MAKhan
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Posts posted by MAKhan
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Jeff Carrier Ops
Ok the Jeff is practically carrier qualified! :D see the below video, the guy lands, re-arms and takes off with full weight. If you guys are ever in a mission where carrier ops is necessary, u can still use the trusty Jeff for that :D
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Nigeria has also bought 3 JF-17 Block 2(Serial # NAF-720, NAF-721, NAF-722) which are ready and user testing in Pakistan has started. The will be delivered in November.
Nigeria had inked a contract to purchase three JF-17 Block II fighter jets and the deal was formally set in motion in March 2019 when the Pakistani government's Economic Coordination Committee (ECC) approved a $184.3 million sovereign guarantee covering the delivery of three PAC/CAC JF-17 Thunder fighter jets to the Nigerian Air Force.
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Look at this little guy rubbing shoulders with Giants :D
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F-7PG definitely come out before the J-7G and was using the J-7E airframe. The PAF may have put the radar in themselves. If you take a look at the radar corn, it is way too small, because it was designed to house only a ranging radar.
Yes exactly. I just started doing some research on J-7, and man there are literally hundred variants. There a separate page on its variants in wiki :D. However i read that the Chinese did install a radar in J-7G, in the Bangladeshi ones its called KLJ-6.
"J/F-7G series is the further development of earlier J-7E series. Contrary to many frequent but erroneous claims, the fire control radar is not the Chinese development of EL/M-2001B radar, because EL/M-2001B is a pulse Doppler ranging only radar.[64] Instead, the Chinese fire control radar for J-G is developed from EL/M-2032 fire control radar China obtained from Israel when it was a subcontractor for Elbit in the Romanian MiG-21 LanceR program described above.[74][75]
J-7G: Upgraded J-7E with more than 30 improvements with Mr. Song Cheng-Zhi (宋承志) as the general designer. Equipped HOTAS and a Chinese derivative of EL/M-2032. However, due to the inherit limitation of the small size of the nosecone, the antenna size of EL/M-2032 has to be greatly reduced, resulting in the drastic decrease of the original 150 km range of EL/M-2032 by approximately 60% to slightly more than 60 km.[92] Development begun in March 2002 and completed in July 2004, with delivery begun in Nov 2004.[86][87]"
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I always heard because of its placement it’s to be used up during taxing, that way it won’t affect in flight CG
Yeah that would be prudent. The main takeaway is that they managed to retain the same fuel capacity. Weight would have increased probably, that is if it has not been compensated by using lighter composites.
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Pakistan even has the facility to repair overhaul and make the Grifo radars at Kamra. You can see it in the new Kamra video, warning though this state sponsored with a pretty nationalist stance, but there is a lot you can see in the video, including JF-17 assembly and the JF-17B sim cockpit they use to test avionics(it has a central pedestal and other stuff)
They make it sound like they achieved the ability to make the fuselage, and only import the engines, but I could be wrong
Did you see the part about the Bravos tail? they have made a fuel cell in the tail, to make up for the fuel loss due to the second seat. Interesting right? Never knew the tail can also store fuel!
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The Radar in PAF's PGs is Italian, it is specific to PAF. I am not sure about Chinese or Bangladeshi or other countries J-7s.
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F-7PG is not actually an export version of J-7G. It is an J-7E. It has no search radar.
Major Improvements
More powerful WP-13 Engine, improvement in acceleration time from 500 kph to 1100 kph and an equally impressive time-to-climb to 36,000 AMSL. More powerful Grifo-MG radar with better ECCM, look-down and shoot-down capabilities than its predecessor Grifo-Mk-II. The number of targets can be tracked simultaneously increased from the original 4 of the Grifo-Mk-II to a total of 8 of the Grifo-MG. Regarding modern avionics upgrades these included a Stores Management System, which is essentially a useful cockpit-pilot interface to help establish the status of stores including configuration, fusing and weapon codes etc. A voice warning system, colour video recorder, elaborate cockpit lighting and a more precise and jitter–free AOA probe are nice-to-have improvements. The colour EFIS includes two displays, one for the attitude and the other for the heading and navigation sub-systems like ADF, VOR, TACAN, ILS etc
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/f7pg-the-nimble-paf-fighter-nobody-talks-about.659857/
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Thanks for point that out. When I saw the picture, I was suspicious of it too.
Man I had hard time finding a cockpit picture of J-7G. So far the only one I can find is the civilian airshow version of it, which has no radar nor weapon.
I believe this is a video of PAF F-7PG simulator, it may be a bit different from J-7 im nt sure, but it looks good though:
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Brother i would suggest you rename this thread if possible to JF-17 tips & tricks or tactics, tht way it would be sort of an tactics information pool abt the Jeff :)
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One thing i saw with CM802 AKG, the man-in-the-loop variant which made it very very effective in anti shipping role:
When the AKG is launched, the mfcd on which it timer etc is, theres a button on the left labelled CRS. If you press it, it instantly gives you control of the missile, even before the distance countdown of 10nm. You can control the missile and bring it down to as low as possible just over the water. This way it is really low from a pretty far distance from a ship and the ships defenses cannot shoot it down. Do try it guys, ive seen it used to a very good effect. I think this tactic can be used against a sam site too if the terrain is plain enough.
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Size does not affect RCS unless the phsysical construction is the same inside and outside. Shaping and RF opaqueness/absorption control RCS, not size. A tiny luneburg lens will have a gigantic RCS.
Never base RCS estimates on size.
Yes you're right, i stand corrected, was just wondering on the reasons LD-10 aren't intercepted while LS-6s are.
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Im sorry to hijack this topic and noticing SD-10 missile here, was a big mistake.
Also I edited my original post and added
to make clear who said what.For your info, if you just compare front view and cross section:
[ATTACH]245809[/ATTACH]
From sides, its clear, that Viper have more angled shape with comparison with thick and tall JF-17 cigar. Unfortunately I didnt found any JF-17 cross section drawing.
Again, I insist that JF17 must be RCS 4.0 defined in Lua script same as F-16, not 3.0
You wont find open source to confirm figures for RCS of JF-17, at least not yet, most would be guesstimates. As per my information (which i cannot substantiate with a source) the RCS of JF-17's first prototype was 2.6m2 (the one with splitter plate intakes), which was further reduced in the final product, with reduction of 30% rcs just by the DSI intake. You cannot just look at a fighter and calculate its RCS. F-16A has RCS of 5m2, F-16C has lower RCS than that while both have essentially the same shape! F/A-18 E/F has even lower RCS than f-16C, even though it is aerodynamically dirtier than than an F-16C. You see where this is going? About composite material, i have not seen any accredited source mentioning it having RCS reduction ability, it is essentially used for weight reduction and strength. RAM coating on the other hand is used for RCS reduction.
PAF which flies F-16 C/D, F-16 A/B, Mirage 3/5, F-7P/PG(mig-21) maintain that JF-17 has lower RCS than all of the above and is the hardest to spot on the radar. DEKA will have to use their sources to get a figure and i dont think they would be provided documentary evidence to share, as it is confidential, at least in PAF's and Chinese case.
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Type 052c Destroyer issue
I don't know if its reported earlier or not, but the Type 052C Destroyer, destroys its self while firing cruise missiles. Watch the below clip timestamp (01:10:00)
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It is a quasi-ballistic missile reportedly, solid fuel, anti ship. Seems already intergrated with JF-17 judging from the attached pic of an operational plane.
"In its disclosure for 2017-2018, Pakistan’s Ministry of Defense Production (MoDP) revealed that it procured 60 CM-400AKG missiles for $100 million US."
"According to IHS Jane’s, the CM-400AKG “climbs to a high altitude and terminates with a high-speed drive on the target.”[7] In effect, it appears that the CM-400AKG operates with an arc, thus owing to its quasi-ballistic missile ties. Besides its flight trajectory, the CM-400AKG reportedly has a range of 180-250 km, using a terminal-stage seeker – optional between imaging infrared (IIR) and active radar-homing (ARH).[8] However, the terminal-stage element is – as per CASIC – best suited for ‘slow-moving targets’, with overt mention of aircraft carriers.[9] The CM-400AKG’s warhead options include blast fragmentation and penetration."
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Yeah ur rite probably, but i still think to classify as a missile, independent propulsion should be a factor. RCS wise, LS-6 isnt much bigger dimension-wise than an Sd-10/Ld-10 also, besides the wings, i dont know how much the wings would contribute to the rcs. For comparison :
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i think a better area for focus should be the re-classification of GB-6 and LS-6 as bombs instead of missiles, coz they are in fact bombs with wings, no propulsion. Reason being they wont end up being shot down by every tom dick and harry SA .
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I think its the end of the road for PL5EII, focus would be more on PL-10.
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Thermobaric Bombs tested on JF-17 Bravo
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TOD? whts tht?
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Hi everyone,
I found a tutorial (in French) about the TOT function in the Jeff. However i havent been able to find any other information on it anywhere else. Is TOT fully functional and implemented?
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I hope it didn't brother. But the US has many tricks up its sleeves to kill of its competitors. I just saw that mectron have been bought off twice and is now called THE SIATT, and the original guys have left the group since 2014-2015. So m not sure whats happening.
The same thing happened with the Czech VERA anti-stealth radar. Pakistan made an order, took a sample radar and before it could be delivered, a US company bought it off and cancelled all the previous deals. Just recently with the Turkish Atak helicopter deal, Pakistan made a deal for 30 attack helicopters and now the US engine providers arent giving clearance for export.
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Yup, they delivered prototypes for integration so it was ready if they made it, but production ended up never happening and being officially cancelled in 2019. I remember now there was some key part they needed from US to make anti radiation missile in mass production but US wouldn’t export it, unfortunately I can’t find that source right now. I’m trying to find a couple articles I saw last year about official cancellation but can’t seem to find them right now
Updated information about MAR-1 sure is hard to come by. I cant seem to find some stuff i read earlier about it now too. Nevertheless, i did stumble upon the following para where they mention 2 difficulties Mectron faced and had to develop themselves > Navigation system(gyroscopes) and seekerhead:
"The major difficulty was encountered the lack of a national platform girométrica (navigation system that "flies" the missile while it searches for the target during flight) available for the missile. Such technology is susceptible to embargo for both political and strategic motives. This required the project, almost starting from scratch, the block Girométrico Miniature Fiber Optic with three orthogonal axes to provide the necessary on-board computer information from the accelerometers, ensuring accuracy for the missile. The design of this subsystem was financed by FINEP (Financiadora de Estudos e Projetos) and conducted by IEAv (Institute of Advanced Studies of DCTA) and Mectron. Apparently it was completed. Another obstacle arose in 1999 When the Brazilian government tried to make the purchase of spiral antennas and some other systems for the development of the search head of the MAR-1 in a Las Vegas manufacturer,[which?] but the U.S. government banned the sale, claiming that "in is interesting for the American defense Brazil Introducing anti-radiation weapons in this region.[9] "Faced with this obstacle, the DCTA found himself with only one alternative: to develop locally seeker head.[9] This subsystem was developed and then tested with simulated emissions from a TS-100 + Systems Excalibur (0.5 to 18 GHz) and HS-125 aircraft of the flight test division of the CTA, we know that event was studied by the FAB installing sensors in similar patrol aircraft P-95 Bandeirante Patrulha.[9]"
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It won’t ever happen. MAR-1 was never made, project abandoned and cancelled last year. It seems there were prototypes made for carriage test firings and air shows, but IIRC they couldn’t find a reputable supplier for the navigation system. Ultimately with LD-10 and C-102 it is not needed.
To enjoy it download Hamza Khans payload mod that adds all sort of goodies, but it wouldnt be realistic to have it in game stock
Really? but i read that:
"In 2008 a MAR-1 order from Pakistan for 100 missiles valued at EUR85 million (USD126 million) was announced by the Brazilian government, which provided export credit support for the deal. Reports from Pakistan suggested that deliveries started in 2009.
Mectron would not comment on the MAR-1 programme except to say that "we have an export client and we have delivered missiles to that client". However, during the April 2011 Latin American Aerospace and Defence (LAAD) show in Rio de Janeiro, learnt that an active integration effort is now underway for both the ROSE Mirage and JF-17 in Pakistan Air Force (PAF) service."
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Cockpit
in JF-17 Thunder
Posted
Jus a grab from a video