engine quites right after taking off

[leafer]

Would be nice to know what happened so I appreciate if someone would be so kind to look at the track. I know the temp needle was in the red but I've flown with it on red longer than this.

emergency_landing.trk

Edited March 31, 2013 by leafer

[VincentLaw]

Same thing happened to me the first time I was doing the guided takeoff training mission, following the instructor exactly, and when he said "Now reduce power" the engine sputtered and cut out almost on cue. It hasn't happened to me on any other takeoff, but I have not tried that mission again yet.

 

Just repeated the training mission. It didn't happen the second time. It might be a random failure associated with flying over max continuous power.

Edited March 31, 2013 by VincentLaw

[leafer]

It's a mystery why the engine quit in this game. I wish they'd make a vid on engine management.

[Paganus]

It wll say in the post mission screen and the debrief.log I think. I'm sure it will be temp related.

Edited March 31, 2013 by Paganus

[VincentLaw]

Well I just looked at the track a couple of times, and the engine didn't sound damaged until the other temperature gauge redlined. Right before that happens, you perform a slow speed turn with a massive sideslip where you max out the sideslip indicator. If I take control before that point and prevent that from happening, then the engine doesn't get damaged.

 

I was able to reproduce the effect in the same mission by performing similar turns or more easily by pulling high angle of attack and reducing my airspeed to 50 MPH. I was not able to reproduce this in a mission where the ambient temperature was 20 C, but I changed the temperature in my own mission to 40 C and got the engine to overheat and break doing the exact same maneuver (but not in level flight).

 

You were not operating the engine out of it's maximum continuous operating RPM or Pressure when it failed, and all of the other switches were in the right place. So I would say your problem was the weather being too hot combined with an extreme maneuver that choked the cooling system.

 

Edit: Ok, I take back saying I couldn't do it at 20 C. I just managed to overheat my engine doing the same maneuver. It is just a bit easier to do at high atmospheric temperature.

Edited March 31, 2013 by VincentLaw

[MotoX Racer]

The oil temp was getting up there but it wasn't to the point where it should cause failure, in my experience anyway. However, your coolant temp is pegged all the way over and was there for quite a while, so who knows what temperature it actually got to. Weird, I always overheat the oil long before the coolant. Your radiators were both on auto, so that shouldn't have been a problem.

 

I guess my judgement would be that the engine failure was caused by overheating the coolant, but I don't know what would have caused the coolant to get that hot that quick in the first place at those speeds and engine rpm/pressure.

[VH-Rock]

The oil temp was getting up there but it wasn't to the point where it should cause failure, in my experience anyway. However, your coolant temp is pegged all the way over and was there for quite a while, so who knows what temperature it actually got to. Weird, I always overheat the oil long before the coolant. Your radiators were both on auto, so that shouldn't have been a problem.

 

I guess my judgement would be that the engine failure was caused by overheating the coolant, but I don't know what would have caused the coolant to get that hot that quick in the first place at those speeds and engine rpm/pressure.

 

Hi Leafer,

 

The Engine management in the P-51 is great fun although, after a while, it gets to the point that it becomes routines. During the course of flying this sim, I have only ever over heated the engine twice and both of those times I was trying to see how much I could push it before she would break. I'll go through exactly what I do below from start up and hopefully it will work for you, too:

 

• Flaps Up
  
• Carb set to Ram Air (Both Carb controls fully forwards)
  
• Both Radiator door switches downwards (So that they stay open)
  
• Fuel Shut Off set to on
  
• Battery On
  
• Generator On
  
• Fuel Boost Pump On
  
• Fuel Selector set to left thank
  
• Prime (4 seconds)
  
• Mags set to Both
  
• Start
  
• Introduce Mixture to "Run" As engine starts to catch
  

 

At that point, I normally run up to about 800 - 900 RPM and let the temperatures come up to about 40 degrees. Start to taxi out to the runway, the engine will continue to warm up as you go. Once I'm holding short of the runway, the temps should have come up a little more. I then do a pre take off power run up to about 2300 RPM for about 20 seconds. If all sounds ok, taxi out, line up and take off.

 

Now, I know you can go up to 60 inches of Manifold pressure at 3000 RPM, but there is really no need to go above 45. I personally power up to 45 inches and take off. As soon as I get airbourne, the gear comes up. I then reduce the RPM to 2700 to prevent any cooling issues and then I start to correct the rudder trim.

 

If you have any issues, pop onto the virtual aerobatics server / teamspeak and I will give you a hand :)

 

http://www.virtual-aerobatics.com

 

 

*EDIT* Looking at your track, the reason your temps got so high and your engine quite because you kept high Manifold Pressure, High RPM and very low speed. - Try reducing your RPM as soon as you get airbourne to 2700 and as I mentioned above you don't need to go above 45" MP on take off. I would also suggest staying straighter and not pulling as much immediately after take off to allow the speed to build. Whilst the Merlin is a liquid cooled engine, it still needs good air flow to keep the temps down.

 

ATB,

 

Rob.

Edited March 31, 2013 by VH-Rock

[leafer]

Uh-huh. I vaguely recall reading about manifold pressure or high rpm causing blown engine, but couldn't remember which. Mystery solved then. As for tracking straight during take off, well, it's a hit and miss, mostly miss, with me. I admit that's the thing I never quite master and I'm hoping due to my twitchy twist joystick on my logitech extreme 3d pro and not my fading reflexes. :D Guys, thanks for the advice and happy flying!

 

I'll definitely give your check list a go, Rock and nice site you have there. Can you enlighten me as to when I should raise, lower or set the radio door on auto? I'd love to fly online but every time I do my ping was just horid, so I gave that up. :(

Edited March 31, 2013 by leafer

[VH-Rock]

Uh-huh. I vaguely recall reading about manifold pressure or high rpm causing blown engine, but couldn't remember which. Mystery solved then. As for tracking straight during take off, well, it's a hit and miss, mostly miss, with me. I admit that's the thing I never quite master and I'm hoping due to my twitchy twist joystick on my logitech extreme 3d pro and not my fading reflexes. :D Guys, thanks for the advice and happy flying!

 

I'll definitely give your check list a go, Rock and nice site you have there. Can you enlighten me as to when I should raise, lower or set the radio door on auto? I'd love to fly online but every time I do my ping was just horid, so I gave that up. :(

 

Hi Leafer, Thank you.

 

When you first jump on the Mustang from a cold start, both radiator switches are in the up (Automatic position). If you were to switch on the batter and the generator, both doors would raise up. Following that check list above in that order, you will switch both radiator switches to the down position (Manual) before you turn on the battery and generator. Doing so will mean that they stay open.

 

Continue with the check list, taxi out and hold short of the runway. Whilst holding short, now set both radiator doors to automatic (upwards). You will hear the doors close, it takes about 10 to 15 seconds (I think). Whilst they are closing, I do my 2300 RPM power run up. To be clear about that, prop pitch is full forwards and just move the throttle forwards until you reach 2300 RPM and hold that for about 20 seconds.

 

Taxi out, line up and advance the throttle slowly to 45" Mp. Once airbourne, gear up, reduce the RPM to 2700 and then trim the rudder to the left.

 

One thing I noticed from your track is that you only used about 2 degrees right rudder trim on take-off. The manual says to use 6. Personally, I use just shy of 5 as I find 6 a little too much for my way of taking off.

 

One more thing is that, when landing, I always open both radiators on the down wind leg when I drop the gear and flaps to keep he cool during the approach and taxi back. Loosing an engine on approach is not enjoyable xD

 

Atb, Rob.

Edited March 31, 2013 by VH-Rock

[leafer]

Thanks again for your thorough explanation. The reason I set rudder to two degrees is I read that that all it takes after the first patch. Maybe I'm imagining thing? Will give it a try as soon as the wife stop making faces. :D

[VH-Rock]

Hi Leafer, After the first patch, there was indeed an error with the trim which meant that you had to use less than the handbook said. However, that was fixed in a later patch so the 6 degrees is the correct figure (Although, as I said above, I personally used 5)

[leafer]

I didn't know that was a bug so I had been setting rudder to 2 degrees all these times. Yikes. lol I like your avatar. I love cats. :D

[VH-Rock]

haha, thanks - according to some of my friends, it quite suites my personality xD

[Scarecrow]

Page 30&128 of the P51 flight manual gives all the different RPM and MP combinations and instrument limits. Ive got it tacked on the wall beside my desk for quick reference.

[doright]

I would mention that in addition to coolant door switches you also have another engine temp management control in your right hand. If temps are getting high lower the nose slightly to increase your airspeed. A climb at 170mph is fine if you are in the green with your temps beforehand. If your in the red lowering the nose slightly to around 200mph will get you back in the green quickly.