Anything better the a Thrustmaster Hotas Warthog?

[Dudester22]

I took the plunge and ordered myself the ThrustMaster Warthog Hotas, but I have to say that I'm one of the ones that are not that impressed? I like the joystick, but I am not at all keen on the throttle department even though it is suppose to represent true life. For one when I put it on my desk and lock the throttles together, it moves about when I try to lift it over the dents even though it's top heavy.

 

I also find the button presses for a desktop control to stiff and clunky on the throttle. I know they are suppose to be like that but I found myself not liking it one bit. I can understand them in a jet when you have all the Geforces and feel you are pushing against something, but I just cannot get used to it on a desktop control. Does the new Saitek offering have them same stiff keys? I currently have the Saitek x52 and like that to be honest lol.

Edited December 2, 2013 by Dudester22

[karambiatos]

this maybe http://flightsimcontrols.com/store/joysticks/vkb-black-mamba-light-joystick-for-eu-customers/

http://flightsimcontrols.com/store/joysticks/vkb-fat-black-mamba-joystick-for-eu-customers/

 

but no hotas, only a joystick

[Dudester22]

Do you know if you can just buy the Warthog joystick and get that to work on its own?

[Feuerfalke]

Very interesting stick!

 

If you want full HOTAS-Functionality with tons of buttons and perfect for desktop-usage, I recommend the CH-Fighterstick + CH Pro Throttle.

 

Most decent advantage over the Warthog:

- Very easy to program, even with complex macros and layers

- Easy to use buttons, switches and toggles

- Very decent mini-stick (biggest flaw of the TM Warthog, IMHO)

- And for me one of the biggest pros: You can easily put the throttle on a desk and still be able to reach all buttons on every throttle-setting without twisting your hand.

[jjohnson241]

I don't think you can buy the Warthog stick as a standalone. At least I've never seen the stick only on sale anywhere.

Try a little Velcro on the bottom of the Throttle plate. That's what I use to keep it in place. Works like a champ.

[Feuerfalke]

Do you know if you can just buy the Warthog joystick and get that to work on its own?

 

Yes.

 

The TM Warthog is made of 2 independent devices.

You can use the stick alone and IIRC you can even buy the stick without the throttle.

 

Edit: Just checked - you can even buy just the stick directly from TM:

http://www.thrustmaster.com/en_UK/products/hotas-warthog-flight-stick

[cichlidfan]

Edit: Just checked - you can even buy just the stick directly from TM:

http://www.thrustmaster.com/en_UK/products/hotas-warthog-flight-stick

 

Amazon, too! The stick has been available standalone since May.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Thrustmaster-HOTAS-Warthog-Flight-Stick-PC/dp/B00CBVHJ00/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1386025739&sr=8-3&keywords=thrustmaster+warthog

[Dudester22]

Here's the other thing and I am wondering if I should return it now. I got the stick and throttle from Amazon for £239.99 and it's just gone up to £307 now. Does anyone else like the stiffness of the buttons and switches? Would I be mad to send it back now I have it for this price? I just cannot make my mind up on the thing to be honest.

 

The other dilema is that Amazon have told me it has a six month warranty? Surly, not for something this expensive? Do you reckon ThrustMaster have a warranty when the Amazon runs out?

Edited December 2, 2013 by Dudester22

[BIGNEWY]

good quality velcro will stop it moving, I have used it in the past.

 

Nothing beats screwing the throttle down :)

[BIGNEWY]

just replied to your message dudester22

 

If you do not want to mark your desk a alternative is to use suckers

 

 

 

you may have to get creative fixing them into the holes provided on the throttle but you will get the idea :)

[cichlidfan]

Do you reckon ThrustMaster have a warranty when the Amazon runs out?

 

Two years, according to the manual.

[Seil]

I think you're nuts man. You need to fly with it. More than 2 hours.

 

You keep saying "desktop" but the TM Warthogs are replica simulation controls, not a cheesy desktop joystick.

 

I'm also not sure which buttons could be "too stiff" - The only ones I can think of are the auto pilot and LG Warn Silence - WHICH you don't want to accidentally turn off with an easy-to-press button.

 

Also, if you're flying *ANY* aircraft with dual engines, do NOT lock the throttles together on the warthog. Fly with them unlocked - always. It will be sort of weird at the very beginning, but you'll thank me later.

[Dudester22]

I think you're nuts man. You need to fly with it. More than 2 hours.

 

You keep saying "desktop" but the TM Warthogs are replica simulation controls, not a cheesy desktop joystick.

 

I'm also not sure which buttons could be "too stiff" - The only ones I can think of are the auto pilot and LG Warn Silence - WHICH you don't want to accidentally turn off with an easy-to-press button.

 

Also, if you're flying *ANY* aircraft with dual engines, do NOT lock the throttles together on the warthog. Fly with them unlocked - always. It will be sort of weird at the very beginning, but you'll thank me later.

 

I changed my mind already lol. Stupidly, I took it out of the box, placed it on the desk and then packed it away to be send back. However, after posting on here, I then thought. I'll give it another go and actually play the game with it this time lol. To be honest I'm glad I did because I love it and why I thought the buttons and switched were to stiff I don't know. I think it's because my credit card is getting a bit to much spent on it and I was trying to convince myself this wasn't upto scratch lol. Oh well another amount of money I'll have to pay back someday because I'm keeping it :)

[blackbelter]

One thing I discovered was that the red paint on the trigger is soluable in alcohol... I discovered that when I cleaned it using alcohol swaps... :'( So remember not to do what I did to mine.

[lxsapper]

The WH is a great consumer market controler, I think it's main flaws are:

1- as pointed before the microstick.

2-The wobbly throttle leavers when unlocked, this is however a matter of feel as in no way affects their ability to be moved percisely and to stay in place and has mostly to do with the detents mechanism, wich brings me to the 3rd flaw.

3- Maybe not exactly a flaw, but I would have prefered a diferent way to activate/deactivate the AB detent, maybe a lever you could switch similar to the Throttles lock.

4- TARGET Software... TARGET is easy to use and quite powerfull, but the decision to make the controlers virtually disconnect and connect a single virtual controler even though it offers advantages in a legacy situation is damaging in most present day uses.

[Seil]

I changed my mind already lol. Stupidly, I took it out of the box, placed it on the desk and then packed it away to be send back. However, after posting on here, I then thought. I'll give it another go and actually play the game with it this time lol. To be honest I'm glad I did because I love it and why I thought the buttons and switched were to stiff I don't know. I think it's because my credit card is getting a bit to much spent on it and I was trying to convince myself this wasn't upto scratch lol. Oh well another amount of money I'll have to pay back someday because I'm keeping it :)

 

Heh, I had no intentions of pushing you into debt. But glad you enjoy your HOTAS!

 

 

The WH is a great consumer market controler, I think it's main flaws are:

1- as pointed before the microstick.

2-The wobbly throttle leavers when unlocked, this is however a matter of feel as in no way affects their ability to be moved percisely and to stay in place and has mostly to do with the detents mechanism, wich brings me to the 3rd flaw.

3- Maybe not exactly a flaw, but I would have prefered a diferent way to activate/deactivate the AB detent, maybe a lever you could switch similar to the Throttles lock.

4- TARGET Software... TARGET is easy to use and quite powerfull, but the decision to make the controlers virtually disconnect and connect a single virtual controler even though it offers advantages in a legacy situation is damaging in most present day uses.

 

Interesting....

 

I've seen others complain about it, but I've never had any issues or complaints about the microstick.... I wish it was the full sized authentic control, but obviously for cost reasons it isn't. That being said, it IS a hall effect input and it seems responsive, smooth and very controllable.

 

A10's don't have after burners.... I know there are plenty of other aircraft to fly but it IS the "Warthog" HOTAS.........

 

 

Also never had any issues or complaints about the software, device representation or programming custom profiles....

 

If you just plug them in, and load up DCS (to fly the A10C), there's litterally NOTHING to change or do; everything works perfectly as intended. If you want to get crazy and customize some things, you have all the power in the world to change every aspect - at the cost of a slightly more complex programming method / understanding.

 

Lastly, none of this is relevant to the OP's topic :p

Edited December 3, 2013 by Seil

[Ratfink]

I'm thinking to update my X-52 Pro sometime, but looking for something more 'general' than the Warthog for other planes and other sims (Falcon BMS, Cliffs of Dover for example).

I like the X-52 because it is not dedicated for just one plane, and seems to work well with all. Just my one is starting to feel worn out!

[cichlidfan]

While I will grant that the Warthog is 'designed' with one aircraft in mind, I would point out that it works quite well in other aircraft. Along with the A-10, I fly all of the DCS aircraft, Rise of Flight, Cliffs of Dover, Battle of Stalingrad and various civil aircraft in Prepar3d and find that it does the job just fine.

 

FWIW, I use Target to program it for all sims.

[Seil]

While I will grant that the Warthog is 'designed' with one aircraft in mind, I would point out that it works quite well in other aircraft. Along with the A-10, I fly all of the DCS aircraft, Rise of Flight, Cliffs of Dover, Battle of Stalingrad and various civil aircraft in Prepar3d and find that it does the job just fine.

 

FWIW, I use Target to program it for all sims.

 

Agreed. And technically, the Warthog's HOTAS are composed of an F16 stick and F15 throttles. (the throttle controls are slightly different, but close enough)

 

Also, there is the possibility of other sticks to come that will attach to the Warthog's gimbal....

Edited December 3, 2013 by Seil

[Feuerfalke]

Interesting....

 

I've seen others complain about it, but I've never had any issues or complaints about the microstick.... I wish it was the full sized authentic control, but obviously for cost reasons it isn't. That being said, it IS a hall effect input and it seems responsive, smooth and very controllable.

 

Hall sensors alone don't make it good.

 

Even the mini-stick on the X52 can handle analog input better than that in the TMWarthog. The later is rather digital, like a coolie hat. I've never managed to not go at full speed. This was a major flaw in many reviews I read and I absolutely agree with that.

 

If compare that to the comfort of the CH Pro Throttle mini-stick, you'll never again lose a positive word on the TM ministick.

[cichlidfan]

I've never managed to not go at full speed. This was a major flaw in many reviews I read and I absolutely agree with that.

 

Set a dead zone of 30 and Y saturation of 15 for both axis. It works fairly well that way.

[lxsapper]

I understand that a people may like the microstick, but I stand by my opinion that's it's one of the weak things in it's design. It works reasonably well with the A-10C but it could be better, on the AU-25T or the KA-50 yes you can play about with deadzones and curves but it's hardly anything better than useable. Ypu can tell the HALL sensor in it it's probably very accurate but without an accurate means of commanding it (travel variance) it doesn't ammount to much. I've never used the CH microstick but COUGAR one was a million times easier to use, until it went spiking to hell and needed a replacement.

 

TARGET software driver is a bad design call. By the way I'm very much aware I don't need to program anything to fly the A-10C, but that's irrelevant when talking about TARGET. And from a technical view point it's the DCS A-10C software that works out of the box with the controler and not the other way around.

The reason I say TARGET is baddly designed, imagine you want to program the Flap lever to something other than the A-10C, you have two choises use LUA edits tu program the switch off positio as well or you can use TARGET. I know how to do the LUA edits (I have a lot of people I fly with that are not so keen on it) but my first choise would be TARGET it's easier and faster. But if I use TARGET everytime I wish to change planes and yes that goes for that multiplayer session that you wish to alternate a little, every single time! YOU HAVE TO EXIT THE GAME! That goes for any sim that you wish to use a diferent setup for multiple aircraft.

Then if that wasnt enough TARGET design made another mistake by making it more apropriate for legacy games than modern ones. See they didn't think that I might want to program my WH in TARGET but instead of keyboard commands I might wanna keep it all DX commands for various reasons. But you are not going to be able to because you will have one single virtual controller and only 32 DX buttons to play with.

[reschke]

I personally can't stand the TARGET as the software. I find that it isn't easy to work with the GUI side and is enough of a problem for me in the script side that I can't wrap my mind around how to write the actual script to make it work for me.

 

As it stands now when I fire up DCS I tend to only fly the A-10C since I can't get the other aircraft to function as I want them to in the game with any of the profiles.

[xaoslaad]

I understand that a people may like the microstick, but I stand by my opinion that's it's one of the weak things in it's design. It works reasonably well with the A-10C but it could be better, on the AU-25T or the KA-50 yes you can play about with deadzones and curves but it's hardly anything better than useable. Ypu can tell the HALL sensor in it it's probably very accurate but without an accurate means of commanding it (travel variance) it doesn't ammount to much. I've never used the CH microstick but COUGAR one was a million times easier to use, until it went spiking to hell and needed a replacement.

 

TARGET software driver is a bad design call. By the way I'm very much aware I don't need to program anything to fly the A-10C, but that's irrelevant when talking about TARGET. And from a technical view point it's the DCS A-10C software that works out of the box with the controler and not the other way around.

The reason I say TARGET is baddly designed, imagine you want to program the Flap lever to something other than the A-10C, you have two choises use LUA edits tu program the switch off positio as well or you can use TARGET. I know how to do the LUA edits (I have a lot of people I fly with that are not so keen on it) but my first choise would be TARGET it's easier and faster. But if I use TARGET everytime I wish to change planes and yes that goes for that multiplayer session that you wish to alternate a little, every single time! YOU HAVE TO EXIT THE GAME! That goes for any sim that you wish to use a diferent setup for multiple aircraft.

Then if that wasnt enough TARGET design made another mistake by making it more apropriate for legacy games than modern ones. See they didn't think that I might want to program my WH in TARGET but instead of keyboard commands I might wanna keep it all DX commands for various reasons. But you are not going to be able to because you will have one single virtual controller and only 32 DX buttons to play with.

 

If you set the X and Y axis to saturation y to 15 (leave saturation x at 100) with a deadzone of 2 and no curve the ministick behaves fine in the Ka-50 and probably in the Su-25T (just got the stick this weekend so spent time messing with it in yhe shark first. But yes it flies VERY fast by default in anything but the A-10C.

 

Other than that I haven't had problems setting inputs in game and nothing has made me want to use TARGET yet.

[docfu]

I'll say this, after wearing through a Saitek X-52 and countless other joysticks the warthog is a godsend. It's nice to have a joystick that doesn't feel like a cheap piece of plastic in your hands.

 

If its still sliding around on you, maybe try some of that non-slip rubber covering that's normally for use in cupboards and on shelving. You should be able to cut it to size and get it fitting perfectly.

 

Just remember a good joystick is like a good woman. If she ain't making you work for success, you ain't really tryin...