Uprade, possibly new build...

[Thinder]

So I have secured this funding, years of pension arrears, done sone research about performances and availability here is my shopping list:

CORSAIR RMx Series (2021) RM850x CP-9020200-NA 850 W ATX12V / EPS12V 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Full Modular Power Supply.

MSI MEG X570S ACE MAX AM4 AMD X570 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard.

2 X SAMSUNG 870 EVO Series 2.5" 2TB SATA III V-NAND Internal Solid State.

WD Black SN850X 2TB SSD M.2 2280 NVME PCI-E Gen4 Solid State Drive.

AMD Ryzen 7 5800X 3D.

G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Series 128GB (4 x 32GB) 288-Pin PC RAM DDR4 3200 (PC4 25600) Desktop Memory Model F4-3200C16Q-128GTZR.

Pimax Crystal.

RX 7900 XTX.

THRUSTMASTER HOTAS Warthog Flight Stick (I keep the TWCS throttle, I'm used to it and it works just fine).

I retain two SSDs (SATA/Windows 10 and M2/Games) will transfer the content of my actual SATA SSDs to the new ones and keep my cooling which I am very happy with, for full upgrade I'll need a new box but it is not necessary as everything fits on my actual case.

 

Edited November 6, 2022 by Thinder

[EightyDuce]

One suggestion I would make is go for 3600 CL18 or CL16 DDR4 instead of 3200 so that you run 1:1 FCLK. Out of curiosity, why 128 GB vs 64? Especially with a 5800X3D.

 

Also I would strongly consider dumping X570 for a B550 and save some money, unless 570 has some feature you absolutely need. Most decent B550s will have good enough VRMs to give the 5800x3d all the gas it needs. At that point just focus on having good I/O on the back and m.2 slots. 

Edited November 6, 2022 by EightyDuce

[Thinder]

6 hours ago, EightyDuce said:

One suggestion I would make is go for 3600 CL18 or CL16 DDR4 instead of 3200 so that you run 1:1 FCLK. Out of curiosity, why 128 GB vs 64? Especially with a 5800X3D.

 

Also I would strongly consider dumping X570 for a B550 and save some money, unless 570 has some feature you absolutely need. Most decent B550s will have good enough VRMs to give the 5800x3d all the gas it needs. At that point just focus on having good I/O on the back and m.2 slots. 

 

The Ryzen (Zen 3) controllers limit is 3200MHz, there is absolutely no benefit going for a higher frequency while using a B.die RAM kit if you intend to run it at 4K, the limits are also 4 X 1 bank regadless of the number of sticks.

Passed those limits, higher frequencies might (or not) compensate at lower resolution, but under load, the controller will throttle back, this combination removes the bottleneck at 4K.

The Ryzen architecture is not designed to use higher frequencies but lower latencies {Cl14) and when I tested my Crucial kit at Cl 16 3600 MHz, I lost just above 1% at 4K, no gain, on the contrtary, I gained 6.04% at 4K running this Cl14 kit at 3200MHz in a 4 X 1 bank combination, since I intend to play 4K VR it is what I need.

AMD Ryzen™ 5 5600X AMD Ryzen™ 7 5800X3D

Intel techies uses this precise RAM kit to O.C it, as did players using older generations of Ryzen and Intel CPUs but it is not what the Ryzen 5/7 are happy with.

How to Overclock RAM

>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Advantages of the X570S ACE MAX over the Tomahawk:

2 X extra SATAIII connections. X 1 extra USB 3.2 ports (Rear) (Gen 2x2, Type C). 2 X extra USB 3.2 (Gen 1, Type A) ports (Front).

I need more, faster USB ports so with the Tomahawk, I would have the same limitations than I have now, also the 4 X M.2 Slot and SATA channels are separated, you don't lose one SATA for using one or more than one M2 SSD.

Those things might not look like they matter, but I will use 2 X M2 SSD (to start with) and at least 3 SATA, the SSDs for gaming (my games are loaded on my actual M2, the other ones for Windows, apps and storage.

For the RAM capacity, it's coming with a kit that you must get as a 4 X1 not 2 eparated kits.

Quote

Even the same models of memory kit in different production period, there might have IC difference as we will be using different memory chips.

In general we do not recommend mixing two or more memory kits together, even if the same model number, may result in compatibility issue, such as unable to boot or unable to perform at rated speeds. Each of our memory kit is thoroughly tested for compatibility between modules within the memory kit before retail, so we guarantee each memory kit will operate to its rated specs on its own.

Euro Tech Support Team

One DCS player had the unfortunate experience of adding the same RAM with an extra kit and couldn't start Windows at all, so it is important to get your shoping list right first thing, regardless of the capacity, you must get a complete kit from the start.

I couldn't find a 4 X 16 GB kit and since I have the budget, I decided to get this one anyway, specs might change if I can get a 4 X 16GB kit of the same RAM from Newegg.

G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Series 128GB (4 x 32GB) 288-Pin PC RAM DDR4 3200 (PC4 25600) Desktop Memory Model F4-3200C16Q-128GTZR

Edited November 7, 2022 by Thinder

[EightyDuce]

Interesting. From everything I've read (I don't have access to Zen 3 to test) 3600 CL16 seems to be the sweet spot. 

[Thinder]

1 hour ago, EightyDuce said:

Interesting. From everything I've read (I don't have access to Zen 3 to test) 3600 CL16 seems to be the sweet spot. 

3600 MHz is the sweet spot for Cl16 and above, but the Zen 3 architecture favours lower latencies.

Let's say that if one player is planning to play exclusively at lower res, doesn't have the funds to pay for the B.Die Cl14 premium, then increasing frequencies might be an option but it will come with its limitations, especially if the player in question doesn't know what he is doing and fit 4 X dual bank sticks, which is beyond the controller limitation.

Before commiting to this RAM, I have asked MSI, AMD and other techies (G-Skill providers) their technical advise and then again I took a risk because this RAM kit wasn't listed as supported by my motherborad, but not only it worked flawlesly first time, I also noticed a gain from my previous Cl16 Crucial kit.

This Cl14 RAM wasn't origilaly aimed at Zen 3 but the previous generation of CPUs, AMD and Intel alike, for its capability to support a much wider range of timings, so users could O.C their RAM when the other kits didn't support those frequencies, but because of the stability of the Samsung die, it is idealy suited for lower latencies.

Those techies commented among other things that Cl 16 higher frequencies could alleviate the difference between those ram sticks and the Cl14 but up to a point and the controller is the limit, meaning the load it can take before throttling down, the average user might not notice because he/she won't put that much load on the CPU controller.

So if you want to play at 4K with a Ryzen 5/7, your best option is B.die, Cl14, 4 X 1 bank, (which allows for interleaving which spreads memory addresses evenly across memory banks) and 3200 MHz. You get that, you have the optimum RAM bound for those CPUs.

As for the Ryzen 7 5800X 3D, it seems like it is the extention of what AMD have been doing since they introduced Zen 3, they try to reduce latency further, when the DDR5 tech will be mature, perhaps they will have support for lower latencies at higher frequencies, but not ust yet...

Now, with the event oi DDR5, higher frequencies RAM kits being agressively marketed etc, before I even think to commit to any new technology, I'll check what my CPU controller as well as motherboard can support, plus I haven't seen any of those DDR5 kits responding to those requirements yet...

 

Edited November 7, 2022 by Thinder