, I recommend the book Fire Strike 7/9 by Paul Grahame, where he talks about his job as a JTAC in Afghanistan. Fascinating book, gives you an awesome insight and made me appreciate the A-10 even more.

[robert123456]

Thanks a lot cookie for that detailed answer. Ill see if i can grab that book somewhere because importing things here is a little complicated at the moment.

 

Another question:

 

The jtac asks me to attack a tank formation consisting of 4 tanks and use a maverick D, i only have 1 maverick and my wingman 2, so i strike 1, order the strike on the other two and then should contact the jtac again and tell him what to make him decide an ordinance for the fourth tank? Whats the term for that? you strike 3 tanks and then refuse command?

 

Thanks.

[-Pv-]

When you call the JTAC again for another task, he'll decide if your current weapon load is acceptable to attack the same target or another target. If you don't meet the requirement, he'll send you home.

-Pv-

[WildBillKelsoe]

1,2,3 N/A

4 2600 feet msc

5 tank column road heading southwest

6 coordinates mm333623

7 marked by wp

8 friendlies south 3000 meters troops

9 egress east

 

1. The Initial Point (IP) that the attack should be started from. This is a point created in the Mission Editor and is a NAV point in the CDU

2. Attack heading to the target and any offset needed

3. Distance to target

 

 

4. Elevation of target (MSL)

5. Target type

6. UTM coordinates of target

7. How the target is marked (None, White Phosphorus (WP), Laser, or IR Pointer) - In your case, marked by white smoke (willy pete)

8. Location of nearby friendly ground forces - If Troops in contact published, now you're looking at Danger Close. Be very cautious about this attack.

9. Control point to egress to - If he says egress south, egress south. If he says egress through IP (for example, egress to Chevy), you begin your attack from Chevy and do a quick 180 turn back to Chevy), this also applies to dry runs (missed ordnance delivery pass).

 

 

The remarks section mainly highlights the threats in area, windage data for CDU LASTE correction, and the attack heading recommended to avoid blue on blue.

 

I have to say that this implementation of combat embodied in JTAC is the best I've come across.

 

Type 1 will pop smoke once you've truly passed IP (ingress point) and published it over FM.

[spn]

So after a lot of trying i finally finished the first of the instant action missions in full sim mode!.

 

On the last target (waypoint 6: column) you are asked to attack a group of tanks going through the road and you may contact the jtac playboy on x radio frequence.

 

So i contact him and automatically send a message which says my bearing info and the current payload of me and my wingman. He then says something about the 9 line (i think he called it) and gave a set of info:

 

1,2,3 N/A

4 2600 feet msc

5 tank column road heading southwest

6 coordinates mm333623

7 marked by wp

8 friendlies south 3000 meters troops

9 egress east

 

This is what i remember now so there might be one or two words missing somewhere but i think its pretty close to what he said.

 

So my first question is what all these means in terms of information to engage the target, specifically i dont know what means numbers 4 and 6. What am i suppoused to do with the coordinates of 6, i imagine is the tanks location but how do i use it? Also what does it mean that 1,2,3 are N/A not available?

 

I ended up completing this last part of the mission with a combination of patience, common sense and some swearing too but of course would like to understand and learn whats all that about.

 

Thanks for any info.

 

 

There are also some good training videos on YouPlay if you search for DCS A-10C Warthog that might help. Also, this post - DCS: A-10C Tutorial Collection (PDF´s and Videos)

Edited November 7, 2012 by spn
Added DCS training location