OpenXR Toolkit 1.3.8 still usable as stand alone (not Steam)

[StratosFalcon]

Hello, is DCS compatible with the current OpenXR Toolkit Mod 1.3.8 if it's a standalone application (not Steam)? I can't get it to work with that. Not even with OpenComposite.

Thanks and regards

[Qcumber]

Open XR toolkit works fine for me. You don't need to use Open composite any more. What headset are you using and do you have any other open XR applications running? Try checking the order of XR layers. 

https://github.com/fredemmott/OpenXR-API-Layers-GUI

 

[StratosFalcon]

Thanks for the tip. It works!

[StratosFalcon]

I have one more question: How do I activate Turbo Mode? I think there was a catch in older tools. It's missing in the current version. When I activate Turbo Mode on the VR, I get the warning "...prevents ASW." Does it even work? What else do I need to configure?

Thanks.

PS: Can/do I enable advanced options in the tool? If so, where can I find them?

Edited Monday at 01:13 PM by StratosFalcon

[mkel2010]

I too have been interested in OpenXR Toolkit, but this advice on the Github site has stopped me;

"AS OF 2024, SUPPORT FOR OPENXR TOOLKIT IS DISCONTINUED. THERE IS NO NEW DEVELOPMENT AND NO TECH SUPPORT OF ANY SORT. THE DEVELOPER DOES NOT RECOMMEND TO INSTALL/USE OPENXR TOOLKIT, AS IT IS KNOWN TO CAUSE ISSUES WITH MANY OF THE NEWER GAMES RELEASED IN SINCE 2024"

Any comments on the above statement?

[Flyingfish]

I'm completely reliant on turbo mode to hugely reduce stutters on DCS. Open XR toolkit works very well with DCS.

Using a quest pro.

[Qcumber]

Turbo mode works well for me and does not affect ASW. It does vary though and can depend on your system. 

[diego999]

Still works. I use it every day.

Can't live without turbo mode.

[Flyingfish]

It worries me that I need open XR toolkit turbo mode to get smooth performance in DCS. If open XR toolkit stops working with DCS it'll be unusable for me. Does anyone know if this is a problem for all headsets or just meta ones?

[Qcumber]

45 minutes ago, Flyingfish said:

It worries me that I need open XR toolkit turbo mode to get smooth performance in DCS. If open XR toolkit stops working with DCS it'll be unusable for me. Does anyone know if this is a problem for all headsets or just meta ones?

It's not necessarily the headset. It is more likely a combination of other factors including pc hardware and software. In some cases Turbo mode can introduce stutters.

I only need to use Turbo mode when I use VD via WiFi. It helps smooth out the frametimes but does not necessarily reduce visible stutter. With VD ethernet and Meta link I don't need it. The frametimes are very consistent. 

This is what mbucchia says about it in his GitHub Wiki:

"Turbo mode
Note: This is a highly experimental feature. If it makes your game crash or misbehave, please disable it.

Turbo mode makes the game entirely ignore any frame timing or throttling dictated by the OpenXR runtime. In other words, Turbo mode forces the game to draw and submit frames as fast as possible regardless of any recommendations or policies from the OpenXR runtime.

Turbo mode can increase your frame rate under certain conditions, but there is no rule or guarantee.

Turbo mode can also have undesired side effects:

Any statistics or performance measuring tool might now present incorrect data for frame times (however frame rate will be reported correctly). For example, on WMR, when using the performance overlay, all app CPU/GPU values will read 0.
Any feature of your platform that relies on frame timing data, such as Motion Reprojection/Motion Smoothing/ASW, will not behave correctly. For example, on WMR, the motion reprojection will not engage automatically anymore, but it can be forced via the Lock motion reprojection option.
Latency is increased, in a way that may or may not visible.
Note: Turbo mode is offered as-is. There will be no support for issues filed while using Turbo mode."

 

[mrsylvestre]

There may be other features that are desirable from the OpenXR Toolkit but if the main reason for still using it today is turbo mode for higher and/or smoother frame rates, it is worth considering QuadViews (QVFR, also by MBucchia) as a potentially better alternative. QVFR also has a setting to enable turbo mode and in addition proposes an alternative for foveated rendering that is very efficient in reducing GPU load in DCS with little or no perceived image quality reduction. YMMV.

Edited Tuesday at 12:54 PM by mrsylvestre

[Flyingfish]

51 minutes ago, Qcumber said:

It's not necessarily the headset. It is more likely a combination of other factors including pc hardware and software. In some cases Turbo mode can introduce stutters.

I only need to use Turbo mode when I use VD via WiFi. It helps smooth out the frametimes but does not necessarily reduce visible stutter. With VD ethernet and Meta link I don't need it. The frametimes are very consistent. 

This is what mbucchia says about it in his GitHub Wiki:

"Turbo mode
Note: This is a highly experimental feature. If it makes your game crash or misbehave, please disable it.

Turbo mode makes the game entirely ignore any frame timing or throttling dictated by the OpenXR runtime. In other words, Turbo mode forces the game to draw and submit frames as fast as possible regardless of any recommendations or policies from the OpenXR runtime.

Turbo mode can increase your frame rate under certain conditions, but there is no rule or guarantee.

Turbo mode can also have undesired side effects:

Any statistics or performance measuring tool might now present incorrect data for frame times (however frame rate will be reported correctly). For example, on WMR, when using the performance overlay, all app CPU/GPU values will read 0.
Any feature of your platform that relies on frame timing data, such as Motion Reprojection/Motion Smoothing/ASW, will not behave correctly. For example, on WMR, the motion reprojection will not engage automatically anymore, but it can be forced via the Lock motion reprojection option.
Latency is increased, in a way that may or may not visible.
Note: Turbo mode is offered as-is. There will be no support for issues filed while using Turbo mode."

 

Thanks, it's interesting that you don't get stutters when using meta link but I do, we have nearly identical systems. Do you use ASW or is your FPS always at the headset refresh rate?

[Qcumber]

3 hours ago, Flyingfish said:

Thanks, it's interesting that you don't get stutters when using meta link but I do, we have nearly identical systems. Do you use ASW or is your FPS always at the headset refresh rate?

I prefer not to use ASW and keep to 72 FPS. It is not often that it drops below this. I sometimes use ASW when flying low over big cities etc but it is still smooth. 

It might be worth comparing systems. I set up a method for analysing frame times in VR. If you try running some tracks without Turbo and see how the frametimes look. Or you could just record them and send the XRFrametool data files to me and I can add them to the spreadsheet. If you then send me your DCS track I can play it on my system and compare. 

 

 

[Flyingfish]

1 hour ago, Qcumber said:

I prefer not to use ASW and keep to 72 FPS. It is not often that it drops below this. I sometimes use ASW when flying low over big cities etc but it is still smooth. 

It might be worth comparing systems. I set up a method for analysing frame times in VR. If you try running some tracks without Turbo and see how the frametimes look. Or you could just record them and send the XRFrametool data files to me and I can add them to the spreadsheet. If you then send me your DCS track I can play it on my system and compare. 

 

 

Thanks for the reply I've sent you a message with hopefully the correct information/files